Tourist visa while K-1 is pending

[Badgerella 5]

My fiance and I plan to file a K-1 application a few weeks from now, around the middle of August. He'll be coming to see me here in Croatia in September. After that, at the end of the month, I would like to go visit him in the States or, actually, fly back there with him. Of course, for that, I need a tourist visa.

Here is what I am concerned about:

I'll be applying for that tourist visa at the end of August/very beginning of September. I have been denied a tourist visa three times, supposedly because of insuficient ties to Croatia. It happened twice in October and then also in November 2007. All I would like to do is to spend my vacation days in the States (21-23 days) and come back to Croatia - I have a full-time job here and, at the time of the tourist visa interview, I will have about six months left before I have to finish school and get my degree.

What do I say at the interview? Where am I going? I assume saying I would like to travel and see some friends is not a good idea, since we'll have a K-1 pending and, in and of itself, it means we're in a relationship which we will have to prove at some point (just a few months after that, technically).

Will I be just outright denied if I say I would like to go spend time with my fiance, while we're waiting for our K-1 related things? A letter from him and his family will be one of the supporting documents I'll bring to the tourist visa interview, anyway. It'll just be an invitation letter, stating that I am invited to stay at their house during my vacation.

I would really, really like to be able to spend some time with my fiance in the States, but if I have to choose between the two, of course that K-1 is a lot more important and just, basically, needs to be approved.

How do these things work? Has anyone done it?

Thank you for your help.

[Mononoke28 135]

Anything goes at the US embassy and they can do whatever they want. Firs of all, you should always tell the truth if you decide to go for a tourist visa again because it might come back and bite you when you go for your K1 visa interview. The CO may or may not grant you a visa even if you have all the evidence in the world to stay living in your home country until your K1 visa is approved. He or she may also flat out deny you and say to wait for the K1 visa. It's always a gamble and there are no guarrantees either way.

Diana

[Badgerella 5]

Anything goes at the US embassy and they can do whatever they want. Firs of all, you should always tell the truth if you decide to go for a tourist visa again because it might come back and bite you when you go for your K1 visa interview. The CO may or may not grant you a visa even if you have all the evidence in the world to stay living in your home country until your K1 visa is approved. He or she may also flat out deny you and say to wait for the K1 visa. It's always a gamble and there are no guarrantees either way.

Diana

That's what I thought, or, well, that's what I actually already know, from my own experience. I've been denied a tourist visa three times for really no good reason other than the CO wanting to do so. I most certainly fullfill all the requirements they list on their offical websites, etc. Anyway, it doesn't really matter at the moment.

This particular time, I believe I should just say, then, where I am going - which is my fiance's house, where I want to spend my vacation, and just see what happens.

I sort of assumed saying random things about just visiting whatever friends, or whatnot, would just come back and bite me in the a** later, anyway.

Being a pessimist that I am, I suppose I can cross out the possibily of spending those three weeks with him in the States, but I'll still go try. Maybe there's hope.

Thank you.

[Mononoke28 135]

This is true. I've seen people with very good jobs, money and all the reasons in the world to go back to Colombia be flat out denied. And I've also seen people without anything to fall back on, college students even be given a visa without any questions asked. It makes no sense to me either.

Diana

[KimandRuss 0]

This is just my opinion ...but I would just tell the truth. It's a logical reason to visit and if you express that you know the rules and what your plans are.... maybe. I realize it doesn't always work out that way but it's what I would do if I were a CO... you can hope . Either way, I think it's better than getting caught up in untruths.

good luck.

[vickydeutsch 0]

If you are going to ask for a visa, please let us know...I would like to do the same..I miss my fiance and I was thinking about asking for a tourist visa while the K1 process is pending. But sometimes I think it's not a good idea because I would be very disappointed and frustrated if they deny my visa. So please let us know if you go to the US embassy and good luck!!!

