rooji

Okay got it. thank you... okay got it...

Yes unfortunately in Pakistan the man can delay the process by not signing the divorce. she can serve the papers but he is not willing to divorce her (selfish reasons) the only way I see is that he dies (since his healthy seems to indicate that). so if she does fall under the f3 category is it because her husband might not immigrate or is it because she is daughter and married? how long does the process usually take? proof of living separately is easy. he hardly comes and see her as he is always with his other wife and lives in that other house.

before anyone jump a gun on me and starts accusing me of doing fraud or anything like that. i am not suggesting that she lies about her marital status. I know she has to mention that but the question is whether she should add him as derivative when the time comes to migrate with her? I mean what if only she immigrates or her kids do? Is that okay? because the husband will not divorce her so she will be immigrating herself and if her youngest is allowed to immigrate with her as derivative then great if not then I know she will have to apply for her daughters.

what if she doesn't want to mention the husband for migration? can she just mention she is married but not include him when it comes time to actually migrating? i mean what if he doesn't divorce her, can she still migrate here?

MIL is not applying for the husband, even I know that. she is going to apply for daughter. I am asking whether we can choose not to include the spouse when adding the derivatives? her youngest daughter is only 12 but yes she might age out if it is not approved before that. older one is definitely going to be aging out anyways. Rest I know.

That is helpful. MIL is only going to be sponsoring the daughter of course.

Hello, I have a question in regards to the derivative of a petition of a daughter. My mother-in-law wants to apply for her daughter and she wanted to know whether it is a must to include the husband as derivative or can we just keep it to kids only? The reason being that her husband is in a polygamy marriage while my sister-in-law is only married to him. She doesn't want to bring him to usa and neither does my mother-in-law want to bring him (they don't like him) and he is not willing to divorce her. It is really bad situation. but she has 2 biological daughters that she wants to bring with her. one is younger than 18 and other is younger than 21. I know the older one might not be able to migrate but the younger can. the husband is willing to let her go but he is not willing to divorce her for selfish reasons. So can we do that? Thanks rooj

her daughters...especially the youngest one. she does not want to leave her daughters behind and that is where we want the husband to leave so we can go ahead and correct the documents problems for her.

I am not willing to fill out the application...please read again. I do not want to and I am refusing to so no I am not committing a potential crime because I have not. I need reasons to give not to. wanted to know if anyone tried it or been in a similar situation and it seems so far none. She is going to support herself financially with the help of her husband who is willing to pay for her but his only demand is that we do the daughter and I am against that because she is not the daughter by law or documents but she is a biological daughter. the husband did that unknowingly to the mother or her family. all i would say is that I got my answer and I was right to not go with this application to begin with. only helped for the sister-in-law but this problem that her husband put out there is where we got stuck. the application is just sitting there since no fees have been paid yet so it is not pending yet. I am planning ahead and I am glad I did refuse to do the daughter's application.

It is not about whether I am willing to or not because I am not able to. The husband is taking one of the 2 daughters with him to canada so me reporting him will cause problems for the sister-in-law. the sister-in-law will not be in a standing position to help herself once she returns to Pakistan (that is if she gets the visitor visa) USA law or any outside country cannot help her if she is a Pakistani citizen and the country is not going to help her or give her justice if God forbid the husband finds out and take the anger out on her. what concept of domestic abuse victim do you not get that? she lives in foreign land where USA law is not going to help her save her life or give her her daughters back. the only way we can help is by correcting the birth certificate of her daughters while he is away and that will automatically put a red flag on him. the sister-in-law is not willing to come to USA and stay here without her daughters so she rather spend a lifetime with this monster than get away from it. even in USA when a domestic abuse victim is not willing to separate, there is not much we can do unless by law he is in jail. and in this situation he will not go to jail in Pakistan, yes in any other country but not Pakistan. Pakistan is not an European country so interpol can't do much. Pakistan allows polygamy so there is no fraud there. I cannot do anything that will knowingly or unknowingly jeopardize my sister-inlaw and her daughters in Pakistan. Can also put their lives in danger too, what part do you not understand that? like I said I don't know on what basis he applied for his other wife and whether he mentioned his marriage or not. I DO NOT WANT to apply for the daughter knowingly that it is fraud even though he is insisting us to. what does that tell you? I am not doing it and i am advising my sister-in-law against it. she wants to know the reasons and I don't have much to give officially except say that it will be a lie and it is best we do not get into that. only she comes visit and leave.

if only criminal defense lawyer is easy to come by in Pakistan...this is not US system...

i know they don't but apparently they ask for it at Pakistan embassy, I have seen it happen to my other sister-in-law in the past. and many I heard stated that they asked for it. i already answered this...i know they don't help but unfortunately they still ask for it.

