Boy Scout discrimination: It’s not just gays

[bgreed 0]

I was in Boy Scouts and not part of a church in Texas, but it was more of a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" thing regarding religion rather than me being openly atheist/agnostic.

The religious aspect comes from the Boy Scout Oath and the Boy Scout Promise. Both of those mantra contain references to God or religion. As someone mentioned earlier, they are an organization of public accommodation. Constitutional law dictates that they are not allowed to discriminate if they receive public benefits/funds. Yet lawmakers have looked the other way. There was a Supreme Court case some years ago concerning a gay scout or leader. IIRC, the Court came down in favor of the Scouts. I was in scouts many years ago and enjoyed every second. Now, my son is involved in cub scouts and enjoying. These issues have not come up in our group and I hope they never do. I don't agree with the policies of the national organization and I hope that local boy scout councils and troops are more tolerant.

Might want to check the constution again there is no such thing mentioned there.

[natty bumppo 297]

Boy scouts have some special privileges granted by the government. But they are still allowed to discriminate as a private group would. In my opinion, they should loose all their public benefits and be treated as any other private religious group, unless they drop their discriminating practices.

the boy scouts are not a religion.

I didn't say they were, just a religious group, after all, you have to be part of a church to be part of the boy scouts.

i certainly don't recall having to be part of a church

There is no church requirement but as I intimated above, the Oath and the Promise presume a belief in God or religion.

Just like ....

I pledge allegiance to the Flag

of the United States of America,

and to the Republic for which it stands:

one Nation under God, indivisible,

With Liberty and Justice for all

and money must be bad too with the printed words ... "In God We Trust"

Edited December 9, 2007 by Natty Bumppo

[DerekJ 0]

I was in Boy Scouts and not part of a church in Texas, but it was more of a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" thing regarding religion rather than me being openly atheist/agnostic.

The religious aspect comes from the Boy Scout Oath and the Boy Scout Promise. Both of those mantra contain references to God or religion. As someone mentioned earlier, they are an organization of public accommodation. Constitutional law dictates that they are not allowed to discriminate if they receive public benefits/funds. Yet lawmakers have looked the other way. There was a Supreme Court case some years ago concerning a gay scout or leader. IIRC, the Court came down in favor of the Scouts. I was in scouts many years ago and enjoyed every second. Now, my son is involved in cub scouts and enjoying. These issues have not come up in our group and I hope they never do. I don't agree with the policies of the national organization and I hope that local boy scout councils and troops are more tolerant.

Might want to check the constution again there is no such thing mentioned there.

Of course those specific words are not there but it is a well-established principle of constitutional analysis and more than a little bit of case law that supports what I have said.

[pedroh 21]

Boy scouts have some special privileges granted by the government. But they are still allowed to discriminate as a private group would. In my opinion, they should loose all their public benefits and be treated as any other private religious group, unless they drop their discriminating practices.

the boy scouts are not a religion.

I didn't say they were, just a religious group, after all, you have to be part of a church to be part of the boy scouts.

i certainly don't recall having to be part of a church

There is no church requirement but as I intimated above, the Oath and the Promise presume a belief in God or religion.

Just like ....

I pledge allegiance to the Flag

of the United States of America,

and to the Republic for which it stands:

one Nation under God, indivisible,

With Liberty and Justice for all

and money must be bad too with the printed words ... "In God We Trust"

yea.. but that wasn't the original pledge of allegiance.. Eisenhower added the under God thing.. so it's a biased fact

[Dan J 277]

Boy scouts have some special privileges granted by the government. But they are still allowed to discriminate as a private group would. In my opinion, they should loose all their public benefits and be treated as any other private religious group, unless they drop their discriminating practices.

the boy scouts are not a religion.

I didn't say they were, just a religious group, after all, you have to be part of a church to be part of the boy scouts.

i certainly don't recall having to be part of a church

There is no church requirement but as I intimated above, the Oath and the Promise presume a belief in God or religion.

Just like ....

I pledge allegiance to the Flag

of the United States of America,

and to the Republic for which it stands:

one Nation under God, indivisible,

With Liberty and Justice for all

and money must be bad too with the printed words ... "In God We Trust"

Under God was never part of the original form of the pledge. That was added during the cold war. More or less as anti communist propaganda, as the Soviet Union and other communist nations were perceived as godless.

[natty bumppo 297]

Boy scouts have some special privileges granted by the government. But they are still allowed to discriminate as a private group would. In my opinion, they should loose all their public benefits and be treated as any other private religious group, unless they drop their discriminating practices.

the boy scouts are not a religion.

I didn't say they were, just a religious group, after all, you have to be part of a church to be part of the boy scouts.

i certainly don't recall having to be part of a church

There is no church requirement but as I intimated above, the Oath and the Promise presume a belief in God or religion.

Just like ....

I pledge allegiance to the Flag

of the United States of America,

and to the Republic for which it stands:

one Nation under God, indivisible,

With Liberty and Justice for all

and money must be bad too with the printed words ... "In God We Trust"

yea.. but that wasn't the original pledge of allegiance.. Eisenhower added the under God thing.. so it's a biased fact

It is what is is today. Not stating what it was ... just what is today.

Just looking for the outcry about the words ... even how bad the money must be because of the words printed on the currency.

[peejay 327]

The city has decided it does not want to subsidize a group that discriminates.

Who is "The City"? It is in reality "certain people" and their personal beliefs. They have abused their power to punish the Scouts for not conforming to their personal standards of behavior (or lack of them). They wish to impose their standards on society at large and punished the Scouts for not bowing to their extortion.