Vicky

Edited July 26, 2008 by vickydeutsch

[Badgerella 5]

If you are going to ask for a visa, please let us know...I would like to do the same..I miss my fiance and I was thinking about asking for a tourist visa while the K1 process is pending. But sometimes I think it's not a good idea because I would be very disappointed and frustrated if they deny my visa. So please let us know if you go to the US embassy and good luck!!!

Vicky

I will most definitely ask for a tourist visa at the end of August or beginning of September this year and, at that same time, our K-1 process should be pending (it should be sent within the next couple weeks).

I was denied a tourist visa three times last year, while nobody knew anything about K-1, for no good reason at all, other than the CO being... well, just so I don't end up being rude, I'll say they had no idea what they were doing, other than just demonstrating their power. (To illustrate a bit, I'll mention that the last CO I talked to said I should come back when my salary becomes $100 a day. In Croatia. Where an average monthly salary is under $1000. One would assume that CO should know which country they are in and what everything looks like.. etc.)

Anyway, I don't expect much of this appointment at all. While I will do all I can, and more, to prove that I will be returning here after 23 days (that's how many I can take off work, as our yearly regular vacation days), I expect them to, actually, deny me a tourist visa again. I'll be disappointed and angry, of course, but as long as I do everything right as to not ruin my K-1 chances, it'll be okay.

I'll post here as things actually start happening.

[Carlawarla 1]

I would doubt if you asked for one while not having a finance in the US and a K-1 pending and it was denied, that the answer would still be the same. Having a K-1 pending is no guarantee that you'd come back...well, at least to them. So I don't think they're on a "power trip" or anything of the sort. If they're not assured that you'd come back after your vacation, then they'll deny you. Maybe find out from others here that maybe had a visitors visa what they had as proof that they were going to return was. Sometimes it's a job, money in the bank, and property. Do you own your own home or have land? Do you have other family members or children that you would be returning to Croatia for? I think sometimes that each country has their own definition of what "ties" are. Find out what your country's are!

Best of luck!

[pushbrk 12,876]

If you are going to ask for a visa, please let us know...I would like to do the same..I miss my fiance and I was thinking about asking for a tourist visa while the K1 process is pending. But sometimes I think it's not a good idea because I would be very disappointed and frustrated if they deny my visa. So please let us know if you go to the US embassy and good luck!!!

Vicky

The relative ease or difficulty for a young single person to get a tourist visa to the USA varies widely by country. Since your country is not incluced in your profile, it would be difficult to assess whether there's anything to be learned from this young woman's experience that would be applicable to you.

[Badgerella 5]

I would doubt if you asked for one while not having a finance in the US and a K-1 pending and it was denied, that the answer would still be the same. Having a K-1 pending is no guarantee that you'd come back...well, at least to them. So I don't think they're on a "power trip" or anything of the sort. If they're not assured that you'd come back after your vacation, then they'll deny you. Maybe find out from others here that maybe had a visitors visa what they had as proof that they were going to return was. Sometimes it's a job, money in the bank, and property. Do you own your own home or have land? Do you have other family members or children that you would be returning to Croatia for? I think sometimes that each country has their own definition of what "ties" are. Find out what your country's are!

Best of luck!

I asked three times while I had no K-1 pending. Nobody knew anything about any boyfriends there, or fiances.

People here get to go to the US for no good reason and all, with and without good ties, all the time. Sometimes they have families here and own a place to live, or have a job or go to school. Sometimes they don't have anything at all.

I have a full-time job and my salary is above the Croatian average. I am a college student as well, close to graduation. I have no children, but I have a big enough family that nobody should expect I'd just leave here to go work somewhere as a maid, or whatever else they thought I would do. I have more than enough money in my savings account to last me in the States a lot longer that I'd ever want to stay on a tourist visa, even if I paid for everything there myself, from food to accomodation.

Each country does have its own definition of what ties are, but I still stand behind it when I say that these COs here have no idea what they are doing. In case their job is to make sense, in the first place. Otherwise, they're demonstrating their power just fine.

