B1/B2 Visa

[slim 1,525]

K1 saved us about 10K a year in out of state tuition. Moving in with me while here on an F1 would not break any rules as far as I know, even if we decided to get married some time in the future.

K1 also "locked her in" as your wife instead of "just living together" as a foreign student and her boyfriend. (Although, you probably would've saved more than 10K a year just having a foreign girlfriend living with you instead of a wife!)

The OP on this topic is not in a dissimilar situation. He has the opportunity to "choose" which way to go with the entire visa process and whether or not to pursue it with a wife here, a wife overseas, or a fiancee that's just so happened to have visited several times in the past year.

This is a perfectly legal way to go, regardless of how it's done. The OP isn't actually doing anything wrong by weighing the options. The fact is the B visa was obtained for the purposes of the job (sure, seeing the person she loves is a great side-benefit) and not for the purposes of seeing the boyfriend. And now since she has the B visa, the rest is all optional!

[Satellite 1]

There is certainly a bias towards K visas here. In the case of my wife, it was a choice between a K1 or F1 (she is a full time student anyway). K1 saved us about 10K a year in out of state tuition.

Certainly true. But each states does it differently. For example in California one needs to be resident for one year to qualify for in state tuition. For a K1 holder that means I-94 / entry stamp plus 365 days. But if you came in one something else you might not qualify:

"Unfortunately, the following visa status holders cannot establish residency regardless of the length of time in California: B-1, B-2, C, D-1, D-2, F-1, F-2, H-2, H-3, J-1, J-2, M-1, M-2, O-2, P-1, P-2, P-3, P-4, Q, and TN/TD."

However, once you get your green card the clock starts to tick even if you did come in on one of the visas listed above. I am not sure from which date you start counting from date of greencard or date of entry. I take it the date of entry or at least the date you got your driver's license will work too. Because residency in California is status / length based. Once you overcome status you can start counting the length. The day you got status doesn't really need to be an issue. So in our case my wife got her green card within a year of arrival, it would not have mattered in terms of tuition.

People have been denied entry for a lot less, and even "contemplating" marriage while she just happens to be traveling on a business Visa can raise suspicions.

I am again confused by your line of thinking. If someone has no "immigration file" - no pending I-129F etc., how does an immigration officer come to a conclusion that a person coming to the states for a job interview plans on marrying? The two just don't go together. They can ask who the employer is, what accommodations, and how long. And unless you say something stupid like I am going to be staying with my fiancé the day before the interview and then we are off to get married the day after, you should be fine.

[mox 298]

People have been denied entry for a lot less, and even "contemplating" marriage while she just happens to be traveling on a business Visa can raise suspicions.

I am again confused by your line of thinking. ... And unless you say something stupid like I am going to be staying with my fiancé the day before the interview and then we are off to get married the day after, you should be fine.

Well that's pretty much my line of thinking, but I don't think most people would be quite so obvious about it. It's possible that the CO and the applicant could start chatting, the applicant starts to feel at ease, mentions a boyfriend, and then it gets slippery from there.

Anyway, I said I wouldn't speculate, and there I go speculating. I guess what I'm trying to convey to the OP is to just be careful. Obviously their relationship has become more than just boyfriend/girlfriend. They haven't made the big commitment yet, but it's obvious they're circling the drain. USCIS likes things to be black and white. They start seeing shades of gray and they're likely to get nervous.

[Satellite 1]

Obviously their relationship has become more than just boyfriend/girlfriend.

Wow, how would you know such a detail? Were you spying on them?

[mox 298]

Obviously their relationship has become more than just boyfriend/girlfriend.

Wow, how would you know such a detail? Were you spying on them?

Look out your window...I'll wave...

[Fettman 0]

Obviously their relationship has become more than just boyfriend/girlfriend.

Wow, how would you know such a detail? Were you spying on them?

Look out your window...I'll wave...

After reading through all the responses I understand the whole intent and legality behind the situation. Nothing official has been said to anyone. My concern is with the whole process after the fact. If for some reason she comes her and while she is here I decide to ask her to marry me and then she stays beyond her allotted time it seems to me that could cause trouble with the whole AOS, Social Security, getting work documents process. I would in some ways prefer to go through the whole K-1 process if it would mean things would be easier on that end. I think both of us would like for her to be able to start working and leave the country again in a timely manner rather than waiting for some time. This whole thing came totally as a surprise to both of us. I did not expect for her to be invited to America for an interview, nor get a multiple entry B1/B2 visa.

