Russian Language Self-Study

[russ 1]

I was just curious what others here have been doing. Here are my general observations:

o Rosetta Stone Expensive, but not generally effective. I have learned some vocabulary from this, but it doesn't do much by itself.

o Pimsleur Very expensive, but good. (An Air Force buddy of mine studied Russian for his new job and had these). Will not teach any writing or grammer, but is outstanding for vocabulary and pronounciation. I have them in my iPod now. If you are a serious student, you probably want these -(find them cheap, like from the library)

o Random House Living Language Russian Cheap and Good. This was my first Russian course, about $20 with dictionary and cassettes. Mainly useful for grammer exercises. Seems to be a re-packaged US State Dept course.

o Teach Yourself Russian Grammer Looks good. I just bought this for the exercises - my grammer books didn't have enough. Starting to work them out now.

o The New Penguin Russian Course This was highly recommened by Amazon. Just starting it now - for the price, it looks excellent. Too advanced for a beginner (learn the alphabet, numbers, basic grammer before this).

o Russian Children's Books My wife thought I was crazy for buying these. Got them in Russia, managed to learn the alphabet well, and some basic vocabulary. (easy - lots of pictures). Keeping them around for our kids.

o Teach Yourself X in 14 days I've got a bunch of these, usally a phrase book and CD. Worthless, for the most part.

o Dictionaries I use the Oxford one ($5). There are a number that are good. The one on the rambler's website is said to be good as well (the built-in one on my mac is only OK, but convenient.) My wife only uses dictionaries entirely in English.

o Movies, TV Мастер и Маргарита, ироня судбу, Интердевоцка... My wife has a bunch of these. I still don't understand most of them. It will probably be a few months before I can watch them at all. I typically watch them in Russian with Russian Subtitles. Irony of Fate, which I saw about 500 times in Russia, I understand the best - but watching the same movie over and over again can get boring.

o Letters I've sent exactly one in Russian, to Russia. Not sure how much this helps me a this point. I will probably start writing one a week to my mother-in-law.

I'm not sure what is best for more advanced textbooks.

I'm also considering taking some courses here in FL (USF). Cheap, but I'm not sure how much they will help.

[slim 1,530]

Take the college course!

While in Korea, I had a basic knowledge of how to read/write the language and knew all the basic words, etc., but after signing up for Korean 111, then sitting through the first couple of (boring) weeks of class, it all started to come together and actually make sense. No longer did I have to "think" in English, then translate to Korean, I could simply "think" in Korean. Plus, there's nothing like getting 100% on all your tests to boost your confidence. Your instructor will know that you're not the average 19 y/o "I hate Spanish class" student, and will challenge you further. When you have a great understanding of the basics, you can build rather easily from there.

Another resource that I've used multiple times with very good results is the Lonely Planet Russian Phrasebook. Simply excellent. If I only had one book to learn Russian from, it would be this one. It doesn't have a "teach yourself" type format, but if you already know the basics, it's a great tool.

Spot-on with the childrens books. No better way to learn vocab. How did we learn English???

I love the Pimsleur set. It is the best interactive learning tool (other than gorgeous women) that I've ever used. Don't buy the sets for $150, get a bootleg off of e-bay or from the library or somewhere else.

Another thing that was helpful (although, I didn't actually follow the entire program, just kind of took some hints) was a book written by some special forces guy called "The quick and dirty guide to learning languages fast." With this soldier's method, you really can be speaking the basics within a week.

And just a few other tips that I've heard....

1. Study for only about a half hour at a time. Right when you wake up and right before you go to sleep are best.

2. Study and practice somewhere private (away from folks not interested in learning your target language) like your home or car so you can build confidence in yourself. Ensure you say aloud your responses.

3. Attempt to "think" in your target language. Someone asks "how are you today?" You respond (in your head) with "Kharasho, a vwi?"

4. Drink alcohol!!! It lowers your inhibitions, so instead of thinking "gosh, I hope I'm not messing this up.. I'm scared to speak Russian to these fine ladies over here..." You'll be saying all kinds of nice things with a perfect accent! Think about it, you hear it all the time from your sweety, but how often do you really try to say it back? Try it out!

[russ 1]

Take the college course!

I guess I'll go ahead and try that too. Unfortunately, the courses here are at a fairly elementary level. I'll see how it goes, though.

I took the courses/studying route for learning French (8 years). In the end, I learned more reading books and watching TV.

Learning Dutch was a disaster - I can count, that is about it.

Any other advice?

[Neonred 3,581]

4. Drink alcohol!!! It lowers your inhibitions

Now you're talking!

