Patience with your S/O

[jordanianprincess 0]

Now my husband would love it to death! if I wore the hijab. But he doesn't force it. He really likes the Hijab and also it's a cultural and Islamic way of them having authority over you, really it is.

NO it's not! It has nothing to do with men at all. It is a religious act nothing more nothing less. And a darn good one too in my opinion. Just look at the differences of how women here are treated there... those of us who wear it there don't get nearly the amount of problems as those of you who choose not to. I was there and everyone I met was perfectly respectful and nice to me. Granted, they thought I was Arab but even after my husband explained that I did not understand Arabic fluently and told them I was American they were still VERY nice to me. Men did not even talk to me alhamdulilah! If they needed something from me they would address my husband. One man out of the whole time I was there tried to shake my hand but Yousuf was quick to smack it away LOL. And NO it was not because he was trying to control me, it was because he knew that I would not shake hands with a man and he was protecting me. No one stared at me in bad ways. No one dared look at me in a lustful manner (1. because my husband is a a very big strong man, I'm sure) but also because I felt as if they respected me. Western women at the pyramids who were dressed like they didn't know where they were, were treated badly but not me.. not once. I'm not saying it's excusable for them to treat anyone that way, I'm just making the point that covering is not a bad thing. Even in the western countries... those women who dress more modestly are taken more seriously than those who expose 90% of their bodies.

Sorry but I need to object here Leila, that is because peaple can be ignorant. I agree that it's worn for religious reasons, but that does not mean that people should be treated badly becuase they don't share those beliefs. I know you are not saying it's a bad thing, but there are not very many women that I know that expose 90% of their bodies. Personally I don' think there is enough tolerance in the ME on this subject and I think people there need to be more open-minded.

If you choose to cover-up, you have my utmost respect. If you are forced (which many are) that is wrong. I don't cover up, but I'm not hangin out of my clothes either and I hve never gotten anything but respect. In the Middle East, it depends on the country you go to, some are more liberal than others but all should be treated with respect.

Object to what JP? This is not a court of law

Had you read my post to the end you would have noticed that I said it's NOT excusable

Now my husband would love it to death! if I wore the hijab. But he doesn't force it. He really likes the Hijab and also it's a cultural and Islamic way of them having authority over you, really it is.

NO it's not! It has nothing to do with men at all. It is a religious act nothing more nothing less. And a darn good one too in my opinion. Just look at the differences of how women here are treated there... those of us who wear it there don't get nearly the amount of problems as those of you who choose not to. I was there and everyone I met was perfectly respectful and nice to me. Granted, they thought I was Arab but even after my husband explained that I did not understand Arabic fluently and told them I was American they were still VERY nice to me. Men did not even talk to me alhamdulilah! If they needed something from me they would address my husband. One man out of the whole time I was there tried to shake my hand but Yousuf was quick to smack it away LOL. And NO it was not because he was trying to control me, it was because he knew that I would not shake hands with a man and he was protecting me. No one stared at me in bad ways. No one dared look at me in a lustful manner (1. because my husband is a a very big strong man, I'm sure) but also because I felt as if they respected me. Western women at the pyramids who were dressed like they didn't know where they were, were treated badly but not me.. not once. I'm not saying it's excusable for them to treat anyone that way, I'm just making the point that covering is not a bad thing. Even in the western countries... those women who dress more modestly are taken more seriously than those who expose 90% of their bodies.

Sorry but I need to object here Leila, that is because peaple can be ignorant. I agree that it's worn for religious reasons, but that does not mean that people should be treated badly becuase they don't share those beliefs. I know you are not saying it's a bad thing, but there are not very many women that I know that expose 90% of their bodies. Personally I don' think there is enough tolerance in the ME on this subject and I think people there need to be more open-minded.

If you choose to cover-up, you have my utmost respect. If you are forced (which many are) that is wrong. I don't cover up, but I'm not hangin out of my clothes either and I hve never gotten anything but respect. In the Middle East, it depends on the country you go to, some are more liberal than others but all should be treated with respect.

Object to what JP? This is not a court of law

Had you read my post to the end you would have noticed that I said it's NOT excusable

I object to this view in general. If we all cover up, we would be treated better. I know you think its not excusable, but there are so many in the ME that think this way of thinking is ok. I was not objecting to you, more so to this style of thought

[djcess 0]

i know the answer to that is compromise, but hmmm....., how do you actually do that?

