Jerry Springer Interview

[palilover 1]

After much debate I decide to post this on vj but please leave in Mena. And please hear this out and don't go ape shyte on my husband as that is why I did not want to post before. I am already getting flack about staying with my husband irl.....I don't need it here. but what I do need is to know if someone has been through this before and until I get to talk to a lawyer, I am not going to know what to do and I am going to drive myself nuts. Monday may be the earliest I get to speak to someone.

Habibi had his interview on July 8 in Jerusalem. All was going good and we even breezed through teh Jerusalem checkpoint since we got an Israeli cab driver and I had my passport. Did not even ask to look at my husband's permit;) We arrived 45 mins early and at 8:30AM he got in line and they all got called into consulate oblivion. I waited outside for maybe 3 hours. No word and no one coming out from his group.

I walked up to the security guard and asked him if they ate my husband. He asked me for my name and called me in and took me to the waiting room. Before he took me to waiting room, anotehr security guard asked me what I was doing there and I told her my husband is upstairs at an interview and I was told to come in. She said go upstairs and I found my husband and he said no one from his group had been called for interview yet. At this point, I got ushered back downstairs and the guard said no, stay here, you are not even supposed to be here but he felt bad for me being outside all that time. (you know hot sun over there, hot hot hot). He asked me basic questions though about how I met my husband, what he does for a living, etc. I knew at this point something is worng...why is a guard asking me this?

He told me to wait and after anotehr hour/hour and a half I got called up by the CO. I had to answer basic questions about us again so I did. He sent me back to waiting room hell. He called my husband in, and I could hear my husband speaking loudly from inside the waiting room glass. They call me out and they leave us alone for a minute. I asked my husband ####### is going on, I can hear you screaming inside the waiting room. He told me they are accusing him of using me for green card and saying he is divorced twice with 5 kids and not just divorced once as we had writen on immigration paperwork. I said why do they say that and he looked down and siad it was in the computer. I'm thinking they are just being stupid because I met his kids last time I was in Pali. (2). So when the CO came back in, I immediately said "I understand there is a problem. you say that my husband is divorced twice with 5 kids. And he is divorced once with only 2. It is in our paperwork and I already told you his kids names and when he was divorced. Look at the certificate." The CO and I got into a heated argument for a minute and suddenly my husband is still looking down and says quietyly "Habibi, he's right"

OMG I wanted to puke but I forgot how!!!!

The co discussed with me what was in teh computer and that is how they found out. I did not speak to my husband at this point, but the CO went onto accuse my husband once again of using me for green card. My husband rose his voice again "Give me my visitor visa back! I just wanna be with my wife! I don't need your green card!" My husband is wanting me to stand up for him, and I am so in shock. I'm looking at the CO with my mouth hanging open.....the CO left it to me....he said at this point, no visa will eb issued. He said my husband must hand in his original divorce cert that was missing and the 2 original marriage certs from his previous marriage. The CO told me straight up he suspects fraud but he said it is my decision. I told the CO thanks but I will prefer to speak over this mater privately with my husband before I make a final decision.

So my husband and I left the consulate visa-less and me angry. I walked ahead of him so fast he could hardly keep up. He said something and I turned around and WHAM! right there caddy corner from the consulate, I punched him as hard as I could. More than a year's worth of aggression built up, then more than 2 hours waiting on consulate, and then finding out he did not get a visa cuz he f@cked up. He gave me a deer in the headlights look and I started screaming at him as loud as I could. I punched him again. I notice that arab men are standing there staring but I did not care. I keep asking him why he lied and he said it was not a lie. Well, in his culture maybe not but in my culture hell yes it is! He said his brothers lie to their wives all the time and no one does this to them. So yeah, no excuse but this is all he knows. Well, I let him know with my fist that I will not tolerate this. I told him you mad e me look butt stupid in there because I defended you! We were too busy screaming at each other to get any "rational" talking done but I hit him a third time. At this point, keep in mind he never hit me once although he did something worse. He said to me after the third punch "No, I wont have you hitting me like this. We're settling this here. If you want to stay with me fine. but if not, we are in front of the consulate and you are free to go back home". Well, my laptop was at his house so I did not want to leave:) Plus I wanted my answers after all this time. but I kept crying and he did not know what to do. So to make things worse for me, he went back into the consulate and said to teh guy (he did not work in visa section I don't think) that my wife is crying because I did not get my visa (I dont know how many details he gave on that....I was outside and they would not let me go in with him) and then the guy called me in seperately. The guy wanted to know what hapened so I briefly told him and that guy even zoned in on green card issue. I told the guy straight up he is not using me for if he was, he would have never left the US and gone back to Palestine. The guy told me what my rights were which I already knew. Then what pissed me off was he started to ask me where my passport was. I said it's with my husband and yes, I gave it to him when he went to his interview so the CO could look and see that I had been to Palestine twice in past year to see my husband. Instead of hearing me out on that, the guy starts to say shyte like "Oh even if he forcefully takes your passport we can get you a new one". I'm like "Wait a freaking minute...mly husband wont do that" and then he said "If you ever fear you are in danger with your husband when you are back with him, go to the police and they can help you get to the consulate". At this point, I was now getting mad at theg uy. I said to him "My husband is the biggest jerk right now but he has never in our relationship hit me or anything. I've been to Palestine twice and never felt in danger with him ever." He's like oh but I just have to warn you blabla

