The whole Thailand Ordeal?

[Obama 2012 1,714]

does anyone know exactly what the deal is there? I haven't been following it all that much. THey're saying 35 people have been killed since Thursday...

[rsn 135]

does anyone know exactly what the deal is there? I haven't been following it all that much. THey're saying 35 people have been killed since Thursday...

It's complicated and is not a new issue at all, but it is clearly boiling over. Thaksin Shinawatra, a formet PM who was thrown out of office in '06 is believed to be leading the red shirts while in exile (not sure exactly where he resides now). The red shirts want to overthrow the govt and are probably, at least indirectly, acting on the orders of Thaksin. The yellow shirts oppose the red shirts and are pro-Abhisit (the current PM). The king, historically, as put an end to these types of issues before they turned the country upside down, but he is apparently quite sick now. If he passes on, Thailand is in real trouble as his successor is not nearly as widely respected as him.

Edited May 17, 2010 by rsn

[ScottThuy 140]

dont be surprised if the airports get taken over by the Redshirts again...

[rsn 135]

dont be surprised if the airports get taken over by the Redshirts again...

They were taken over by the yellow shirts last time.

[anya-D 8]

The yellow shirts are not all Aphisit supporters btw, he's just someone that's not in the same group as Thaksin. They actually have their own party now. and btw i'm not one of the yellow.

The red shirts have armed terrorist situated in buildings and shooting at civilians, they’re most of the dead body you've seen. They are trying to create chaos and attempt to get the UN and US to intervene as they claimed (lied) that the military is the one who shoots the civilians. They build tire walls and put children on the wall - shoot the soldier, the soldier couldn’t shoot back because they are afraid to hurt those kids (many YouTube video show the reds holding toddlers, kids as human shield) They stole food, money from ATM, burned down public places, broke ins shops, rob by standers - pretty much full terrorist act. They wont permit anybody going in to help people who live in the red zone and they also shoot ambulance personnel. They attempted to burn the BTS (sky train) but the military prevented that (Thanks goodness)

The govt is not doing anything much right now and people are frustrated. I'm pretty much worried about my sister (who's also pregnant) who live near the palace and near victory monument - but she's fine right now, she couldn’t leave though as she will have to drive through the red shirts camp to get out of Bangkok.

This situation came from one thing - one person greed and ego. Nothing to do with the King or the prince. even though there's been some concern about that and something may change but it wasn’t an issue. And don’t give me that ####### about democracy they asked for, they have no clue what's democracy is and all they want is debt relive and money the guy promise to give them when he returns. They wont even allow anybody who's opposed to them give their opinion and would challenged those groups and even hurts them. Before all this happened they charged into the hospital at night claiming they saw military in there, the hospital needs to moved all patients out and some dies from it. They don’t care about other people's life or freedom to live life and rights, they only care about theirs. when they do it they said it's all for the red shirts security and rights to express opinion and all their ####### but they didn’t care that their rights causes other people life, country trillions of bahts, people jobs, kids education, rights to not be terrorized by their actions. And the worse part, the freaking police wont do a thing coz they are the same.

ahhh I have to stop or i'll get too stress. Excuse my grammar, i'm not in a mood to even think about it.

[rsn 135]

The yellow shirts are not all Aphisit supporters btw, he's just someone that's not in the same group as Thaksin. They actually have their own party now. and btw i'm not one of the yellow.

The red shirts have armed terrorist situated in buildings and shooting at civilians, they're most of the dead body you've seen. They are trying to create chaos and attempt to get the UN and US to intervene as they claimed (lied) that the military is the one who shoots the civilians. They build tire walls and put children on the wall - shoot the soldier, the soldier couldn't shoot back because they are afraid to hurt those kids (many YouTube video show the reds holding toddlers, kids as human shield) They stole food, money from ATM, burned down public places, broke ins shops, rob by standers - pretty much full terrorist act. They wont permit anybody going in to help people who live in the red zone and they also shoot ambulance personnel. They attempted to burn the BTS (sky train) but the military prevented that (Thanks goodness)

The govt is not doing anything much right now and people are frustrated. I'm pretty much worried about my sister (who's also pregnant) who live near the palace and near victory monument - but she's fine right now, she couldn't leave though as she will have to drive through the red shirts camp to get out of Bangkok.