[minibadger 1]

I can confirm what Badgerella is saying, as I helped her through the process and did extensive research on how to maximize chances.

She has no legal problems or crime record, she's had the same job for three years, she makes above-average money and also brought in a notarized letter of invitation from me with statements that we'd provide lodging and food etc, she had three months notarized letters from her bank with her balance (also far above average for an average Croatian, who is in debt) and from her job stating her salary, position, time worked and when she was expected back. She also had a notarized letter from her father stating what of his property she had access to, such as her home, etc etc, and also a notarized letter from her grandparents, who are ill and require care, which she provides. She also brought in her blue book from school and a notarized letter stating that she was enrolled for that semester, among other miscellaneous evidence. This is far, far more evidence than we know 99% of applicants, even those who are approved for no apparent reason, bring.

The reason she was denied the first time? She wanted to use all her vacation days and stay for about a month and a half, and the woman said "I don't understand why you'd want to go stay with someone you'd never met before," because we had told the truth and said we met on the internet. The logic is awesome!

She re-applied a week and then three weeks after that, because all the government websites say you can re-apply as often as you like, as long as you feel you didn't state your case well enough, or they didn't listen, or you have new evidence. However, the subsequent two times, the visa agents basically looked at the time of the last denial, and were stamping their denial on the form as they said "Hello." The average time of the meetings were 5 minutes. They mostly did not even bother to look at the evidence she had provided, at most providing a cursory glance.

We later spoke to a friend of a friend who said that, in practice, consular officers will look at a person who has been recently denied, and, unless they've basically won the lottery, will deny them immediately again because it saves them time and they don't like to be seen to be reversing the previous officer's decision. This was rather verified when, after the third denial and finally expressing frustration, the CO said "You realize most people wait a year to reapply, right?" This, and how little time they spent with the evidence, completely goes against the officially stated position that the consulate understands local conditions, and considers all evidence and case individually and on its own merit.

Surely, given other stories with other types of visas on this site, one cannot deny that, sometimes, one just gets a really shitty consular officer, people are lazy, or the system just simply fails the public and does not do what it says it will. Because of the way this particular bureaucracy is set up, there's pretty much no recourse when this happens, and, even more unfairly, often there's no way to even find out why one was denied.

When, despite having the truth and evidence on your side, you come to expect nothing but nonsense and failure from the people who are supposed to be serving and representing you, there is something wrong with the system itself.

And all that's left to do is demand better, and hope something will get better, and keep trying, trying, trying, because it's what's right, and it's what they say they should already be doing.

Edited July 31, 2008 by minibadger

[Badgerella 5]

It seems minibadger and I are mostly just venting here right now, but that happens, too. I will never agree with anyone who says that the COs I talked to those three times were right and that they did their job correctly. They didn't. At the same time, I can only say that the system itself is disgusting, but there's nothing I can do about that either. It's basically just degrading. But oh well.

I'd still like to hear from people who have done this before - went to the States on a tourist visa while their K-1 was being processed, etc.

I'd just like to make sure I am doing my best. It'd really be great if I could spend my vacation in the States on a tourist visa, but the K-1 is a lot more important and we can't afford getting denied because of some mistake we might make somewhere during the process.

Edited July 31, 2008 by Badgerella

[frali 2]

I wonder if you showed the Embassy a letter from your university stating that you are a full time student and what the expected date of graduation (completion of course is)? This letter would help to prove you have a reason to come back to home country and not stay back in US?

Something else that comes to my mind is, What if you submit a letter of support from your Boyfriend where he would accept full financial responsibility for you?

[minibadger 1]

I wonder if you showed the Embassy a letter from your university stating that you are a full time student and what the expected date of graduation (completion of course is)? This letter would help to prove you have a reason to come back to home country and not stay back in US?

Something else that comes to my mind is, What if you submit a letter of support from your Boyfriend where he would accept full financial responsibility for you?