[centurion 0]

There were alot of Russian'and Ukrainian TCN's in the U.A.E. Where I just returned from.

I found that this approach worked good.

1. Find a cooperative Russian Speaker. ( We hooked up with a Russian tattoo artist that came over twice a week to do work on guys in my unit)

2. Get drunk and practice on them

This was also a good way to learn quite a few of the words you won't find in the Dictionary .

Otherwise:

Learn the cyrillic alphabet. Most of the language is phonetic.

Prompt online / paralink has a decent online translator. You can type in a phrase and it will translate and back translate. It will also transliterate into the English alphabet. I have used this feature often when speaking on the phone with my fiance. Sometimes she corrects me but mostly she understands what I'm saying. It has been the best learning tool for me.

pimsleur is great and you can download quite a few lessons from Limewire.com. I have yet to find a really good dictionary.

College courses would probably be the best bet from start to finish.

Of course regardless of what you do, your mileage will vary depending on your learning curve and ability to learn languages. JMHO

Edited March 9, 2006 by centurion

[slim 1,530]

prompt/paralink is great!

Sometimes kind of jumbled, but definately gets the point across. If you have a "sensitive" issue to talk about and want to get your point across without arguing about words in translations, this is a great resource.

[russ 1]

o The New Penguin Russian Course This was highly recommened by Amazon. Just starting it now - for the price, it looks excellent. Too advanced for a beginner (learn the alphabet, numbers, basic grammer before this).

An update on the New Penguin course. I've worked through about a quarter of the book. It is very good, though I wouldn't say it is for beginners. It only devotes a few pages to the alphabet and Russian sounds. Start with the Living Language course, then move on to this.

[Turboguy 6]

I like the Rosetta stone and can learn words faster with it than most other ways. I think my brain processes what it sees faster than what it hears. The big problem is you have to devote speical time for it.

Pimsleur for me is a very slow way to learn. I have to I learn words with it at about the rate of one every 4 hours. The nice thing is you can do it while you drive and not have to devote special time. I think if you check your prices a little closer you will find full list on the pimsleur set is more in the $ 300.00 range. You are right about Ebay. You can save some money. I just bougth Pimsleur Russian 3 for $ 125.00. Usually on Ebay it goes for $ 175 or so. There is also a place called Cheap Pimsleur that sometimes advertises on Ebay and otherwise has on online store.

Another thing I really like is a book called Berlitz Essential Russian. I can learn more, faster with it than anything. It only sells for $ 10.95 and you could get it cheaper on Amazon. I would not recommend it if someone was starting with absolutly no knowledge. Perhaps about the time you finish Pimsler 1 or the equivilent.

There was and probably still is a tape/book set in the book stores called Russian Fast and Easy. It is not too bad and is only something like $ 39.00 It was the first thing I tried. You do need to use the book with the tapes or you will get nowhere.

Slim--- I love the Russian Phrasebook by lonley planet. It does not help me learn Russian. I do like it as sort of a joke. Did you ever notice the strange phrases in there. It is full of them. I was killing time in a book store and laughed so hard I had to buy it.

A few of the milder examples. yazykom use your tongue

ni astanvlivaysa Don't stop

aden prezervativ Use a condom

Klakkssnaya popka Nice behind

That is enough to give you the idea.

[slim 1,530]

Those were some of the "invaluable" phrases I was referring to Turbo!

[russ 1]

Those were some of the "invaluable" phrases I was referring to Turbo!

My wife has already taught me most of those Language appropriate for the

in-laws is what I need more of.

I agree about not using the Pimsleur's alone. They won't teach you how

to read or spell anything. I've been working grammer exercises out by

hand. While time consuming, I've learned a lot this way.

My wife's granny just recieved my first letter, written in Russian. She was

happy - no grammer mistakes (she was a school teacher, and had her

red pen in hand while reading it).

My project now for this month - trying to read Мастер И Маргарита in Russian, by

myself. I've made it two pages already

[slim 1,530]

Two pages is good russ!

I got laughed at when I tried to read the passenger rules on a plane ticket a couple of years ago. The girls told me I read like a 3rd grader. I thought that was pretty good!

You are doing it right. The best way to improve reading/writing is to practice. Keep it up. And keep writing Granny, she'll be able to help you a lot, that red pen is some serious stuff!

[russ 1]

I like the Rosetta stone and can learn words faster with it than most other ways. I think my brain processes what it sees faster than what it hears. The big problem is you have to devote speical time for it.