[dollface41601 0]

JP....u have some very good points....i definitly disagree with women covering up " for the wrong reasons" i know my sis in laws dont, but if are around uncles or cousins, they do it for this reason " so the families dont start talking" its sad, and sucks, but thats life right...especially in zarqa, which i consider to be a very unsafe city......i dont cover, but my dress is decent....sofyan has never asked me too, and i never would....but i dont feel any less respected from other arabs or my family back home....

[AInfante-Saraireh 0]

JP and Just Waiting, thanks for understanding what i was tryuing to say. Like I said, I posted in a hurry, my daughter has been very ill and is finally after two weeks making a slight recovery. What I mean as women in place, traveling to an Arab country for an american woman can be so so different. YOu know how some women here in the STates like to express there point, even if it's in the middle of the street? LOL Well, it just can't be done there. I just think that in order for all to balance, we must understand both sides, not just culture, but both sides of man and woman. We are different in many ways and Americans are more expressive in their thoughts, and they have a lot to say about life in general. I know I do. I don't believe that Hijabs are religious thing in Islam. I know Arabs here in America, and they are Muslims and they know that Hijab is more culture and was brought into Islam honestly to cover and protect their women from sin. But really, hijabs should be for Muslims, Christians, Jews, etc...and should be worn in any house of prayer. I am too free, but I do respect God to actually do this. If you did it here in the States, everyone would look at you as an Muslim/Arab and probably snuff you. Christians wouldn't understand that, because very few do it. But hijabs are in every culture and in the books as respect to God in prayer. Anyway, I don't think we should debate each other all the time. Everyone has a point of view. Express, agree or disagree but don't snap at each other. First of all, even if some of us has converted to Islam, we were not raised in it and have a lot to learn. Also, on VJ, there are many Christians and Jews who have married Arab men from the ME. We are all here for the same reason, waiting for our husbands visas. Some of us have their husbands here and they are coping too. So let's be a bit more supportive here.

Ok, off to bed. Everyone have a great weekend.

[iceyspots 0]

Now my husband would love it to death! if I wore the hijab. But he doesn't force it. He really likes the Hijab and also it's a cultural and Islamic way of them having authority over you, really it is.

I think authority is wayyy too strong of a word there, if you'd even like to make that claim. I know muslim women who have no man of "authority" in her life, and she still wears hijab to protect herself from the lustful stares. For me it's a personal choice.. but anyways.

Now my husband would love it to death! if I wore the hijab. But he doesn't force it. He really likes the Hijab and also it's a cultural and Islamic way of them having authority over you, really it is. I mean, this doesn't show the body, etc. And they like it!

I hate to get in hijab wars, and normally try to avoid them like the plague, but let me just make one small comment. Hijab is what you make of it. If you let your husband use it against you, then it's that. But, for myself and for many other muslims both here in the US and around the world (like many of the women I had the pleasure of meeting in Egypt), it has completely different connotations. We embrace the hijab as an integral part of our faith and a sign of obediance to God. I wore hijab before I ever met my husband.

I enjoyed this article from the Christian Science Monitor last week, as it highlights the growing trend of american muslims to take on hijab.

[iceyspots 0]

JP and Just Waiting, thanks for understanding what i was tryuing to say. Like I said, I posted in a hurry, my daughter has been very ill and is finally after two weeks making a slight recovery. What I mean as women in place, traveling to an Arab country for an american woman can be so so different. YOu know how some women here in the STates like to express there point, even if it's in the middle of the street? LOL Well, it just can't be done there. I just think that in order for all to balance, we must understand both sides, not just culture, but both sides of man and woman. We are different in many ways and Americans are more expressive in their thoughts, and they have a lot to say about life in general. I know I do. I don't believe that Hijabs are religious thing in Islam. I know Arabs here in America, and they are Muslims and they know that Hijab is more culture and was brought into Islam honestly to cover and protect their women from sin. But really, hijabs should be for Muslims, Christians, Jews, etc...and should be worn in any house of prayer. I am too free, but I do respect God to actually do this. If you did it here in the States, everyone would look at you as an Muslim/Arab and probably snuff you. Christians wouldn't understand that, because very few do it. But hijabs are in every culture and in the books as respect to God in prayer. Anyway, I don't think we should debate each other all the time. Everyone has a point of view. Express, agree or disagree but don't snap at each other. First of all, even if some of us has converted to Islam, we were not raised in it and have a lot to learn. Also, on VJ, there are many Christians and Jews who have married Arab men from the ME. We are all here for the same reason, waiting for our husbands visas. Some of us have their husbands here and they are coping too. So let's be a bit more supportive here.