So I went out and I told my husband lets go home. The day was ruined. We wanted to go to Al Aqsaa mosque but no....hell no......I wanted to get out of Jerusalem as fast as I could and sure as hell wanted to bash my husband's head in the floor. He would not allow it on the street like before so I was waiting til we got home:)

No, I still have not bashed his head in btw...although his family see me hit him on 3 occasions. I was on their bad list for a while. Well, they are on my bad list so now we're even.

Oh back to the arab guy at consulate...the guy said he was palestinian but I think more like he was arab israeli. (I highly doubt they'd let west bank ppl work at consulate). I bluntly asked the guy what my husband's demeanor was when he went into talk before me about me being outside. He said that my husband was genuinely concerned about my safety and my rights as an American should I decide to go home and that was his purpose for going in. And I asked him on a cultural level, is it possible just that men do this here. He said it is not on a wide scale but it does happen. He said it does happen mostly in villages and not bigger cities and it also depends on their mentality and how they were raised. He then kept saying green card, green card, green car dnd I was like tahnk you and left.

My husband is from a badckwards village and of course if his family lies to women and all this and that, then naturally he is raised to believe it is ok. I on the other hand have made it known to him (with words and my hands:) that I do not and will not tolerate this. I have and still tell him I do not approve of what happened. And he is NEVER to do this in the future. It's just unfortunate that now the freaking government is involved.

We fought for 48 hours straight. We went home that night and I set in with the integgogation. (Israeli style...you know that that means....asking same question a million times in a trillion different ways and not shutting up til the enemy breaks). My husband has finally admitted (and has been sticking to story) that when he first met me, he did not have the intention to amrry me and likewise with me, I did not plan to marry him til later. He said he told me originally he was divorced with 2 kids. When he saw that things were escalating between us, he said he was afraid if he came clean I would leave him. Well, as far as immigration goes.....and he even told the consulate this. He never lied to the consulate actually. the consulaet confronted him and he said yes straight away. He told both the consulate and me that he lost his divorce certificate from second marriage (which is true cuz we had to get it replaced) and only handed in the one. He made an effort to find the divorce certificate but could not. So instead of fixing it, he assumed (habibi got to learn what happens when he assumes the hard way) that the consulate if they see one divorce cert it will be ok cuz they know he's divorced.

Yes he should have known better because HELLO this is US GOVERNMENT you are ddaling wtih!!! but I know my husband well enough to know how the thinks in matters such as this. He does not understand anything about the legal laws of anything here so he screws everything up. I know him well enough to know how ignorant he can be in western affairs. And I wont go into detail here cuz I'm already bashing him enough myself. I dont wanna pour out his entire personal life before he met me for all to see.

The night after the interview, in the midst of all of our fighting, he said to me he knows he messed up and he probably at this point has ruined our life. I don't think he understands fully what could hjapen to him as far as immigration goes. But he knows enough I guess to say something like that. He told me he wants to fix things and he wants to hand in the correct documents to the consulate and see what happens. He told me though he needs to stop fighting so we can work together on this because if we fight, we will accomplish nothing. Well, to this, I bluntly told him Look buddy....it may take time and legal issues at this point to fix these papers but they can hopefully be fixed. But what time and money cannot repair right now is how I don't know if I can trust you anymore and we needed that the most today because this day was probbly the most important day of our life! He said how can he show me that I can trust him again and I said I don't freaking know...you figure that out on your own. Cuz you've had a year and a half total. It's all up to you now.