I am not asking about his immigration to canada. I am asking about sister-in-law's visit visa (not immigration). As per Pakistan law he didn't commit a crime so I can't report him there and I don't know whether he mentioned his 2 marriages or not so I can't officially say he is committing a fraud. I am speculating that he didn't mention it. I can't do anything because it is not my house and I am in USA while my sister-in-law who is a victim of domestic abuse is not willing to report him. Also she is scared of him and is still in love with him as most women are under a narcissistic abuser. so me reporting him will be problematic for her and he can even kill her while we sit here and do nothing. Pakistan's justice system or even police is not like USA system so she will be in trouble. She didn't assist him do anything. he did it on his own and she didn't even know. Like I said the guy has connections in the government and he made it seem like that she will be in trouble so my sister in law never said anything. she is scared as are most domestic victims. nothing I can do until she is willing to stand up and Pakistan law does not favor the women and it has been proven time and again. I can do what I want but she will be the one to suffer. We are waiting for the opportunity where he leaves and we can correct documents while he is away and that way we can make the daughters officially my sister-in-laws...again I am not asking for her domestic life that is another story...all I am asking to see if it is wise to apply for the daughter or no. because my answer is no.

plus we are giving her the invitation letter to her to show at the interview.

yes her husband. she is dependent on him and he is a rich business man. so she will be supported by him in terms of her tickets and all.

okay if we say the daughter knows us then what are we supposed to mention how she knows us? we can't say she is our niece or anything like relative so what is our option. her being a minor she will not be allowed to travel without an adult and well her biological mother cannot put down her own name because well she is not listed in her birth-certificate. the father made sure of that but father is giving permission to travel with biological mother but I know that will be problematic since by Pakistan's official law she is not the mother and I don't know how we can help fill that application out. I rather we only apply for the sister-in-law and not the daughter.

DS 160 does not ask for kids. it only asks about parents and their married life. nothing about kids at all so no it is not misrepresentation. B-2 is not pending because it hasn't been paid yet. the payment is where we are stuck because the husband is refusing and asking us to apply but I am not willing to because i know it is fraud and it will be problematic for the sister-in-law. my timeline is not going to narrow me down...no matter what...that will only happen if they trace me and my account to my exact location. but since I am not committing any fraud as far as I know since I didn't so it makes no sense to me.

that is the plan...I am only helping her come visit us in USA and not canada. and only my sister-in-law and no one else.

okay well the father wants us to apply for the daughter but we are not willing to mainly because of the reasons I mentioned. my sister-in-law we helped her but again the husband is asking we do daughter too so he can make the payment for both of them. I am trying to help my sister-in-law with her only and not the daughter at the moment. only sister-in-law needs to travel or visit and that is what I want to do, however this demand by the husband is problematic and that is where I am asking what should we do. but it seems clear to me that do not do daughter's application since there is no official way to get her to come here. and no we are not planning on lying at all.

unfortunately that is not my decision. I cannot interfere in my sister-in-law's life as much as I cannot see unjustice being done, the domestic abuse she will endure will cause more problem for her and she is all alone in Pakistan so we can't even rescue her.

how will they know who i am and who i am referring to? and how am i an accessory to US federal felony? I didn't do anything wrong here. how is it a crime to apply for visit visa for only sister-in-law when she is officially married as per pakistan's official national registry system. she hasn't mentioned her daughters anywhere in the application. It is the daughter's application that is causing us a problem. we have been trying to correct the situation but the father is like a gangster type person and in pakistan it is common when father is connected and often the domestic partner is the one who suffers. the father is giving permission to the daughter to travel however we are not willing to do the application mainly because the daughter as per pakistan's birth-certificate she is not related to us but biologically she is.

That is where you are wrong. The plan was to apply for my sister-in-law alone and that is what we did. she didn't mention anyone traveling with her because she was going to travel alone. Since she is financially dependent on her husband, he has demanded that we apply for the daughter too and i know that officially we can't do that since officially she is not related to us however unofficially she is the biological daughter of my sister-in-law. We were never intending to apply for the daughter and the father stated he will give permission for her to travel with the sister-in-law officially however since the Ds-160 asks if daughter knows anyone in us and who she will be traveling with, we can't put down our names or my sister-in-law's name in that order because officially she is not related to us. I don't know if that makes sense. So all I am asking is what should we do, how do we tackle this because even if we put down our names, it will be pulled up in the system when my sister-in-law goes for her interview. It is really confusing. the father is not willing to make payment unless we apply for the daughter...that is where we are stuck.

Unfortunately Pakistan is one of those countries where making false documentation is easy. The guy put down his other wife's name as the birth mother when the daughter was born and since then in the Pakistan official NADRA system my sister-in-law is not the mother. My mother-in-law wants to correct that and can correct it with DNA testing however the manipulative father will not allow it and have high ranks members in the government who can seriously cause trouble for my sister-in-law who has been a victim of domestic abuse for 15 plus years. anyways that is a different story but I wanted to point out that how officially by the national system of pakistan my sister-in-law is not the mother. I just need to know that should we even attempt to try to apply for the daughter or just keep it to my sister-in-law only? She is financially capable to support herself and is going to return to pakistan. she has strong ties since she is married and will be returning home.

Just to correct you: he is not my brother or any way related to me so please don't call that man anything to me. secondly in pakistan polygamy is allowed and I believe he has already been granted visa to canada with his other wife based on business so they are in fact migrating. Even if he gets arrested not my problem since I want him arrested and so does my in laws. But I believe he lied on his marital status to canada and plus he is not taking my sister-in-law.

I am well aware of that and I think my sister-in-law's visa will be granted given her daughters are not applied. however that is least of our worries at the moment because she has a strong standing.