Ok, off to bed. Everyone have a great weekend.

It just seems to me that the bolded statements are contradicted. There are specific quotes in the Qu'ran, 7:26 and 33:59 respectively. Women from ALL muslim countries have some kind of standards on hijab, while they are worn differently in different regions (e.g. hijab is different in morocco compared to the %100 veiled style in saudi or afghanistan). If it was simply just a cultural thing to be imposed onto women, then you wouldn't find it in Indonesia... etc.. countries that are outside of the realm of the ME/NA. But we have to remember that religion helpes shape culture... When I started wearing hijab, Yacine didn't say "Mabrouk now men won't hit on you anymore" he said "Mabrouk that you are properly following the Qu'ran".

[Together4ever 1]

JP and Just Waiting, thanks for understanding what i was tryuing to say. Like I said, I posted in a hurry, my daughter has been very ill and is finally after two weeks making a slight recovery. What I mean as women in place, traveling to an Arab country for an american woman can be so so different. YOu know how some women here in the STates like to express there point, even if it's in the middle of the street? LOL Well, it just can't be done there. I just think that in order for all to balance, we must understand both sides, not just culture, but both sides of man and woman. We are different in many ways and Americans are more expressive in their thoughts, and they have a lot to say about life in general. I know I do. I don't believe that Hijabs are religious thing in Islam. I know Arabs here in America, and they are Muslims and they know that Hijab is more culture and was brought into Islam honestly to cover and protect their women from sin. But really, hijabs should be for Muslims, Christians, Jews, etc...and should be worn in any house of prayer. I am too free, but I do respect God to actually do this. If you did it here in the States, everyone would look at you as an Muslim/Arab and probably snuff you. Christians wouldn't understand that, because very few do it. But hijabs are in every culture and in the books as respect to God in prayer. Anyway, I don't think we should debate each other all the time. Everyone has a point of view. Express, agree or disagree but don't snap at each other. First of all, even if some of us has converted to Islam, we were not raised in it and have a lot to learn. Also, on VJ, there are many Christians and Jews who have married Arab men from the ME. We are all here for the same reason, waiting for our husbands visas. Some of us have their husbands here and they are coping too. So let's be a bit more supportive here.

Ok, off to bed. Everyone have a great weekend.

It just seems to me that the bolded statements are contradicted. There are specific quotes in the Qu'ran, 7:26 and 33:59 respectively. Women from ALL muslim countries have some kind of standards on hijab, while they are worn differently in different regions (e.g. hijab is different in morocco compared to the %100 veiled style in saudi or afghanistan). If it was simply just a cultural thing to be imposed onto women, then you wouldn't find it in Indonesia... etc.. countries that are outside of the realm of the ME/NA. But we have to remember that religion helpes shape culture... When I started wearing hijab, Yacine didn't say "Mabrouk now men won't hit on you anymore" he said "Mabrouk that you are properly following the Qu'ran".

I don't want to get into the Hijab wars either. It is personal choice. I spoke at length with a sheikh about this issues and nowhere in the quran is it stated specifically that a woman MUST cover her hair. This was a cultural practice that extended back before the time of Islam. The quran states that women (as well as men) should dress with modesty particularly in public. Because covering the hair was already a cultural practice it eventually became adopted as a public symbol that you were a "good girl".

I do understand its philosophy, I respect it, and I am in no way belittling the use of it. It is not an implement of control or anything else other then what the wearer makes it for themself.

[jordanianprincess 0]

JP and Just Waiting, thanks for understanding what i was tryuing to say. Like I said, I posted in a hurry, my daughter has been very ill and is finally after two weeks making a slight recovery. What I mean as women in place, traveling to an Arab country for an american woman can be so so different. YOu know how some women here in the STates like to express there point, even if it's in the middle of the street? LOL Well, it just can't be done there. I just think that in order for all to balance, we must understand both sides, not just culture, but both sides of man and woman. We are different in many ways and Americans are more expressive in their thoughts, and they have a lot to say about life in general. I know I do. I don't believe that Hijabs are religious thing in Islam. I know Arabs here in America, and they are Muslims and they know that Hijab is more culture and was brought into Islam honestly to cover and protect their women from sin. But really, hijabs should be for Muslims, Christians, Jews, etc...and should be worn in any house of prayer. I am too free, but I do respect God to actually do this. If you did it here in the States, everyone would look at you as an Muslim/Arab and probably snuff you. Christians wouldn't understand that, because very few do it. But hijabs are in every culture and in the books as respect to God in prayer. Anyway, I don't think we should debate each other all the time. Everyone has a point of view. Express, agree or disagree but don't snap at each other. First of all, even if some of us has converted to Islam, we were not raised in it and have a lot to learn. Also, on VJ, there are many Christians and Jews who have married Arab men from the ME. We are all here for the same reason, waiting for our husbands visas. Some of us have their husbands here and they are coping too. So let's be a bit more supportive here.

