Believers in Obama

[IAMX 3,055]

Pretty funny to see people go back and forth about abortions that are the choice of one person. Not everyone else.

[rebeccajo 14]

"Groups like BornAliveTruth.org say laws like the one that applied in Illinois leave discretion to the physician. As the anti-abortion group puts it, they cover fetuses who "are considered viable – by the very doctor aborting them." That's a fact, and reasonable people might agree or disagree on the merits of relying on a physician's discretion."

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/bo...ve_baloney.html

[Niels Bohr 72]

Isn't it redundant to have two legislation that are the same?

It's not misleading, it's the perception of people.

[Peikko 1,575]

VW doesn't like the facts, so she goes back to OP ed pieces to bolster her biased and wrong opinion - what's new?

Yeah Consolemaster, sounds like a helicopeter and spins like a helicopter then it probably is a helicopter

[Danno 1,228]

2nd Yes, GODS judgement is upon our Nation bcz our Nation continues to disregard Him. Let the next President lead our country morally and towards GOD and let GOD to fix our economy.

Are you serious?

Our President has no business leading our country towards God. Churches should do that.

Our President should lead our country towards taking care of the infrastructure of the nation - and that infrastructure includes its citizenry.

Q; which President holds the record for leading the nation in the longest prayer?

Hint, it was over the radio

I was doing snopes to figure it out and got Barak Obama but then though wait he's not President yet? Then I saw Billy Graham and thought...wait president of what a company?

These are my guess but my intuition is telling me Herbert Hoover. Dunno why?

It's no trick question, the President OF the United States led the Nation in prayer for over 6 minutes (IIRC). Who was it?

This should not surprise anyone who knows the history of "faith" in our Government and nation.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

From the Chicago Tribune, an audio clip of Barack Obama arguing that his decison to vote against the was justified because the doctor and the mother had already decided against the child being allowed to live:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/media/mp3/2007-04/29383467.MP3

Quote: I suspect that doctors feel that they would be under that obligation, that they would already be making these determinations, and that essentially adding an additional doctor, who then has to be called in an emergency situation to come in and make these assessments, is really designed simply to burden the original decision of the woman and the physician to induce labor and perform an abortion.

Here is a link to an Illinois legislative session where Obama elaborated on his views against the protection act. The problem with his argument is that he is obtusely defending abortion rather than the babies who were left to die after surviving an abortion. That this was known to be happening was the entire reason for the bill being in play:

Quote: [T]he only plausible rationale, to my mind, for this legislation would be if you had a suspicion that a doctor, the attending physician, who has made the assessment that this is a nonviable fetus and that, let’s say for the purposes of the mother's health, is being, that, that labor is being induced, that that physician (a) is going to make the wrong assessment and (-bb) if the physician discovered, after the labor had been induced, that, in fact, he made an error, and in fact this was not a nonviable fetus but, in fact, a live child, that the physician, of his own accord or her own accord, would not try to exercise the sort of medical procedures and practices that would be involved in saving that child.

Now, if, if you think that there are possibilities that doctors would not do that, then maybe this bill makes sense, but I, I suspect and my impression is, is that the Medical Society suspects that doctors feel that they would already be under that obligation, that they would already be making these determinations, and that essentially adding a — an additional doctor who the has to be called in an emergency situation to come in and make these assessments is really designed simply to burden the original decision of the woman and the physician to induce labor and perform an abortion.

Now, if that's the case and, and I know some of us feel very strongly one way or the other on that issue, that's fine, but I think it's important to understand that this issue ultimately is about abortion and not live births. Because if these children are being born alive, I, at least, have confidence that a doctor who is in that room is going to make sure they’re looked after.

Edited October 27, 2008 by Virtual wife

[Niels Bohr 72]

Essentially, Obama knows that if the fetus is born-alive it will be salvaged. (Sounds awful, but, hey life is life)

"Leaving babies to die on hospital floors." - I don't think so.

If the abortion is done, and the baby is not alive. Essentially, the fetus is dead.

There's a fine line between alive, and not alive.

