U.S. citizen arrested under state's new anti-illegal immigrant law, Hispanic advocate says

[Nessa 23]

[Peikko 1,575]

I must have missed where I wandered off topic. Please accept my apologies.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Only 16 votes and so far the overwhelming majority is in favor of a guest worker program instead of deportation for those who are here illegally.

If you think otherwise...vote in the poll.

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/index.ph...t&p=1308503

[no name 1]

*snicker*

me too!

Vote for me!

[no name 1]

I am still astonished that anyone should think that's a good example of how to deal with the problem of economic migration. More than that, I am astonished that anyone should smile in the context of people losing their lives because a perilous journey is preferable to remaining in the poverty stricken status quo of staying in their country of origin.

Then again, if you think in the terms of 'so sad, too bad'...well, I guess it's not so astonishing.

Who said that?

Not easy to work to make your country better when you are doing nothing more than subsisting...but then in reality I believe, that globally, this is what should happen and would be part of a long term solution if all countries are really prepared to look at the world as a place we all live in, and not continue this "us and them mentality". I have always argued that we should look at what drives people to immigrate illegally and not just throw up the barriers and pretend that it doesn't matter.

Economic migrants, for the most part, don't actually want to live somewhere else, they want to live in their 'homes' which is why, suprise, suprise, many of those who do go elsewhere to better themselves continue to send money back to their country of origin and try to maintain their cultural heritage...some people think this is objectionable too.

and who said that? Are you a migrant? How do you know what they think?

Well, it's certainly callous to observe nations that suffer from intense poverty and just say, "well, if only they would help themselves they'd be alright." As if somehow, the people in these nations are stupid or lazy.

It does require some input from those nations that have the wealth to be able to improve the situation of those nations that are impoverished.

and again????

Oh of course, my bad. Economic migrants just want the easy way out don't they? They don't really have any problems at home that can't be fixed if only they had a bit of back bone and determination. Oh my, that's really...well, if you do believe that, then I guess it is not suprising that you think that illegal aliens are little more than scum under your shoes.

and again?

No one is suggesting that this isn't a complex problem that would require some very imaginative solutions. Not every country that supports an impoverished population does so because of a lack of natural resources, but then not all are a result of corrupt regimes either.

What is suprising though, is that one can just dismiss these impoverished populations as lazy and stupid because they can't see a way to change their terrible situations and would rather move than simply starve.

Wow, is that whole lotta putting words in people's mouths...!

Seems to work for you. Can't handle own medicine can we?

Needless to say her interpretation of comments made in the thread isn't that far off. You seem to be under the bizarre illusion that a person can't paraphrase those comments to make a general point, or that because the exact words of the paraphrase weren't said verbatim by any one person that they have no meaning, relevance or validity.

Little disingenuous don't you think?

Quite the contrary. Where have I/we insulted the 'other side'? Where have I/we put words in your mouths? Where have I/we been so cruel?

Exactly, we haven't.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I am still astonished that anyone should think that's a good example of how to deal with the problem of economic migration. More than that, I am astonished that anyone should smile in the context of people losing their lives because a perilous journey is preferable to remaining in the poverty stricken status quo of staying in their country of origin.

Then again, if you think in the terms of 'so sad, too bad'...well, I guess it's not so astonishing.

Who said that?

Not easy to work to make your country better when you are doing nothing more than subsisting...but then in reality I believe, that globally, this is what should happen and would be part of a long term solution if all countries are really prepared to look at the world as a place we all live in, and not continue this "us and them mentality". I have always argued that we should look at what drives people to immigrate illegally and not just throw up the barriers and pretend that it doesn't matter.

Economic migrants, for the most part, don't actually want to live somewhere else, they want to live in their 'homes' which is why, suprise, suprise, many of those who do go elsewhere to better themselves continue to send money back to their country of origin and try to maintain their cultural heritage...some people think this is objectionable too.

and who said that? Are you a migrant? How do you know what they think?

Well, it's certainly callous to observe nations that suffer from intense poverty and just say, "well, if only they would help themselves they'd be alright." As if somehow, the people in these nations are stupid or lazy.

It does require some input from those nations that have the wealth to be able to improve the situation of those nations that are impoverished.

and again????

Oh of course, my bad. Economic migrants just want the easy way out don't they? They don't really have any problems at home that can't be fixed if only they had a bit of back bone and determination. Oh my, that's really...well, if you do believe that, then I guess it is not suprising that you think that illegal aliens are little more than scum under your shoes.

and again?

No one is suggesting that this isn't a complex problem that would require some very imaginative solutions. Not every country that supports an impoverished population does so because of a lack of natural resources, but then not all are a result of corrupt regimes either.

What is suprising though, is that one can just dismiss these impoverished populations as lazy and stupid because they can't see a way to change their terrible situations and would rather move than simply starve.

Wow, is that whole lotta putting words in people's mouths...!

Seems to work for you. Can't handle own medicine can we?

Needless to say her interpretation of comments made in the thread isn't that far off. You seem to be under the bizarre illusion that a person can't paraphrase those comments to make a general point, or that because the exact words of the paraphrase weren't said verbatim by any one person that they have no meaning, relevance or validity.

Little disingenuous don't you think?

Quite the contrary. Where have I/we insulted the 'other side'? Where have I/we put words in your mouths? Where have I/we been so cruel?

Exactly, we haven't.

