Questions for the immigrant spouse about communication in the US

[slajmn 0]

Hi everyone,

My husband, John, and I have always found this forum to be very useful in the process of him moving here, adjusting conditions and now filing for the 10 year green card. It was a great comfort to him during the waiting time between when we married and the eight months before he could work to know that he wasn't the only one going through the "endless wait" as we called it. Although we haven't posted often, we have often looked here for answers to our questions and have been greatly helped. Currently, I am a graduate student at the University of Washington's Information School studying to earn my MLIS (Masters of Library and Information Science.) I am in a group that is studying the information needs of new immigrants in the country. I've spent most of the quarter observing John and recording his information gathering needs. Now, I'd like to expand that a wee bit to ask all of you a few of the questions I've been thinking about. I won't identify anyone in my presentation without express permission, but since I know how candidly people here speak I'd like to ask the following ten questions, the non USC will need to be the one who answers.

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

I really appreciate any of you who might be willing to answer the above questions.

Thanks,

Stephanie

[Emancipation 2]

Double post.. sorry!

Edited November 26, 2007 by Emancipation

[Emancipation 2]

Hi everyone,

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

I really appreciate any of you who might be willing to answer the above questions.

Thanks,

Stephanie

Hey Stephanie.. I'll bite!! Although my info may or may not be helpful as i'm from Canada and was an english speaker.. my thinking is that you are looking for someone with a different experience - although this may get others to write up their answers!

1. Biggest Barrier is probably assumptions. most of the time I'm not "spotted" as an immigrant- so i don't get a lot of questions. Usually when I am outed than it turns to discussions about universal healthcare or us being "nice".. there's not much conversation after that.. I'm not considered "exotic" enough to be interesting but different enough to be "different"..

2. Again many of the cultural differences don't apply in my situation. I do find my bent towards socialism and everyone working together for good - considered idealistic and trivial here. I do feel in many ways a stranger in this place.

3. Misunderstood probably mostly in that I'm not like them but i'm not different enough to really be interesting. Sometimes I find I just am ignored or isolated cause I can't contribute the way I would like to or understand fully what's being discussed.

4. Probably the #1 thing is that I didn't move here cause Canada's horrible but i moved here for my husband. I'm not an immigrant because I wanted a better life - but because I wanted a life with my husband.

5. VJ, my church, and getting to know my husband's family.

6. Pretty good! I live in the North East so the pace of life is faster and I do find it generally isolating here.

7. Nope.. again probably not what you are looking for as i've only been here 9 months

8. No I can't say that I have! I did print out my forms for immigrating once at the library though

9. The one time i tried to print my forms from PDF - the computer hadn't been updated at the library and it just didn't work.. It was frustrating to deal with the 1hr time limit and I ended up leaving with NOTHING accomplished. The librarian was very helpful but knew very little about computers and she felt so bad for me she never did charge me for the paper.. she was very sorry that i wasn't able to get the stuff printed.

10. Blogging about my experience, seeking out other CDNS on VJ who have "been there", and trying to meet new people through church.

[Krikit 1,165]

Hi Stephanie. At the risk of being flamed, I have responded your questions below.

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

Since I am english-speaking, the communications barrier is more with regard to lingo and accent than anything. There have been many times where I have needed clarification on information given because I have not understood American terms or slang. Also, I have had to resort to having my husband "interpret" for me when I cannot make out the words due to dialect or accent. I cannot imagine how frustrating it must be for immigrants who have english as a second language.

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

A fair number of the products I am used to purchasing are unavailable in the US. Sometimes I have a difficult time explaining the type of item I am looking for because Americans do not use the same terms and/or products.

In addition, I cannot tell you the number of times I have been called out for not knowing my SSN. Whereas it is against the law in Canada (FOI) to request this information for the types of things I have been asked for here, I find it is required in almost every imaginable situation here in the US.

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

I had/am having a great deal of difficulty explaining the metric system to DMV employees. (Which in Florida is called the "Tag Office" and is located in the "Tax Collector's Office"..... both terms of which were unfamiliar to me, btw. LOL) They cannot seem to comprehend that miles are not the same as kilometers as I try to register my Canadian vehicle in the US. This problem has yet to be resolved and has been pending since this past July 2007.