This situation came from one thing - one person greed and ego. Nothing to do with the King or the prince. even though there's been some concern about that and something may change but it wasn't an issue. And don't give me that ####### about democracy they asked for, they have no clue what's democracy is and all they want is debt relive and money the guy promise to give them when he returns. They wont even allow anybody who's opposed to them give their opinion and would challenged those groups and even hurts them. Before all this happened they charged into the hospital at night claiming they saw military in there, the hospital needs to moved all patients out and some dies from it. They don't care about other people's life or freedom to live life and rights, they only care about theirs. when they do it they said it's all for the red shirts security and rights to express opinion and all their ####### but they didn't care that their rights causes other people life, country trillions of bahts, people jobs, kids education, rights to not be terrorized by their actions. And the worse part, the freaking police wont do a thing coz they are the same.

ahhh I have to stop or i'll get too stress. Excuse my grammar, i'm not in a mood to even think about it.

Yep, it's quite a mess over there. Best wishes to your sister & her child in Thailand as well as you and yours!

[Niels Bohr 72]

Thanksin is protected by the Cambodian Gov't as of now. He's in Cambodia. The Thai's government removed their embassy from Cambodia. Relations between the two country is in bad shape due to one government refusing to accept an old ruling for an old temple in Cambodia.

I'm guessing the corrupt prime minister of Cambodia is using Thaksin so he can gain a political advantage over the border dispute.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Niels Bohr

[Kathryn41 3,205]

Topic moved from Off Topic to Asia:East and Pacific Regional forum as more appropriate location for this discussion

[thongd4me 69]

This book is pretty much the prologue for what's been happening now:

The King Never Smiles

I finished reading it a few months ago.

It's banned in Thailand but says many good things about the monarchy.

It tells the story of how the current king, helped by other royals, politicians,

the army and powerful businessmen, created a mystique of him personifying

the "Dhammaraja" or an all-seeing, all wise king who protects and guides

his people through good times and bad.

lèse-majesté

The lèse-majesté (inviolability of the monarchy) laws were freely discussed

therein and by doing so the book was and is banned in Thailand.

Throughout his 60+ year reign, I believe he tried to do good but his plans

or the plans of those he endorsed often backfired. Compared to most countries

of the world, Thailand in that history has had relatively few incidents that could

be called "mass bloodshed." Unfortunately Thailand is perhaps in the middle

of such a time in it's history now.

Historically he has stepped in during crises in the past, giving both sides a

stern browbeating, after which general peace usually ensued. This time is

different because he may not have the physical will with which to act.

The fact that his son (crown prince) has always been an embarrassment to

the monarchy hasn't helped. Once the king is gone, there will be a huge vacuum

and that is why the opposing sides are forming, one to preserve the monarchy

without mentioning his son and the other seeking to destroy it.

These are grim times indeed and we can only watch from the sidelines if we

are not Thai.

This book is pretty much the prologue for what's been happening now:The King Never Smiles

I finished reading it a few months ago.

It's banned in Thailand but says many good things about the monarchy.

It tells the story of how the current king, helped by other royals, politicians,

the army and powerful businessmen, created a mystique of him personifying

the "Dhammaraja" or an all-seeing, all wise king who protects and guides

his people through good times and bad.

The lèse-majesté (inviolability of the monarchy) laws were freely discussed

therein and by doing so the book was and is banned in Thailand.

Throughout his 60+ year reign, I believe he tried to do good but his plans

or the plans of those he endorsed often backfired. Compared to most countries

of the world, Thailand in that history has had relatively few incidents that could

be called "mass bloodshed." Unfortunately Thailand is perhaps in the middle

of such a time in it's history now.

Historically he has stepped in during crises in the past, giving both sides a

stern browbeating, after which general peace usually ensued. This time is

different because he may not have the physical will with which to act.