Part II. Fantastic Voyages in Palestine and Habibi Sweating It Out

Still I was unsure of what to do with my husband. Some people back in the US told me to go home straight away cuz he could "brainwash" me and all this and that. I said no, my husband does not brainwash. You either accept him as he is or go. He said to me now you know everything about me, if you dont like it leave me. I told the people who were telling me to go home, it is easier for him to brainwash me on the phone (if he wanted to) than to brainwash me here. I assured them no way was he getting off easy. No way am I going home without a fight and at least here, I can see his facial expressions, see his actions. Had I gone home, I would not have been able to go through that so no, I was determined to stay and let time take its course and I would gradually make my dedision on whether to stay with him and continue based on what I saw, not based on talk alone.

So.....last Thursday I woke my husband up bright and early. I demanded he take me to ramallah. I had thought to myself hey, after all this, and now I may need a lawyer...he is not going to sit on his ####### and let me deal with things alone and expect me to help him over there. Who am I, superwoman? Plus my logic in doing this (which I did not tell him) was if he wants to prove he can be trusted again, he needs to stand up and be a man so I can see it. And if he can't he better have a darn good excuse and PROOF. Here I am in Palestine, now show me the proof.

We woke up and I said habibi today I am g;oing to help you find a job in Ramallah. ramallah is the most built up city in the west bank (haha) and if anyone is going to find a job in Palestine, it's going to be Ramallah. He looks mainly for work in Jerusalem, but prob is he needs sponsorship and a permit which he has not been able to get. Even the one bro who has sponsorship there maybe works once a month and that is it. Anyways, habibi and his brothers laughed at me for saying such things. But no one standing in my way now, not checkpoint, not arab man attitude.....I pulled a Condoleeza Rice on their ####### and dragged him to Ramallah.

I had to go check my bank balance so first we went to internet cafe. Afterwards, I got to speaking to the guy who worked at the internet cafe and he spoke english pretty good. So I talked to him about the internet in Palestine and about his network (I critized the poor guy's network....I shoulda stuck my foot in my mouth) but anyways I began talking about my husband and how he was looking for work. Then I told my husband you start speaking to him. So they spoke in arabic and the guy gave him his business card and asid call me tomorrow, I will look for you around here. (not at internet cafe but my husband told him what his expertise was). So that gave me some hope although by the end of the day, we were rejected at a restaurant because my husband is too old, and the rest of the people we asked gave us a freaking Palestinian attitude from hell. "What do you think thi sis?? There are no jobs in Palestine!" "If my wife did not believe me and did this to me, we'd divorce her!" To that, my husband said "She's American and yes, american women are different than arab women so maybe this is why she is t hinking this way". "sigh" He actually had an idea to operate a taxi til he got here but we asked his own father for help with the downpayment and his father shot him down to our face. He gets absolutely no help from his family and now I saw that with my own eyes too:(

By the time the end of the night was over, we were exhausted. I looked at my husband and I felt so horrible. He said to me "habibi you made me look like shyte today" I could see the shame in his eyes and I could see that he resented the fact that I did not believe him that there was no work in Palestine. (I thought you could at least do SOMETHING there and he was being too picky). He talked about how people thought we were stupid for looking for work and you know, I thought of this mentality. How stupid are these people?? If you don't look for work, how are you going to make it? Do most people there seriously wait on handouts??? Get up and do something already. This is what I was trying to show my husband, but it ended up blowing up in our face. (forgive the expresion here). But you know what I said to my husband? By this point, I made my decision to stay with him when I saw how hard he wanted to prove to me he tries and he sucked kup all his pride to go with me. I told him "I don't care what your backwards culture says. There is no shame in trying and you tried today. For that, I am very proud of you"

Oh and as far as help in Palestine, it looks like the people who get any UN help or aid are the ones affected by 1948. Not the average common everyday Palestinian like my husband. I don't know what is worse...being in a refugee camp with UN rations only or being in his situation with nothing and in either case, you can't work because no one is hiring and no one will help you.

Since the interview and despite his traumatic experience in Ramallah, he has never left my side. He has been standing up beside me up to and including fighting his family about him going to his sister's wedding without me. He said no, if my wife cannot go, then I wont go. And he stayed home with me because he knew I'd feel left out if he left me. He even gave up a night of hanging out with the men and he sat with me and the women (against his wishes of course) because he knew I was upset and I said to him no, I leave in a few days and you are not coming with mea nd you want to leave me?! So he stayed.

Oh and other things regarding his interview.....when he was calmed down, he spoke to me more in detail about what went on before I got upstairs. he was denied an interpreter even though he requested one. they were cornering him in English which is is uncomfortable speaking on heavy subjects. He requested for the arab guy to come back and translate and the American said "No we must do this in english". They also accused him straight out of paying for my plane ticket so I could come to interview (which is bs, I paid for it on my debit card from orbitz), giving me money so I'd get him the green card, saying things like how can you love this woman, she is not even beautiful......when they saw the pics of us together. He got totally harrassed at his interview which I am very unhappy with. had I known this at the consulate, I think I woulda given the same treatment to the CO as I did my husband on the street!!