The so-called "City" is saying, "tolerate and embrace open homosexuality or we punish you". The City of brotherly love...what a bunch of idiotic dictators of the looney Left's agenda. They want the Boy Scouts to be their personal forum for homosexuality...or else! It's kind of creepy when you think about it.

The Boy Scouts are better off paying more rent elsewhere and not giving in to intimidation by extortionists with looney personal agendas.

[pedroh 21]

The city has decided it does not want to subsidize a group that discriminates.

Who is "The City"? It is in reality "certain people" and their personal beliefs. They have abused their power to punish the Scouts for not conforming to their personal standards of behavior (or lack of them). They wish to impose their standards on society at large and punished the Scouts for not bowing to their extortion.

The so-called "City" is saying, "tolerate and embrace open homosexuality or we punish you". The City of brotherly love...what a bunch of idiotic dictators of the looney Left's agenda. They want the Boy Scouts to be their personal forum for homosexuality...or else! It's kind of creepy when you think about it.

The Boy Scouts are better off paying more rent elsewhere and not giving in to intimidation by extortionists with looney personal agendas.

so are homosexuals loony? or just because they are gay, they can't join the boy scouts? because of course, it's a well known fact that homosexuality is spreaded by sight, or a slight touch..

[Ban Hammer 13,346]

so are homosexuals loony? or just because they are gay, they can't join the boy scouts? because of course, it's a well known fact that homosexuality is spreaded by sight, or a slight touch..

research shows that only 20% were born gay, the remaining 80% were sucked into it.

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

so are homosexuals loony? or just because they are gay, they can't join the boy scouts? because of course, it's a well known fact that homosexuality is spreaded by sight, or a slight touch..

What causes homophobia? What is it that makes a heterosexual man worry? I think it's because men know that deep down we have weak sales resistance. We're constantly buying shoes that hurt us, pants that don't fit right. Men think, "Obviously I can be talked into anything. What if I accidentally wander into some sort of homosexual store, thinking it's a shoe store, and the salesman goes, "Just hold this guy's hand, walk around the store a little bit, see how you feel. No obligation, no pressure, just try it. Would you like to see him in a sandal?"

- Seinfeld, The Note (1991)

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I don't think that the preferences of a particular person are at all even slightly relevant to being a scout or a scout leader. I mean... its been 20+ years since I was in a scout troop but I can't remember any sort of xxx education or discussion about those issues coming up, or being a problem in any of the meetings or field trips I attended.

[ivona 0]

My son is in the cubscouts and I can personally say that I would prefer if they didn't show God in my sons face and just let the kids enjoy themselves while learning something useful.

We don't attend church and we don't agree with the image of God pushed by the cubscouts, but what can you do? He enjoys himself, hopefully as he gets older he will realize the brainwashing is happening...

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

My son is in the cubscouts and I can personally say that I would prefer if they didn't show God in my sons face and just let the kids enjoy themselves while learning something useful.

We don't attend church and we don't agree with the image of God pushed by the cubscouts, but what can you do? He enjoys himself, hopefully as he gets older he will realize the brainwashing is happening...

Yeap, plenty of kids are brainwashed by religious kooks but grow up and snap out of it.

[peejay 327]

The city has decided it does not want to subsidize a group that discriminates.

Who is "The City"? It is in reality "certain people" and their personal beliefs. They have abused their power to punish the Scouts for not conforming to their personal standards of behavior (or lack of them). They wish to impose their standards on society at large and punished the Scouts for not bowing to their extortion.

The so-called "City" is saying, "tolerate and embrace open homosexuality or we punish you". The City of brotherly love...what a bunch of idiotic dictators of the looney Left's agenda. They want the Boy Scouts to be their personal forum for homosexuality...or else! It's kind of creepy when you think about it.

The Boy Scouts are better off paying more rent elsewhere and not giving in to intimidation by extortionists with looney personal agendas.

so are homosexuals loony? or just because they are gay, they can't join the boy scouts? because of course, it's a well known fact that homosexuality is spreaded by sight, or a slight touch..

Homosexuality isn't an issue until someone makes an issue of it. Since when was the Boy Scouts about sexuality? It never was when I was a Scout.

This episode by the weirdos in Philly is all about using the Boy Scouts as a platform to propagandize their agenda. Total bullshit. The organization is for and about kids, not adults trying to spoonfeed kids a bunch of propaganda about homosexuality.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

The city has decided it does not want to subsidize a group that discriminates.

Who is "The City"? It is in reality "certain people" and their personal beliefs. They have abused their power to punish the Scouts for not conforming to their personal standards of behavior (or lack of them). They wish to impose their standards on society at large and punished the Scouts for not bowing to their extortion.

The so-called "City" is saying, "tolerate and embrace open homosexuality or we punish you". The City of brotherly love...what a bunch of idiotic dictators of the looney Left's agenda. They want the Boy Scouts to be their personal forum for homosexuality...or else! It's kind of creepy when you think about it.

The Boy Scouts are better off paying more rent elsewhere and not giving in to intimidation by extortionists with looney personal agendas.

so are homosexuals loony? or just because they are gay, they can't join the boy scouts? because of course, it's a well known fact that homosexuality is spreaded by sight, or a slight touch..

Homosexuality isn't an issue until someone makes an issue of it. Since when was the Boy Scouts about sexuality? It never was when I was a Scout.

This episode by the weirdos in Philly is all about using the Boy Scouts as a platform to propagandize their agenda. Total bullshit. The organization is for and about kids, not adults trying to spoonfeed kids a bunch of propaganda about homosexuality.

But surely if the organisation is discriminating against people on that basis, then they are making it an issue - just not an overt one. As you say the kids probably don't care (I know I didn't). I wonder why the organisation itself does...

Edited December 10, 2007 by Number 6