Unemployment List

[Ban Hammer 13,348]

all you have proven is....you don't want to hear anything other than agreement w/ what you have to say & this is another illegal immigrant cheerleading thread.

ROTFLMAO Pot meet Kettle !!!

actually....no suprise...but you're WRONG again. if you'll look at my friends list, some of those people (fancy & almaty) & myself don't agree on many issues at all. yet i do have great respect for these people and value their opinions & views as well as consider them to be friends.

It is my belief that you have no desire to hear anything other than agreement with the potition you have taken. I spent last night going through this forum and it is plainly obvious that there is an anti-immigration crowd here, here of all places! And I truely mean anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration. This handful of people are in no way interested in talking about this topic, they attack any person who does not conform to their belief. These people are nothing but haters and do not care to discuss the issue.

Just take a look at this thread. I ask a simple question, Tell me about people you know who have lost jobs, and look at the response...same few people come out to derail and attack the person who is in opposition to them. THAT, my friend, is an anti-immigration crowd.

you're confusing anti-illegal immigration with anti-immigration. even your op contained the sentence "This is a list of people(real name not necessary) who can not get a job because of illegal aliens taking those jobs. I would like to limit it to the following:" so do try to stay on topic and off the soap box.

[JenT 0]

I'm genuinely surprised at some people's resistance to stay on topic. [snip]

I think it can be explained by the simple fact that no one here is being paid to stay on topic. I think if we were salaried employees then members would be less inclined to to treat it lightly. As well, conversations naturally branch off into other areas of interest so it's really not that surprising.

As an observation -- and not directed at you, Eau_Xplain -- it's kind of hard to stay on topic when the OP has deliberately baited the audience; doesn't stand up to his moniker (a "gentleman" is a civilized, educated, sensitive, or well-mannered man); and is steadfastly hostile.

Nessa's joke was FUNNY. It reminded me of Agador in The Birdcage. Hank Azaria was brilliant in creating a character who was not only funny, but endearing.

Sometimes people take life so seriously. Life is FUN. I just wish people could enjoy it.

well said

[Peikko 1,575]

A list isn't really very useful. If there are 20 Million illegal immigrants in the US of employable age (which is probably not right as at least 30% are going to be either too young or too old, but for sake of argument) then there are 20 Million extra people seeking employment so it really depends how many actual jobs exist to know how many of these jobs are being taken up by illegal immigrants at the expense of indigenous people.

[natty bumppo 297]

Landscaping is a full time job around here too. In the summer months they plant flowers, take care of lawns, etc. In the winter months they cut and ship Christmas trees.

I have got to live near you !!! Just think Christmas all winter long !!

Cutting and shipping Christmas trees is extremely seasonal, is of a short duration, and is normally over on Dec 25. Unless in your area they continue to cut and ship in Jan ... Feb ...

[no name 1]

Landscaping is a full time job around here too. In the summer months they plant flowers, take care of lawns, etc. In the winter months they cut and ship Christmas trees.

I have got to live near you !!! Just think Christmas all winter long !!

Cutting and shipping Christmas trees is extremely seasonal, is of a short duration, and is normally over on Dec 25. Unless in your area they continue to cut and ship in Jan ... Feb ...

[AmericanGentleman 0]

all you have proven is....you don't want to hear anything other than agreement w/ what you have to say & this is another illegal immigrant cheerleading thread.

ROTFLMAO Pot meet Kettle !!!

actually....no suprise...but you're WRONG again. if you'll look at my friends list, some of those people (fancy & almaty) & myself don't agree on many issues at all. yet i do have great respect for these people and value their opinions & views as well as consider them to be friends.

It is my belief that you have no desire to hear anything other than agreement with the potition you have taken. I spent last night going through this forum and it is plainly obvious that there is an anti-immigration crowd here, here of all places! And I truely mean anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration. This handful of people are in no way interested in talking about this topic, they attack any person who does not conform to their belief. These people are nothing but haters and do not care to discuss the issue.

Just take a look at this thread. I ask a simple question, Tell me about people you know who have lost jobs, and look at the response...same few people come out to derail and attack the person who is in opposition to them. THAT, my friend, is an anti-immigration crowd.

you're confusing anti-illegal immigration with anti-immigration. even your op contained the sentence "This is a list of people(real name not necessary) who can not get a job because of illegal aliens taking those jobs. I would like to limit it to the following:" so do try to stay on topic and off the soap box.

Your still attacking the messenger rather than answering the question? You sir, are a fraud. Let me know if you ever want to have an honest debate, but I wont be holding my breath.

[AmericanGentleman 0]

A list isn't really very useful. If there are 20 Million illegal immigrants in the US of employable age (which is probably not right as at least 30% are going to be either too young or too old, but for sake of argument) then there are 20 Million extra people seeking employment so it really depends how many actual jobs exist to know how many of these jobs are being taken up by illegal immigrants at the expense of indigenous people.

That is the question I am trying to find an answer to. That is the question that is being deliberately clouded by intellectually dishonest people who rather play word games rather than seek real answers.

[Peikko 1,575]

I don't think you will find answers in this way though.

Most people are probably not interested in anything beyond that which affects them directly. If there is a perception that people are having their 'tax dollars' wasted because of illegal immigrants, then they will get upset. If they think their immigration process is affected directly because of illegal immigrants, they will get upset. If they think that illegal immigration is a threat to homeland security, they will get upset.

Most of what drives people's reaction to illegal immigrants is not fact, but emotion and even presenting facts will probably not change their perception one way or another.