However, abortion is at the discretion of the individual and not that of the state.

[Danno 1,228]

So you think that YOUR god is bigger and meaner than the gods of other people? Don't we have freedom of religion in this country? Specifically, the government not operating or endorsing one particular faith? All of you Jeebus-Freaks are the same...you want to push YOUR religion on everyone else. Who cares if they're Jewish?!?! Screw 'em! Make 'em slobber all over Jeebus! Buddhist? Sorry. No Buddhists allowed here!

F##k your stupid-assed religion, f##k YOUR god, and... well, you can guess the rest.

IF you feel comfortable calling people Jeebus-freaks,

Are you also comfortable with calling people Hebs or dot-heads?

Since I have not read the TOS, I don't know if these type of slurs are permitted or not, I would hope not.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

From Nexis. com:

The Associated Press State & Local Wire

March 13, 2003, Thursday, BC cycle

BYLINE: By KRISTY HESSMAN, Associated Press Writer

SECTION: State and Regional

LENGTH: 389 words

DATELINE: SPRINGFIELD, IL.

Legislation

(Other issues edited out)

Also on Thursday, the Senate Health and Human Services Committee rejected a bill that declares any fetus with a beating heart or muscle movement outside the womb as "born alive." The measure is in response to a rare abortion procedure in which labor is induced and the fetus sometimes survives, possibly for hours.

The sponsor, Sen. Rick Winkel, R-Champaign, said the bill is modeled after a recent federal policy that defines a "born-alive" infant.

But critics said defining when a fetus as "alive" could require doctors to provide care and might expose them to legal action if they don It, even if there was no way the fetus could survive outside the womb.

Winkel's bill got four "yes" votes and six "no" votes.

The same committee rejected a "Choose Life"license plate. Motorists would have been able to get the plate for an extra $25 a year, with part of the money going to pregnancy centers that encourage adoption.

The vote was 4-6 against the measure.

The bills are HB2486, SBlO82, SBl502.

On the Net: htt;p://www..Ie:gi$,$tat~,.i1,1lS

[Sofiyya 1,687]

However, abortion is at the discretion of the individual and not that of the state.

Not true. Roe gave the states the authority to regulate abortions after the first trimester. The Born Alive legislation pertained to babies aborted AFTER the first trimester, when the state has every right to regulate the procedure. Also, this is about how to deal with babies who survived a BOTCHED abortion, that is, an abortion that didn't KILL them, as abortion is designed to do.

The ** Party is the party of baby killing. The consequences of this position is on those who support abortion on demand.

I'm not done yet.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Correction: This didn't post correctly in my post #159:

On the Net: htt;p://www..Ie:gi$,$tat~,.i1,1lS = On the Net: htt;p://www.Iegis.stats.il.us

BTW, Barack Obama was chairman of that committee when the bill was introduced.

I have an erand to run, but more to post. I'll return soon, insha'allah.

Edited October 27, 2008 by Virtual wife

[Peikko 1,575]

The Democrats are the baby killing party? That's getting awfully close to crossing some kind of unacceptable invisible line in my opinion.

Please if you are just going to post this rubbish, stay away. Quite honestly to besmirch the good name of a mainstream and moderat political party is pretty outrageous.

[Amby 490]

You will never be able to truly understand a person who chooses to have an abortion unless you've been in their shoes and had to make the choice. It's their body and their choice. Unless you want them to be able to decide what happens with your body then you can't argue with me.

[Dr. A ♥ O 203]

You will never be able to truly understand a person who chooses to have an abortion unless you've been in their shoes and had to make the choice. It's their body and their choice. Unless you want them to be able to decide what happens with your body then you can't argue with me.

I agree Amby. But this whole thread is insane.

[rebeccajo 14]

You will never be able to truly understand a person who chooses to have an abortion unless you've been in their shoes and had to make the choice. It's their body and their choice. Unless you want them to be able to decide what happens with your body then you can't argue with me.

Are you ready to take on VW, Amber? She doesn't mind telling you what to do with your body. But she doesn't want anybody screwing around with 'her' money.

Conflicting - no?