So, two questions. One, how much more "riskier" is it for me to make the marriage decision once she is here on the B1/B2 visa than if I asked her to marry me now and go through the K-1 process? Two, if I did decide to apply for the K-1, she can still come here on the B1/B2 visa if I arrange for an invitation and she proves that she has sufficient ties to Russa correct? I was already prepared to pay all the fees and she is already prepared to do all the stuff on her end, so really going the K-1 route is not too much for us to handle. We understand the wait times and that is why we decided that it would be a good idea for her to apply for a job in Russia to pay her bills while I save money for us. However, if for some reason we decided not to make up our minds about marriage until she was here on a B1/B2 and the process after we got married was as "painless" as the K-1 then why not go for it?

I appreciate all the feedback and advice. I want to work the system for my benefit rather than the system trying to benefit off of me. Thanks!

[russ 1]

So, two questions. One, how much more "riskier" is it for me to make the marriage decision once she is here on the B1/B2 visa than if I asked her to marry me now and go through the K-1 process? Two, if I did decide to apply for the K-1, she can still come here on the B1/B2 visa if I arrange for an invitation and she proves that she has sufficient ties to Russa correct? I was already prepared to pay all the fees and she is already prepared to do all the stuff on her end, so really going the K-1 route is not too much for us to handle. We understand the wait times and that is why we decided that it would be a good idea for her to apply for a job in Russia to pay her bills while I save money for us. However, if for some reason we decided not to make up our minds about marriage until she was here on a B1/B2 and the process after we got married was as "painless" as the K-1 then why not go for it?

I appreciate all the feedback and advice. I want to work the system for my benefit rather than the system trying to benefit off of me. Thanks!

To stay away from TOS issues, I will put it this way. Hypothetically, should someone legally admitted to the US marry and submit an AOS, it is as likely to be approved as a K1. Procedurely, it raises a red flag with USCIS if such a marriage occurs less than 30 days after entry into the country, but otherwise, it does not screw anything up. As long as an AOS is pending, there is no problem obtaining SS or EADs or anything else.

Intending to get married on a non-marriage visa is, of course, against the rules.

I would suggest spending about $100 to speak with an immigration lawyer for an hour or so. Prepare your questions in advance.

[Satellite 1]

Addition:

1. If you file for AOS based on marriage to a US citizen all previous overstays and unlawful work will be forgiven. So don't worry about taking time to get married even if she is out of status.

2. When you apply for AOS you instantly get authorized stay by the Attorney General.

3. Biggest draw back to getting AOS from B1/B2 visa is that you can't travel abroad until you get the card. Too risky to try AP in such situations. Not a big deal if you want to work and travel in the US for a year or two.

4. Once you apply for that I-129F your fiancée will face great difficulty upon entering, no matter what letters you write. Even the European folks who have high paying jobs and real property in their home countries get turned around once that pending I-129F is in the system.

5. Going straight to AOS will save you money and time in the long run, however, only if you admit to doing something illegal will it end up costing you more in legal fees.

6. Statistically more people Adjust status from other visas rather than K1/K3 visas.

[russ 1]

6. Statistically more people Adjust status from other visas rather than K1/K3 visas.

Everything Sat said is correct.

An important consideration though - if your wife overstays and you don't marry, you will be screwing her life up. I would suspect that one reason your wifes interview is in the US is that they want to make sure she can travel here freely. A visa overstay will likely cost her career. If she gets this job, try to get them to employ her here and go the K3 route.

Drug company MBAs do okay, she could end up making more money than you in the next few years. I would make the job priority number one. It may make the K visa issue moot, if she can get herself a transfer to the US. Having a 150K+ a year job in the US puts her way ahead of most of us.

She will probably get the B1, as she has more to lose by overstaying in the US.

[Satellite 1]

A visa overstay will likely cost her career. If she gets this job, try to get them to employ her here and go the K3 route.