Ok, off to bed. Everyone have a great weekend.

Andrea, #1 U'm glad you daughter is feeling better! I agree with everything you said except what I put in Bold. I don't think christians should wear hijabs, and its not mentioned anywhere in the bible nor preached in the churches to do so. It is true that some older Christian religions like mine (Orthodox) require you to wear a scarf in the church or before recieving communion, however most don't do this anymore. I'd have to also say that wearing hijab is not cultural, it's Islamic. If it were cultural then everyone in the middle east would have to wear one. You did make one interesting point...there is a certain amount control with the hijab. If it was strictly religious, then they would all be the same. Some women wear tight clothing and a scarf around their hair. Some cover up head to toe showing nothing but their eyes. Some even cover thier eyes. I think with the recent wave of extremism in Islam and the fundamentalists, they have given the hijab a new meaning. Some of you may disagree, I'd like to share with you that when my dad was growing up in the middle east, women were not as conservative as they are now. I have pictures of my mom in Jordan wearing a shorti skirt and tank top in the late 60's. Women did not cover up the way they do now. He was absoulutly astonished when he returned to Jordan after being gone for 28 years. He said he felt the country had moved backwards instead of getting with the times.

By the way...I don't think this is Hijab war. There are alot of people that come into this forum to read about the Middle East, this is a good way to educate people why certain things are done.

Kelly - Wow what can I say...I think you have become a true Jordanian. I'm very impressed. Not only have you learned the culture and the language and even lived there, but you have also learned how to brush things off. Some people really try to get to you, and I'm glad to see you don't let them. I have grown up my entire life hearing things like ..you can't do this, what will the family say? When I was younger, I used to always tell my parents that they cared more about what everyone else thought, then they cared about their own thoughts. I defintly don't feel less respected for not covering up or being more conservative. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't like it, don't look!

[AInfante-Saraireh 0]

JP, it does state in the Bible in Corithians that one's head should be covered upon entering and praying in the church. I can find it for you if you'd like. But off the hijab, head dress, etc. subject, 4 more months till my husband has interview date. Hate to see time move so fast since time in a way is valuable since we are all getting older, but I want my HUSBAND!

[AngelK96 0]

Andrea time is moving fast seems like when you get over 21 time speeds up, but when you are waiting for something important the time seems to move very slowly. Hope your daughter is feeling better!

[jordanianprincess 0]

JP, it does state in the Bible in Corithians that one's head should be covered upon entering and praying in the church. I can find it for you if you'd like. But off the hijab, head dress, etc. subject, 4 more months till my husband has interview date. Hate to see time move so fast since time in a way is valuable since we are all getting older, but I want my HUSBAND!

Ok well to chruch yes, but on a daily basis no. I'm actually supposed to wear one in my church as well but no one does it anymore. My friend is Assyrian and she has to wear it, they actually have spare scarves at the enterence of the church incase you forgot yours.

I know what you mean about not wanting the time to pass by so fast...I don't want to get any older but at the same time I can't wait until he is here. Those 4 months are gonna fly by, especially since its summer. Winter months seem to drag on for me, but once summer rolls around there seems to be alot more to do. Weddings, graduations, birthdays, etc.

I've already got quite a few things lined up for myself...Kicking off the summer with a cruise to Mexico. One of my favorite things to do is to go to the Lake. My friend has a really nice boat, and she takes us out on it all the time. It's nice being out there with the girls. Still wish I was in your shoes though

[Veiled Princess 1]

I don't want to get into the Hijab wars either. It is personal choice. I spoke at length with a sheikh about this issues and nowhere in the quran is it stated specifically that a woman MUST cover her hair. This was a cultural practice that extended back before the time of Islam. The quran states that women (as well as men) should dress with modesty particularly in public. Because covering the hair was already a cultural practice it eventually became adopted as a public symbol that you were a "good girl".