See thread

Another area of difficulty is the fact that employees in State and Federal service centres, as well as financial institutions, have no idea of rules and process when it comes to dealing with immigrants or foreign funds. You have only to look at the number of threads here on VJ related to SSN, banking, and driver's license issues to begin scratching the surface of the problem..... not to mention that USCIS staff are blissfully unaware of their own rules and regulations.... causing the immigrant even more frustration (and sometimes significant costs) as they attempt to assimilate into the culture. The US tends to be routinely unaware of life outside their own borders. As a result they have isolated themselves from world events and generally have an inability to think beyond local processes. (See

this post

with regard to my experiences with US banking. Which, BTW, remains unresolved but was definitively pinpointed to a US banking error.... which they refuse to see.) I find other countries much more worldly and much less territorial than the US.

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

That everyone who comes here (this includes visitors) is not clamoring to live here. In other words, there is a great, wide, wonderful world beyond the US borders, and to live in the US is not the be-all and end-all of existence. Granted, the US is a beautiful country with wonderful people, but every immigrant is not "escaping" from the third world.

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

USCIS; online searches; VJ; USC husband and family; neighbours; local contacts.

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

Successful

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

I cannot say it has changed.

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

No.

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

N/A

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

To lower my expectations that people will know what I'm talking about. To not expect process and government and service industries to be similar. To be prepared to explain process to those same bodies and come prepared to back up my requests with their own documentation. To be aware that I am not "in Kansas" anymore and to adapt.

[Anna C. 4]

My experience - it's my personal view and I don't intend to offend anyone

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

My English is good enough to understand most communications. I have a hard time with accents though and with special lingo. Usually hubbie explains things to me

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

Hmmm sometimes maybe seriousness on my side? Also, when I talk about things I miss, some relatives mistake that as me hating to live here. That's when I simply complain about bad chocolate... I don't think it means I hate something, I think though some people are seriously sensitive when you criticize even the smallest things. It's not exactly American, you find those people anywhere in the world.

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

See point 2...

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

That not all immigrants come from super bad and terrible countries. I like the US, but I like my home country as well. They are equally good in my eyes. I am not in the US because I was searching for a better life financially (I would be better off in Germany!), I did it for good ole love. Most people get it though.

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

My husband.

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

Very!

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

Nope

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

No, I was familiar with all the information like political organization, country history and stuff... learned it at school.. no need for reading about it!

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

see point 8

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

Talking to my family and my American family and friends. It helps to vent!!!

If there is one thing that I did not expect here - you basically have to start over. Even if you have a degree from an elite university in the EU with a good reputation, it will count less or next to nothing here. My MA was basically downgraded big time, it is considered less than a BA from a State university (no offense please!). After 6 years at college, when I worked 20h/week in my field at Infineon, and a traineeship in NYC all I can get is being a customer service rep. Nobody replied to more than 100 applications in my field in the Bay Area (PR, advertising, event marketing, polls & surveys, got a social science background and actually wrote a scientific thesis for my degree). I'm either over qualified or it's me being from the wrong country. My strategy is to get another MS in the US.

Hope that helps!

Anna

[Nancy2015 2]

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

- They make assumptions about me, they think America is the best country in the world and overall they think too much of themselves and too little of others.

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

- Older people trying to talk about politics and the Cold War stuff to me, people of all ages being misinformed about my country and again, people thinking they are better than everyone else.

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

- All the time. I still do.

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

- We are not different from them and our countries are not worse than the U.S.

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

- None

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

- N/A

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

- The longer I've been here, the more disappointed in the U.S. I've become.

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

- No

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

- I check out books on a regular basis, the staff are nice and helpful.

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

- I have decided to finish up what's not done here and go back where I belong.

[Krikit 1,165]

Also, when I talk about things I miss, some relatives mistake that as me hating to live here. That's when I simply complain about bad chocolate... I don't think it means I hate something, I think though some people are seriously sensitive when you criticize even the smallest things. It's not exactly American, you find those people anywhere in the world.

I worry about that too. It concerns me that when I comment on how I don't particularly like something because it tastes completely different than back home that people will take that personally. But seriously..... the chocolate here IS really bad.