The fact that his son (crown prince) has always been an embarrassment to

the monarchy hasn't helped. Once the king is gone, there will be a huge vacuum

and that is why the opposing sides are forming, one to preserve the monarchy

without mentioning his son and the other seeking to destroy it.

These are grim times indeed and we can only watch from the sidelines if we

are not Thai.

Edited May 19, 2010 by thongd4me

[rsn 135]

This book is pretty much the prologue for what's been happening now:The King Never Smiles

I was trying to find the audiobook, without success, as I have limited time to actually sit down and read a non-technical book. Does anyone know of such a version?

Thanksin is protected by the Cambodian Gov't as of now. He's in Cambodia. The Thai's government removed their embassy from Cambodia. Relations between the two country is in bad shape due to one government refusing to accept an old ruling for an old temple in Cambodia.

I'm guessing the corrupt prime minister of Cambodia is using Thaksin so he can gain a political advantage over the border dispute.

Hmm, sounds plausible.

Edited May 19, 2010 by rsn

[Dai. 7]

What did thaksin do that was so bad?? Was it sell the telecommunications company that belong to thailand? I dont understand why they ousted him.

[rsn 135]

What did thaksin do that was so bad?? Was it sell the telecommunications company that belong to thailand? I dont understand why they ousted him.

That and general corruption based on what I have read and have been told.

[Dai. 7]

wasn't the economy doing good with him as the prime minister. I thought he was a good business man.

[rsn 135]

wasn't the economy doing good with him as the prime minister. I thought he was a good business man.

I'm not sure it is as simple as economy good=Thaksin good. I'm not even 100% sure of the effect Thaksin had on the economy, good or otherwise. This is a very complicated issue and there does not appear to be a simple explanation to the chaos in Thailand right now as far as I can tell. I'm not even sure I am comfortable discussing what I "know" about this situation. Some of my knowledge comes from what I have read, but most comes from what I have heard, and this appears to be a sensitive issue among Thai people as far as I can tell. I'm not sure it is my place to discuss my theories in an open forum. I'll just leave it at this: I sincerely hope for a ceasefire soon so no more lives are lost & I hope this is resolved once and for all, peacefully.

[daboyz 36]

wasn't the economy doing good with him as the prime minister. I thought he was a good business man.

Let me sum it up for you.

His police in 2003/2004 killed 2500+ alleged drug dealers with no trial

His wife was sold a building in Rachadaphisek for 750M baht, sold it later in the week for 1.5B baht. This building was sold to her by the govt. When Thaksin was the PM.

He sold Shincorp to Singapore for billions of dollars and didn't pay 1 baht on the tax.

He bought votes via "micro loans" most people up north (not all) They just pi$$ed away on whiskey. I saw it first hand.

He was convicted of fraud on numerous cases and currently faces a 2 year jail term on only one of them.

When he found out he had to go to jail for 2 years, he left the country and continued to run Thailand via proxy. (Samak, Somchai.. his brother in law by the way)

He has funded these red shirted thugs during the siege of Bangkok

Now these are all facts. There is no room for debate or speculation on the above facts.

He is suspected of killing a lawyer in the south that was an advocate of the muslims. (A different Somchai)

Tak Bai massacre on the trucks. 85 dead

Kru Se SP? Another 50 or so killed at the mosque. Can't find the exact total.

And the worst of it all... He has held Bangkok hostage for the last two months while shopping in Paris. He is funding this insurrection. Please be clear this is all about Thaksin. I can back this up with news stories or whatever, but I have been up way too late watching Bangkok burn for one man's selfishness.

It really comes down to alot of poor people up north/northeast, that have been being paid to put their life on the line because of previous governments not paying attention to them. Thaksin did this, but in a corrupt way. They love him for that. Now he could care less if they live or die. He is a meglomaniac.

You are correct. Thaksin was a good businessman, just a poor leader.

Abhisit gave them everything they wanted. Elections a year early etc. Mr. Thaksin wanted the fight to continue. Now people are dieing in Bangkok, and property is being destroyed.

I hope there is reconciliation in Thailand soon, but it will NEVER happen if Thaksin is involved in any way unless he is locked up in a Thai jail.