Obviously applying for another with a previous overstay doesn't help, but the real punishment begins after 180 day overstay with a 3 year bar on entry and a 10 year bar for a one year or more overstay. There are hardship waivers to USC's to get around this but they take a long time to grand and seldom granted.

She will probably get the B1, as she has more to lose by overstaying in the US.

Unlike B2 visas which immigration officers tend to blindly grant 6 months of status in the US. B1's I-94's tend to represent exactly how long the stay will be. This is based on the word of many practitioners in this field.

[russ 1]

Obviously applying for another with a previous overstay doesn't help, but the real punishment begins after 180 day overstay with a 3 year bar on entry and a 10 year bar for a one year or more overstay. There are hardship waivers to USC's to get around this but they take a long time to grand and seldom granted.

The failure to show up at work will cause problems as well. Probably better off going the K route for this reason.

[Fettman 0]

Obviously applying for another with a previous overstay doesn't help, but the real punishment begins after 180 day overstay with a 3 year bar on entry and a 10 year bar for a one year or more overstay. There are hardship waivers to USC's to get around this but they take a long time to grand and seldom granted.

The failure to show up at work will cause problems as well. Probably better off going the K route for this reason.

Thanks for all the advice Russ and Sat, basically here is how I see things happening for the two of us based on different visa routes:

K-1

I apply for the K-1 soon after her interview next week. If she gets the job, great, but she only wanted to use it temporarily in Russia until she was able to come here and marry me if we so decided to get married. She does not want to work for J&J long term, she just knows that she will get a better salary with them in Russia than just waiting tables, etc. In the US she would like not to work for a bit and then search for a job she wants, to work for a non-profit or NGO. So, the job point a not one we are concerned with right now. She was going to quit J&J in any case. So, she would work for them until the K-1 was approved, quit her job and then come here, and then we would go through the whole AOS and onward process.

B1/B2

We would wait and see what happened with the job and if she was offered one, great, but we would find an excuse for her to come here again and before she did that she would quit her job and then come her, we would wait the 30 days or so, and then get married. Then we would have the whole AOS and onward process.

I see that the risks involved are not too great, intent is a hard thing to prove to in any case since she is technically not my fiancee yet. However, I think both of us have set up the next 6 months or so getting prepared to get married, I need to move into my own place, she needs to be able to pack up her stuff and decide what to take with her, work on getting a visa for her mom to come to the wedding, etc. I have the money set aside already, so I think in the end we will both feel more comfortable taking the K-1 route. We would both really like to be able to go to Russia within a year of our marriage so she can visit family and friends. Sat answered the biggest question I had about being able to use the visa to come while the I-129F is under review. However, if the process from AOS onward is the same for both then it is an option to consider. However, I think J&J will look more favorably on her if she stays 6 months and the says that she is going to America and will be interested in working with them there, as a back up if she cannot find a job she wants. Just alot for me to balance out and discuss more with her. However, when the waiting and money are not an issue for us I think we would prefer to play it "legal" with the K-1.

Thanks again!

[mox 298]

I hate to be a wet blanket. I really do. But your last post sounds a lot like you've already made up your mind about marrying this girl. If you intend to marry in the United States, she will be entering fraudulently on the B1/B2. There's no such thing as "technically" being your fiance. If you have intent then that's all that matters, and it sounds like you have intent. If she is entering this country with the intent to marry you, then it will be fraudulent unless she enters on the K-1. You are playing a dangerous game with your futures if you try to get the "best deal" out of the system. And as others have pointed out, it could cost your SO a lot more than just a marriage.

If I've misunderstood you, my apologies.

[russ 1]

I hate to be a wet blanket. I really do. But your last post sounds a lot like you've already made up your mind about marrying this girl. If you intend to marry in the United States, she will be entering fraudulently on the B1/B2. There's no such thing as "technically" being your fiance. If you have intent then that's all that matters, and it sounds like you have intent

It is her intent that matters here, not his. There is no B visa now, so this discussion is purely academic anyway. I would suggest she consult with an immigration lawyer in the US to discus options anyway - comments here are not legal advice.

[mox 298]

It is her intent that matters here, not his.

As the saying goes, it takes 2 to tango. Somehow I don't think this whole marriage thing is going to be news to her.