[Krikit 1,165]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

[nin 1]

1. What have you found to be the biggest barrier to communicating with U.S. Citizens?

- Being shy? Less of a problem in this country than in some other places though

From having read the rest of the questionnaire, I assume that people who don't speak English might have some more interesting answers for you. But I'll answer anyway

2. What cultural differences have made communication difficult?

- Measurements (metric ROCKS) and clothing sizes.

3. How have you felt misunderstood by U.S. Citizens?

- Let's see, one waiter working in a Mexican restaurant didn't hear what I said when I ordered something once. Might have been my accent. His accent was heavier than mine though and I don't know if he was a citizen or not I didn't ask.

I sometimes feel misunderstood by my husband, especially when I'm grumpy or pouting but I don't think that counts.

4. What do you wish U.S. Citizens understood about immigrants that you think they may not understand?

- That most people are quite happy with their lives in their home countries and people in general aren't dying to leave everything behind to move to the big US of A.

To be fair and honest though, most people just ask how I like it here. The answer they get depends on what kind of day I'm having. And weather or not they ask me if I speak "Swiss"...

5. What sources have you used to find information about assimilating in the US?

- I guess I don't understand the question. I never picked up a guide book to learn how to do things here... (Immigration for Dummies?) or how it differs from what I'm used to. If I have a "why" I ask someone, or look it up myself. Daily life isn't rocket science.

6. How successful have the resources you used in question 5 been?

- I don't think I've screwed up too bad, yet.

7. How has the process of gathering information changed the longer you've been in country?

- Not at all. Well, I am more used to NOT finding what I'm looking for on line here... Small businesses here are less likely to have their info available on the web.

8. Have you ever used a library to help you gather information since you moved to the U.S.?

- Not in the US.

9. If you have used a library since immigrating, describe your experience with the library staff.

- I've borrowed books, and taken my kids to story time. The staff has been acting normal and I'm a little confused about this question too.

10. What systems (formal or informal) have you set up for yourself to help with the adjustment process?

- I brought my 105 key Swedish keyboard. And I buy candy and food items from back home from time to time. It's not about helping me adjust though, it's about me craving good candy.

But maybe I should try that one next time "Honey, 10 kg of this nice European chocolate would really help me in my adjustment process"

[Nancy2015 2]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

I don't think you're in the same boat as me - you're Canadian, and people probably treat you differently than they treat me. I can't stand it how misinformed people here are about Russia, everyone's been asking me "do your parents still live in Russia?" Now, what the hell is "still" supposed to mean? It's me who's still here for some reasons, thank God it's not forever...

Yes, I am very disappointed, I wasn't that way before, I used to like it here.

[slajmn 0]

Thousand thanks to everyone who has replied. I'm really appreciative of so many people being willing to answer my questions. I just finished up a paper for the same class this survey is for about overcoming the five phases of culture shock...boy I wish I had read it two and a half years ago when John and I were trying to figure out why adjusting to living here was so hard when he'd visited so often. I'm also really glad for all of the English speakers who commented...just because the language is the same doesn't mean the culture is the same. I actually found a quote that said

"Outwardly, moving from one culture to another, very different culture, would present the greatest challenge for the migrant, on the basis that the change is so dramatic. In contrast, moving from one culture to a seemingly similar culture, would appear to be much easier, but the sting in the tail here is that the very similarities may often present the greatest challenges because of the subtleties of difference."

That is exactly what John kept saying during the first year (He's from the UK) ..everything was so similiar, but just two shades off and it felt like continious information overload...especially the grocery store..so many unfamiliar choices, where as I'd never really thought about how many types of cream cheese there are :-)

Have to agree with everyone about the chocolate...especially Marabou....I had a bar last month and it was heaven!

Also, I had to add a comment about the language barrier..even with accents. People either think John's Irish..which drives him crazy because he's Scottish :-) Or they're always saying, "Say something to me." Like he's a trained puppy that speaks on command.

Again, I appreciate all of your responses and I really appreciate you all taking the time to answer.

Cheers!

Stephanie

[Emancipation 2]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

I don't think you're in the same boat as me - you're Canadian, and people probably treat you differently than they treat me. I can't stand it how misinformed people here are about Russia, everyone's been asking me "do your parents still live in Russia?" Now, what the hell is "still" supposed to mean? It's me who's still here for some reasons, thank God it's not forever...