We pretty much did that already. She had a notarized letter from me and my family stating all that, and a notarized letter from her school stating her current status and enrollment as a fourth-year student.

I don't want to submit a full I-134 Affidavit of Support for a tourist visa, because when we called the embassy they'd never even really heard of anyone using one of those for that purpose, and I also found out that submitting one now leaves room for the one I submit for the K-1 petition to come up for grabs forl finding discrepancies and inconsistencies, and that's not a good idea.

Meanwhile, we've heard from friends-of-friends who basically had no money, little proof, and are younger and have jobs that pay less, who've gotten visas. Heh.

[Badgerella 5]

So far, I've had:

- notarized letter from my boyfriend and his family, where they were literally accepting full financial responsibility (at that point, no boyfriend/girlfriend relationship was mentioned)

- perfectly official letter from my employer (one of the biggest financial institutions in this country, that also happens to take care of all the money-related things that Embassy gets done in Croatia, so they must've heard of it, heh) showing my position, salary, promotion and raise, time worked, paid vacation days, date I was expected to be back

- perfectly offical document from my school, stating I was enrolled for that semester (final year, which means that one is supposed to graduate within 12-18 months, on average)

- one more notarized letter from another US friend, inviting me to come over to their house (this was a married couple and it was quite obvious I wouldn't marry either of them, or at least I hope it was)

- another letter from another, female friend, again inviting me to come see her

- notarized letters from both my parents (they're separated), listing all their property and stating that I have the right, legal and other, to use it (two apartments, land, other things)

- bank statements showing my saving accounts balance (a lot more than one would need for a vacation in the States, or elsewhere) as well as my credit card limits

- letter from my grandparents who I take care of, as well as my uncle's family, whose kids (my cousins) I often babysit

- proof that I've been basically all over Europe and have never tried to live somewhere else

- various random proof that all these years spent here (I am 30) actually mean something to me and that I wouldn't run off across some border to get a better life, or whatever else they assume every visitor to the States would do

What they wanted, on top of all these things, most of which didn't matter to them at all or weren't considered proof or a tie:

- bigger salary - $100 a day (in Croatia, that would be what a politician or high-up manager makes)

- more work time at a company (three years with the same employer, hello?)

- a family (yes, the last CO didn't consider my mother, stepfather, sister, brother, father, another stepbrother, grandparents, cousins, uncle and aunt a family AT ALL)

- children and a husband

- apartment I would actually own (the fact that my family owns more than enough for me to not need one on my own for which I'd actually need a loan and whatnot did not matter to them at all)

- passed exams listed in my school report for that semester, even though the semester itself started only 25-ish days before that last interview (a CO should know that much about the country they work in, or at least ask or let the person explain things they know nothing about)

- probably many other, random things that made no sense at all

At the same time, I know, in person, or have heard of people who have gone to the States on a tourist visa (only one so far has not come back, out of a whole bunch) with a job that pays about half of what I make and nothing else. With no job at all. While being a college student and nothing else. With no money in their savings account.

Newest: a person with a criminal record, who is also a registered drug user got a tourist visa with both these things being known at the interview, as well as marked on the D-156 form, or whatever it's called was granted a tourist visa not so long ago (within the past few months, as far as I know). And I know this is not just gossip.

So I am either doing something horribly wrong, or people working there really makes no sense at all. Hopefully, about a month from now, I will get to see a new face behind that counter. And then, when the time for my K-1 interview comes, I really do hope that those same people don't have anything to do with it. The first woman I talked to wouldn't grant me a visa because I had friends in the States that I had met on the Internet. How would that person let me MARRY that same person I, omg, ended up meeting on the, omg, Internet?!?

For my next interview, I do not even know what I should bring and present as proof. For K-1, we will bring every single thing we have and.. argue, if we have to. With another denied tourist visa - I'll live. Denied K-1 doesn't really sound like a plan to me.

The entire process is so disgusting that I really feel like a nice piece of cattle waiting to be imported. Or worse.