So in the end, my husband was given a sheet of paper that said he had to hand in the necessary documents and then at the end of the paper it says if all is ok, we will ask for your passport.

It looks like the consulate wants to be peaceful about it or do they? I am concerned they may send his papers back to USCIS fore review since USCIS did not know about his second divorce, nor was it (or his extra kids) on the paperwork. I am also worried they may deny him all together. And if they do that, we have major issues because now he has misrepresented himself on immigration documents.....he may not even be able to gt a nonimmigrant visa back to the US!!!!!!

Does anyone know anything about cases such as these? As I said, i am going to discuss with an attorney on Monday hpefully. I have already talked to one yesterday and he seemed like an egghead out for money. Because he kept interupting me, kept trying to dodge the current process we aer on...and all of this before i even got a word in edgewise about his interview! But that guy did tell me that the consulate can accuse all they want, but they need proof. And as for the divorce, he did not think this should ahve been a huge issue to suspect fraud. But then again, within 30 seconds of talking to the lawyer on the phone, I decided not to hire him in my mind because he was kinda arrogant.

But fyi, regarding my hjusband using me for a green card accusation.....both he and I can stand up to anyone and say it was not him who asked for green card. Believe it or not, it was me from day 1. My husband actually fought me at first because he doe snot like the stigma of women getting green cards for men. He has seen some of that happen in his culture and he doe snot like that and he does not use people. But in his case, he was on a visitor's visa. When we finally got married, he and I were bgoth getting pressure from Muslims here who said man should support women, look at the Koran, blabal. And my husband said to me that he did not like that I work to support him while he sits on his ####### out of boredom here. He wanted to go find work, but I said heck no not on a visitor's visa you're not. We called USCIS in the beginning and explained to tehm that he was on a visitor's visa yet he did not want a green card but wanted the right to work in the country. The woman at USCIS said that no way could he work without his green card. that was the only way he could work here. My husband to this day still doe snot give 2 shyte about the green card. This whole time he has not been able to go to US on his visitor's visa to visit me while this paperwork was pending because we feared border patrol would turn him away if they saw this paperwork. (I had been advised by USCIS, border patrol, and a lawyer about this beforehand). But the only reason my husband decided to go back to Palestine and not file AOS here was because stupid Muslims (also Palestinians from same village AND I MIGHT ADD THEY ARE INVOLVED IN IMMIGRATION FRAUD WHICH PISSES ME OFF EVEN MORE THAT MY HUSBAND IS ACCUSED OF IT AND I'LL BE DAMNED IF I AM GOING TO NOT TAKE ACTION AGAINST THESE PEOPLE NOW) is because they lied to him and said he'd be bck in 3 months and don't listen to your wife she knows nothing about immigration. when 3 months rolled around and my hjusband was still in USCIS hell, he learned that this was what we thought was the most stupidest thing of his life. Of course after interview, we all know what was more stupider.

other than that, it was indeed a lovely time in palestine

[amal 4]

I am speechless but offer my support and shoulder if u need it

[Sassy1natl 0]

I am soooo sorry, that you have had so much stress. (((((palilover)))))

[DARUMA07 25]

I can understand why you are upset, but why the violence toward your husband?? That is not good in any relationship, no matter who the aggressor is..........

[SaadBell 0]

Wow, I only have one thing to say get you a good lawyer, are you sure he is really divorced? Please I am not judging him at all but just be careful that he really did divorce his wife. Where are the extra children? I hope it all works out for you, I can only imagine how you feel right now. Good luck and keep us updated, but remember get a good agressive lawyer who will do the needed work you need to have done.

[S and S 12]

I pray that God gives you strength and guidance so you can pass through these difficulties. I can't imagine finding out such news and that he lied to you. Yet you have to do what you feel is right in your heart. Good for you for not backing down in your principles.

[Donna A 4]

wow what a horrible experience. i hope for u things work out well.

[belinda63 3,038]

i feel so sorry for you and understand the emotional rollercoster you are riding. OMG, to go to get the visa and suddenly find out about 3 more children and an ex wife. I am here for you no matter what you decide.

As to hitting him in the streets, well in his culture this is unheard of but he should be glad I was not there because I think only three times was not enough. To embarrass you that way, knowing he was being decietful to you and the embassy, trying to act like it was nothing....OMG.

Did you happen to get it on video?

Good luck whatever you decide. It sounds like the embassy is leaving the decision up to you.