Yes, I am very disappointed, I wasn't that way before, I used to like it here.

I imagine you mean the sweeping comments about "communism" and the cold war that I have heard so much here in the US, and I can only imagine how frustrating that is.. and although I agree with you that the extent is probably not the same - try being laughed because you don't come from a "real" country, that you are still sucking on the British "teet", that "socialism" is honestly considered just as big of a plague/evil as communism, not to mention the flack Canada got for not going into the war in Iraq..

We get dished for our roots as well!!

Edited November 27, 2007 by Emancipation

[Nancy2015 2]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

I don't think you're in the same boat as me - you're Canadian, and people probably treat you differently than they treat me. I can't stand it how misinformed people here are about Russia, everyone's been asking me "do your parents still live in Russia?" Now, what the hell is "still" supposed to mean? It's me who's still here for some reasons, thank God it's not forever...

Yes, I am very disappointed, I wasn't that way before, I used to like it here.

I imagine you mean the sweeping comments about "communism" and the cold war that I have heard so much here in the US, and I can only imagine how frustrating that is.. and although I agree with you that the extent is probably not the same - try being laughed because you don't come from a "real" country, that you are still sucking on the British "teet", that "socialism" is honestly considered just as big of a plague/evil as communism, not to mention the flack Canada got for not going into the war in Iraq..

We get dished for our roots as well!!

I guess we can sum it all up and say that it's always hard to permanently move from one country to another

I'm a socialist myself and I had no idea the U.S. was so anti-socialist before I got here. I'm still puzzled by that. And I won't even start about the war in Iraq.

Also, I have no idea why Americans are so curious about where I'm from. I'm not a curious person myslef, I don't care about other people and where they come from, so I guess it makes it hard for me to understand why anyone would want to know about my native language and my background.

[Krikit 1,165]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

I don't think you're in the same boat as me - you're Canadian, and people probably treat you differently than they treat me. I can't stand it how misinformed people here are about Russia, everyone's been asking me "do your parents still live in Russia?" Now, what the hell is "still" supposed to mean? It's me who's still here for some reasons, thank God it's not forever...

Yes, I am very disappointed, I wasn't that way before, I used to like it here.

Actually, I'm from the UK and have done this immigration thing twice. You'll find an awful lot of people from other countries - including Russia - coming through the US Consulates in Canada, so don't let the flags to the left of your screen mislead you.

Happiness and perspective is all in the mind, and is presented by attitude. You are a representative of your country and, since the majority of Americans will never have the opportunity to visit Russia, people will form an impression based on their interaction with you. Rather than being irritated or annoyed with them for being misinformed, you can use the opportunity to help them understand Russian culture in a more positive light. Americans are social creatures, so their questions and natural curiousity are a way of reaching out to you as friends. And friends, in my opinion, are a rare and valuable thing.

[Carlawarla 1]

I'm sorry you're disappointed in the US, Nancy. I think it's a wonderful country with equally wonderful people. Don't let the bad ones spoil it for you. You'll find those people in any country.

I don't think you're in the same boat as me - you're Canadian, and people probably treat you differently than they treat me. I can't stand it how misinformed people here are about Russia, everyone's been asking me "do your parents still live in Russia?" Now, what the hell is "still" supposed to mean? It's me who's still here for some reasons, thank God it's not forever...

Yes, I am very disappointed, I wasn't that way before, I used to like it here.

Actually, I'm from the UK and have done this immigration thing twice. You'll find an awful lot of people from other countries - including Russia - coming through the US Consulates in Canada, so don't let the flags to the left of your screen mislead you.

Happiness and perspective is all in the mind, and is presented by attitude. You are a representative of your country and, since the majority of Americans will never have the opportunity to visit Russia, people will form an impression based on their interaction with you. Rather than being irritated or annoyed with them for being misinformed, you can use the opportunity to help them understand Russian culture in a more positive light. Americans are social creatures, so their questions and natural curiousity are a way of reaching out to you as friends. And friends, in my opinion, are a rare and valuable thing.

That was said so eloquently kritkit. What a lovely perspective.

Carla