I do understand its philosophy, I respect it, and I am in no way belittling the use of it. It is not an implement of control or anything else other then what the wearer makes it for themself.

Ok prepare yourselves I'm quoting from the Quran again but it'll even out after I quote from the bible later in this post

24.31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty ....

Ok just_waiting, read the bolded part and think about this... in that time the jewish and christian woman already wore veils over their heads (it wasn't until more recently that they stopped this act) so this verse is going one step further and telling us (muslim women... all others can disregard) that we should pull the veils that are already over our heads around our bodies to cover our bosoms/chest. I hope that makes sense and clarifies that it is required to cover your hair in Islam.

JP, it does state in the Bible in Corithians that one's head should be covered upon entering and praying in the church. I can find it for you if you'd like. But off the hijab, head dress, etc. subject, 4 more months till my husband has interview date. Hate to see time move so fast since time in a way is valuable since we are all getting older, but I want my HUSBAND!

Ok well to chruch yes, but on a daily basis no. I'm actually supposed to wear one in my church as well but no one does it anymore. My friend is Assyrian and she has to wear it, they actually have spare scarves at the enterence of the church incase you forgot yours.

JP, bare with me and you'll understand why a woman covering her head is required in Christianity at all times ok?

(1Co 11:5) But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.

(1Co 11:6) For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.

Ok notice in the above verses it is a requirement for a woman to cover her head at any time she is praying or prophesying. I don't really understand the point of making it a requirement to prophesy since fortunetelling is forbidden in the bible but that's another poste for another day

Anyway, back to the point... it does not specify in a church it says "that prayeth". Also some people like to translate this verse to mean that her hair is what covers her head but that's why I posted the verse after it so I could point out that not having your head covered is the same as being shaved... it also says that IF you don't cover your head you should shave your hair off... therefore it is obvious that it's not talking about covering your head with your hair since if you weren't doing that then you would already be shaved and this would be a moot point.

Next verse...

(Rom 12:12) Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;

In another translation that last part is translated as "at all times given to prayer" which means a christian is supposed to be in a constant state of prayer.

Well, if you're in a constant state of prayer and supposed to have your hair covered to pray then it stands to reason that your hair should ALWAYS be covered

Anyway I think this is where ainfante might have been coming from.

I would also like to point out that the veil is mentioned in the bible in both OT and NT and it is pretty safe to assume that "hijab" was started by the jews and later the christians and then passed down to the muslims.

[jordanianprincess 0]

I don't want to get into the Hijab wars either. It is personal choice. I spoke at length with a sheikh about this issues and nowhere in the quran is it stated specifically that a woman MUST cover her hair. This was a cultural practice that extended back before the time of Islam. The quran states that women (as well as men) should dress with modesty particularly in public. Because covering the hair was already a cultural practice it eventually became adopted as a public symbol that you were a "good girl".

I do understand its philosophy, I respect it, and I am in no way belittling the use of it. It is not an implement of control or anything else other then what the wearer makes it for themself.

Ok prepare yourselves I'm quoting from the Quran again but it'll even out after I quote from the bible later in this post

24.31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty ....

Ok just_waiting, read the bolded part and think about this... in that time the jewish and christian woman already wore veils over their heads (it wasn't until more recently that they stopped this act) so this verse is going one step further and telling us (muslim women... all others can disregard) that we should pull the veils that are already over our heads around our bodies to cover our bosoms/chest. I hope that makes sense and clarifies that it is required to cover your hair in Islam.

JP, it does state in the Bible in Corithians that one's head should be covered upon entering and praying in the church. I can find it for you if you'd like. But off the hijab, head dress, etc. subject, 4 more months till my husband has interview date. Hate to see time move so fast since time in a way is valuable since we are all getting older, but I want my HUSBAND!

Ok well to chruch yes, but on a daily basis no. I'm actually supposed to wear one in my church as well but no one does it anymore. My friend is Assyrian and she has to wear it, they actually have spare scarves at the enterence of the church incase you forgot yours.

JP, bare with me and you'll understand why a woman covering her head is required in Christianity at all times ok?

(1Co 11:5) But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.

(1Co 11:6) For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.