[sandinista! 1,816]

I can understand why you are upset, but why the violence toward your husband?? That is not good in any relationship, no matter who the aggressor is..........

no kidding.

and it's depressing that yours is the only response so far to even acknowledge this. would that be the case if gender were reversed here-if a man found out his wife had been divorced another time and had 3 more kids than originally thought, would anyone still be supportive of the guy if he'd smacked his wife in the face a couple times on the street after he found out?

i hope not, ugh.

[Carolyn 1]

Wow, such a shock...I hope that you are able to come to some resolution and feel peace in your decisions.

Take care of yourself...

[palilover 1]

Wow, I only have one thing to say get you a good lawyer, are you sure he is really divorced? Please I am not judging him at all but just be careful that he really did divorce his wife. Where are the extra children? I hope it all works out for you, I can only imagine how you feel right now. Good luck and keep us updated, but remember get a good agressive lawyer who will do the needed work you need to have done.

Yes sure he is divorced. he shoewd me several times his palistinian id which of course fwas in arabic. BUT when I went through Israeli security, I had to give them his id number when we went through the gate as he was my husband. I said to the guard he is my husband and they looked him up in the computer and said "nO we show he's divorced" (I shoulda asked them how many times, LOL) So he is not married as per Israeli computers which would be same access the consulate has. So kudos to the Israelis, they gave me that answer that he really is divorced:)

As for his other children...they all live with the mother. .Believe it or not, I met 4 of them last time but I only knew that 2 were his. And ironically what I thought was a niece is actually my step daughter so that is kinda neat cuz she is so sweet. I just wish if I woulda known that lats time I was there!! His fifth child he never gets to see as the mother took her away. That's all I'll say on that as I must respect my husband's privacy here.

[palilover 1]

i feel so sorry for you and understand the emotional rollercoster you are riding. OMG, to go to get the visa and suddenly find out about 3 more children and an ex wife. I am here for you no matter what you decide.

As to hitting him in the streets, well in his culture this is unheard of but he should be glad I was not there because I think only three times was not enough. To embarrass you that way, knowing he was being decietful to you and the embassy, trying to act like it was nothing....OMG.

Did you happen to get it on video?

Good luck whatever you decide. It sounds like the embassy is leaving the decision up to you.

lmaolol no but I can guarantee you that someone did. It was a scene I'm sure. Later when we both were off the emotional rollercoaster and more rational (it took a few days), he told me "if you wre an arab woman and did that to me I'd divorce you in the street" Believe it or not, we laugh about it now as we both know neither of us were in our right state of minds after the interview. Our entire life changed and neither of us knew what to do. And in the end, my husband has apologized and still apologizes and says it's his fault and he wants to do things to make things right again both with me and the consulate.

Let's hope you are right that the consulate is letting me make my own decision. But regardless I will speak to someone this week regarding this. And my husband is aramexing his papers to consulate tomorrow so both he and I will be calling and emailing the consulate daily for updates.

[palilover 1]

I can understand why you are upset, but why the violence toward your husband?? That is not good in any relationship, no matter who the aggressor is..........

no kidding.

and it's depressing that yours is the only response so far to even acknowledge this. would that be the case if gender were reversed here-if a man found out his wife had been divorced another time and had 3 more kids than originally thought, would anyone still be supportive of the guy if he'd smacked his wife in the face a couple times on the street after he found out?

i hope not, ugh.

Yeah I do agree thre is a double standard. And for the record, I didnt hit him in the face, no way, I'm not that bad!! Well, ironically I am not even violent at all and I never like to even argue with him. But THIS DAY.........

I got lucky I hope. I do believe that my husband acted in ignorance and he got caught up in what he thought was a white lie at the time and it escalated and he did not know how to back out of it. For that, I forgive him because after the interview, he showed proof that he still was genuine.

At least now my husband knows that while I love him with every bit of my heart......don't try to pull a fast one on me like that in the future and expect no backlash. Hopefully we will have no further issues with this in the future.

[SaadBell 0]

Well than if he really is divorced than that is good, just get you a nasty agressive lawyer if they give you any problems, and good luck with all your visa problems. As for hitting him, yea, I would have been pretty upset, it is true that in the Middle East they don't take kindly to women doing that sort of thing. In your defense I am with you, I would have lost it

[desert_fox 32]

Gee, I dont see any problem. After you submit a few pieces of paper, that Consulate is going to run all over themselves getting that visa out.

The fact that he and his family lied to you; you have already rationized very nicely as boys being boys, or arabs just being arabs.

Im sure that he will have his visa soon and youboth will live very happily forever.

Edited July 19, 2008 by desert_fox