If you like

[Fandango 1,439]

Good grief. Am I invisible? Am I talking out of my bottom and therefore speaking a different language? Stop with the antagonism and stuff of which the words fail me at the moment (am rather light headed from kilz2 fumes so pardon my ditziness). Stop it all, otherwise it'll be.....hammer locky time.

Mags, I apol for my *snicker* comment since it was vague, but it was really on topic and not meant to antagonize. I don't think Dev's comment was insensitive towards our Mexican members...in fact, it's disspelling a lot of lies that anyone here who is anti-illegal has made the statements that PH was accussing people here of thinking. I for one am anti illegal, but have never made the statements that any country's people are 'lazy, stupid, etc'. That's an important distinction that Dev made about the people here who are anti-illegal.

I snickered because she hit the nail on the head with one fell swoop & it's wildly strange that I find myself agreeing with her on something. I assume C did the same for the same reasons. Dev's comment was disspelling some of the bs from the conversation, so the only other comment after your warning would be #6's.

Is that what you're referring to?

[nin 1]

... so far the overwhelming majority is in favor of a guest worker program instead of deportation for those who are here illegally.

The poll does NOT ask if people are in favour of a guest worker program INSTEAD of deportation of those who are already here illegally.

[Nessa 23]

... so far the overwhelming majority is in favor of a guest worker program instead of deportation for those who are here illegally.

The poll does NOT ask if people are in favour of a guest worker program INSTEAD of deportation of those who are already here illegally.

good point

[no name 1]

Good grief. Am I invisible? Am I talking out of my bottom and therefore speaking a different language? Stop with the antagonism and stuff of which the words fail me at the moment (am rather light headed from kilz2 fumes so pardon my ditziness). Stop it all, otherwise it'll be.....hammer locky time.

Mags, I apol for my *snicker* comment since it was vague, but it was really on topic and not meant to antagonize. I don't think Dev's comment was insensitive towards our Mexican members...in fact, it's disspelling a lot of lies that anyone here who is anti-illegal has made the statements that PH was accussing people here of thinking. I for one am anti illegal, but have never made the statements that any country's people are 'lazy, stupid, etc'. That's an important distinction that Dev made about the people here who are anti-illegal.

I snickered because she hit the nail on the head with one fell swoop & it's wildly strange that I find myself agreeing with her on something. I assume C did the same for the same reasons. Dev's comment was disspelling some of the bs from the conversation, so the only other comment after your warning would be #6's.

Is that what you're referring to?

I responded because PH was accusing the anti-illegals of saying things that were cruel & untrue. So I simply asked where/who. It happens in threads a lot, I'm not sure how that is a 'ignore the mod' thing. Even PH questioned where it went OT.

Lisa - With all this agreeing lately, maybe you, me & Charles are the new BFFs of VJ.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Good grief. Am I invisible? Am I talking out of my bottom and therefore speaking a different language? Stop with the antagonism and stuff of which the words fail me at the moment (am rather light headed from kilz2 fumes so pardon my ditziness). Stop it all, otherwise it'll be.....hammer locky time.

Mags, I apol for my *snicker* comment since it was vague, but it was really on topic and not meant to antagonize. I don't think Dev's comment was insensitive towards our Mexican members...in fact, it's disspelling a lot of lies that anyone here who is anti-illegal has made the statements that PH was accussing people here of thinking. I for one am anti illegal, but have never made the statements that any country's people are 'lazy, stupid, etc'. That's an important distinction that Dev made about the people here who are anti-illegal.

I snickered because she hit the nail on the head with one fell swoop & it's wildly strange that I find myself agreeing with her on something. I assume C did the same for the same reasons. Dev's comment was disspelling some of the bs from the conversation, so the only other comment after your warning would be #6's.

Is that what you're referring to?

Offhand - Natty made a statement along those lines, and it wasn't very many pages ago

But if we are talking about dispelling lies - how about the one that has been perpetrated throughout this and the other thread that people who don't agree with specific laws are somehow "pro-illegal immigrant". If you want to be honest here - at least acknowledge that the "debate" thus far has been characterised by hysterical interpretations of people's words (and of course, not a little anger)

As usual this thread could do with less melodrama - but after a certain point that seems to be the only thing that keeps the thing going. At this point - it really should be closed. IMO. Seeing as the discussion has long since lost i) focus and ii) any pretense of civilised discourse.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

... so far the overwhelming majority is in favor of a guest worker program instead of deportation for those who are here illegally.

The poll does NOT ask if people are in favour of a guest worker program INSTEAD of deportation of those who are already here illegally.

That would be, question 3...

Both major political parties support a guest worker program. Where do you stand?

Completely against.

As laid out by the Republican Party, I support it.

As laid out by the Democratic Party, I support it.

I would support some kind of guest worker program under the right circumstances.

Any kind of guest worker program is more logical than deportation.

What answer is not covered?

[Mags 112]

Hey I'm high on paint fumes so I can't even remember typing my last comment.

[no name 1]

Hey I'm high on paint fumes so I can't even remember typing my last comment.

They musta improved Kilz since I used it last year! Damn girl.

[Mags 112]

Hey I'm high on paint fumes so I can't even remember typing my last comment.

They musta improved Kilz since I used it last year! Damn girl.

This stuff is potent, really potent. I'm in a small room with only a door for ventilation which I can't open coz of the cats. So, I keep going to it, getting a few breaths of fresh air and continuing.