Rosetta Stone is OK for vocabulary. I think it is useless for Russian grammer, though. This is a problem, since much of the meaning in Russian sentences comes from the cases and declensions. These grammer rules are not difficult, but I think you absolutely need to know them to make any real progress, even with Rosetta Stone.

Intangible things are hard to express with the short phrases Rosetta Stone uses. While it is marketed as "learning to speak like a child does," I think this is of limited value. After all, children DO take reading and grammer courses.

Plus, one of the advantages you have as an adult is the patience to study grammer. (Kids generally find this quite boring). Russian grammer is quite regular, has few verb tenses, and is more or less phonetic. It is worth memorizing. You'll pick up vocabulary the same way you do in any other language - by reading and using dictionary. I recommend using an all-Russian dictionary as soon as you can (I'm not a that point yet, but I do use all-French dictionaries for myself, and my wife uses all-English ones).

The actual rules fit in 3 pages in my dictionary, but take a bit more effort to learn. I'll revise my reviews above, I think one should start with a good overview of grammer first. The New Penguin Russian Course is now the best I've seen ($12 from Amazon). The reviews there (from people smarter than me) all look good.

Assuming you know a native Russian speaker and have some basic vocabulary, I would start with this book.

[Satellite 1]

russ,

You mention all these study aids, are you still using them now? I must be crazy, but wouldn't your wife be the best source to learn Russian from? You guys could try speaking Russian in the home. Or she can tutor you for an hour a day.

I can't really vouch for any particular method because Russian was my first language, granted I left the USSR when I was 6. But as a current student I would vouch for the junior college classes. There is something about a classroom setting that forces you to learn.

[russ 1]

russ,

You mention all these study aids, are you still using them now? I must be crazy, but wouldn't your wife be the best source to learn Russian from? You guys could try speaking Russian in the home. Or she can tutor you for an hour a day.

I can't really vouch for any particular method because Russian was my first language, granted I left the USSR when I was 6. But as a current student I would vouch for the junior college classes. There is something about a classroom setting that forces you to learn.

My wife does not want me to learn any Russian. I'm not entirely sure why. (Her family obviously sees things differently). Until I improve a bit more on my own, I doubt she will want to help me. To be fair, I spend exactly zero time teaching anything about English - but she was already an English teacher when we met.

So as for tutoring or speaking around the house, probably not going to work.

For the near future (next 6 months), it looks like I am on my own. I've been in touch with a few Russians (Physics dept and Russian dept) at USF here in FL. I'll try a class there next semester, though they are mostly at a very introductory level.

As for study aids, I still do a few grammer exercises every day. That is getting easier now, I must have learned something Starting to read books and watch movies (we have an outstanding collection of Zardonov stand-up routines, though I get none of the jokes at this point).

[slim 1,530]

I know what you're going through russ. I had a Russian girlfriend a while back, and she never wanted to speak Russian with me. I think the main reason was because she wanted to learn and use English because it was more practical, but I tried and tried to get her to teach me, and her reasoning for not doing it was: "You don't need speak Russian, the only reason you want speaking this language is to talk whis another Russian girl." (She was right... but that's beside the point!)

She did teach me a lot though, and I paid attention when her and her friends would speak. It was quite funny actually, they would say something, then look over at me, then quickly change the subject. Half the time I had no clue what they were talking about, but I would throw in a chuckle or an "oooooh." A well placed "Pravda?" here and there would get me looks of amazement when she was talking with girls that didn't know me well. They always suspected I knew more than I did. I studied pretty hard from the books that I had, but didn't really get the chance to converse much with the girls. A little here and there, but nothing serious. I wish I would've known more and I realized when I went to Moscow... I don't know squat.

That's why having native speakers to converse with, and interact with is so important. When you study from books and learn grammer rules and how to read and write well, you miss a lot of the actual communication. Russian is EXTREMELY different than English when it comes to spoken language. If you didn't know any better, you would think everyone in Russia is pissed off at you whenever they say hello. But, once you know how to speak well, the endings make sense when you see them on paper. "Oh, that's just the word for going.... in the past tense. That's the word for market... as in "to the market.""

Satellite pointed something very important out. You have the best resource in the world living with you right now. I'm sure one of her main reasons for not wanting you to learn Russian is because she doesn't want to lose her own English skills. I doubt she's worried about you talking to other Russian girls, but maybe she doesn't want you to understand EVERYTHING that she's saying to her family. A little privacy is nice sometimes. Implore her though, to teach you Russian, and even try to speak Russian in the home. That will help you more than anything. Plus, you can tell her, "well, granny wants me to talk to her... and when I talk to her, I must speak Russian perfectly!"