Ok notice in the above verses it is a requirement for a woman to cover her head at any time she is praying or prophesying. I don't really understand the point of making it a requirement to prophesy since fortunetelling is forbidden in the bible but that's another poste for another day

Anyway, back to the point... it does not specify in a church it says "that prayeth". Also some people like to translate this verse to mean that her hair is what covers her head but that's why I posted the verse after it so I could point out that not having your head covered is the same as being shaved... it also says that IF you don't cover your head you should shave your hair off... therefore it is obvious that it's not talking about covering your head with your hair since if you weren't doing that then you would already be shaved and this would be a moot point.

Next verse...

(Rom 12:12) Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;

In another translation that last part is translated as "at all times given to prayer" which means a christian is supposed to be in a constant state of prayer.

Well, if you're in a constant state of prayer and supposed to have your hair covered to pray then it stands to reason that your hair should ALWAYS be covered

Anyway I think this is where ainfante might have been coming from.

I would also like to point out that the veil is mentioned in the bible in both OT and NT and it is pretty safe to assume that "hijab" was started by the jews and later the christians and then passed down to the muslims.

The only issue with this is that there are soooooo many versions of the bible. Its not in all of them

[Together4ever 1]

I don't want to get into the Hijab wars either. It is personal choice. I spoke at length with a sheikh about this issues and nowhere in the quran is it stated specifically that a woman MUST cover her hair. This was a cultural practice that extended back before the time of Islam. The quran states that women (as well as men) should dress with modesty particularly in public. Because covering the hair was already a cultural practice it eventually became adopted as a public symbol that you were a "good girl".

I do understand its philosophy, I respect it, and I am in no way belittling the use of it. It is not an implement of control or anything else other then what the wearer makes it for themself.

Ok prepare yourselves I'm quoting from the Quran again but it'll even out after I quote from the bible later in this post

24.31 And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms and not display their beauty ....

Ok just_waiting, read the bolded part and think about this... in that time the jewish and christian woman already wore veils over their heads (it wasn't until more recently that they stopped this act) so this verse is going one step further and telling us (muslim women... all others can disregard) that we should pull the veils that are already over our heads around our bodies to cover our bosoms/chest. I hope that makes sense and clarifies that it is required to cover your hair in Islam.

JP, it does state in the Bible in Corithians that one's head should be covered upon entering and praying in the church. I can find it for you if you'd like. But off the hijab, head dress, etc. subject, 4 more months till my husband has interview date. Hate to see time move so fast since time in a way is valuable since we are all getting older, but I want my HUSBAND!

I want to reiterate one thing. I consulted with a sheikh about this issue. I would consider a sheikh somewhat of an authority. I wanted a truly educated view before I formed my own interpretation. Secondly "drawing the veil over the bossom" as HE explained to me meant the bossom, and not the head and face. To be realistic about this, as with any holy writing, it is open to interpretation. I will not argue it. Interpretation is a subjective and personal matter. I had hoped for possibly an open discussion on this, without the patronizing. I go back to my original quote, "nowhere does it state SPECIFICALLY that the HAIR MUST be covered." Being new to Islam I found this very interesting and did some researching into the social root of it. You of course are as welcome to your interpretation as I am.

Since others on this forum have been welcome to have opinion and be who they are, I will go ahead take this opportunity myself. I realize I am not a member of the "clique" here, that's not really my style, but this is not a very welcoming place unless you conform to those who rule roost. I do understand now why some of the women have left. I have tried to remain open minded and understanding.

I thought this would be a place of sisterhood, support, and information sharing. I have gotten support and information here and I will always remain grateful for it no matter how I am viewed by others here.

However, I am tired of the patronizing. This is a hard process. Remember the visa thing? I'm sure those of you who have not seen your beloved in months or now in my case as well as others more then a year, know that at times you feel adrift and terribly lonely. Emotionally I am not up to handling this kind of monkey business. I just want my husband back and some form of normalcy to my life. Obviously this is not a positive factor in that for me.

I'm sure this post will be lamblasted with more arrogance and more patronizing, however I will not be here to read it. You can enjoy your "outrage party" today. But ladies, is all this necessary? REALLY? Support is what is sought here by so many. The cattiness is just over bearing. Have at it as you will. I remain another fed up VJ-er.

[UmmSqueakster 54]

I think it's probably safe to say that hijabis and non hijabis feel uncomfortable in this discussion. We've all made our choices regarding clothes and it might just be best if we don't talk about it anymore. It hurts me when someone thinks that my husband uses it as a weapon against me, and I'm sure it hurts others when someone says that all other women parade around half naked.

Truce?