Edited October 31, 2007 by Purple_Hibiscus

[AmericanGentleman 0]

I'm genuinely surprised at some people's resistance to stay on topic. [snip]

I think it can be explained by the simple fact that no one here is being paid to stay on topic. I think if we were salaried employees then members would be less inclined to to treat it lightly. As well, conversations naturally branch off into other areas of interest so it's really not that surprising.

As an observation -- and not directed at you, Eau_Xplain -- it's kind of hard to stay on topic when the OP has deliberately baited the audience; doesn't stand up to his moniker (a "gentleman" is a civilized, educated, sensitive, or well-mannered man); and is steadfastly hostile.

Nessa's joke was FUNNY. It reminded me of Agador in The Birdcage. Hank Azaria was brilliant in creating a character who was not only funny, but endearing.

Sometimes people take life so seriously. Life is FUN. I just wish people could enjoy it.

Paid stay on topic??? You think these derailers require money to show common decentcy? Might be on to something there. Sorry, you do not feel that discrediting false information with a passion in gentlemanly. I certainly do.

[AmericanGentleman 0]

I don't think you will find answers in this way though.

Most people are probably not interested in anything beyond that which affects them directly. If there is a perception that people are having their 'tax dollars' wasted because of illegal immigrants, then they will get upset. If they think their immigration process is affected directly because of illegal immigrants, they will get upset.

Most of what drives people's reaction to illegal immigrants is not fact, but emotion and even presenting facts will probably not change their perception one way or another.

Well this has to be the most exact and correct thing that has been said to date. Well said indeed. There is no way I can top this perfect logic, so I will end my posts on this here. You are correct.

[Krikit 1,164]

Paid stay on topic??? You think these derailers require money to show common decentcy? Might be on to something there. Sorry, you do not feel that discrediting false information with a passion in gentlemanly. I certainly do.

As with respect, it is my observation that in order to receive common decency, you must first show it.

[Ban Hammer 13,348]

all you have proven is....you don't want to hear anything other than agreement w/ what you have to say & this is another illegal immigrant cheerleading thread.

ROTFLMAO Pot meet Kettle !!!

actually....no suprise...but you're WRONG again. if you'll look at my friends list, some of those people (fancy & almaty) & myself don't agree on many issues at all. yet i do have great respect for these people and value their opinions & views as well as consider them to be friends.

It is my belief that you have no desire to hear anything other than agreement with the potition you have taken. I spent last night going through this forum and it is plainly obvious that there is an anti-immigration crowd here, here of all places! And I truely mean anti-immigration, not anti-illegal immigration. This handful of people are in no way interested in talking about this topic, they attack any person who does not conform to their belief. These people are nothing but haters and do not care to discuss the issue.

Just take a look at this thread. I ask a simple question, Tell me about people you know who have lost jobs, and look at the response...same few people come out to derail and attack the person who is in opposition to them. THAT, my friend, is an anti-immigration crowd.

you're confusing anti-illegal immigration with anti-immigration. even your op contained the sentence "This is a list of people(real name not necessary) who can not get a job because of illegal aliens taking those jobs. I would like to limit it to the following:" so do try to stay on topic and off the soap box.

Your still attacking the messenger rather than answering the question? You sir, are a fraud. Let me know if you ever want to have an honest debate, but I wont be holding my breath.

your question asked and answered. the only fraud i'm seeing is the reason for you starting this thread - it was in response to a post i made yesterday and you apparently have an ax to grind over it. keep being a "gentleman" as it's quite amusing.

[Marc and Olga 0]

You know, I have to agree with Charles on this one, this thread is in bad taste.

I do not support amnesty for those whose life in the USA has been aquired through illegal means (i.e. EWI), I have seen, first hand, multiple families living in a studio apartment.

While I do not go around saying the "sound bite" you choose for this thread I will say there are at least 5 "hot dog stands" that have appeared in my part of Tucson in the 4+ years I have lived in this particular part of town, which has been my contention, they don't need to take jobs...they make their own (and probably don't follow standard business or health laws, where does one wash their hands at a hot dog stand?)

Most importantly, my contention (being anti-amnesty) is we have tried it several times in the last 20 years all with promises that our laws would be enforced and now, 21 years after this promise, none of the laws are being enforced and, in fact it is estimated that we now have MORE people here illegally then we had back then...thus these amnesties that these "cheerleaders" want have not only failed but failed miserably to the point that is actually seems to have ENCOURAGED more people to EWI.

Now allow me to expand a little, lets consider those that may not have come here to work, those that come here to commit crimes/acts of violence...

about 2 months ago alone, there were 2 stories of people here illegally commiting terrible act, 1, a Mexican man in Phoenix shot (and killed) a Phoenix Police Officer, the Mexican man was here ILLEGALLY, had given a false name due to warrants on his name, however the name he gave ALSO had warrants! It seems he also had a previous deportation and was serious criminal history.

first story

the other, a man attacked a pregnant woman who was able to fend off the man with a knife, the man went to the hospital (hmmm wonder if he paid his bill?) for the cuts he received attacking this woman... the attack came less then 5 days AFTER he was deported. Yes he was deported AND came back in time to attack this woman.

second story here

What did either of these guys do that makes you want to open the border? I personally do not want Mexico's poor, especially since they seem unwilling to assimulate into our society.

And last, while it isn't an immigration issue as it is a welfare issue, I would be willing to bet if we limited the welfare programs the these Americans that like to sit on their @$$es pumping out babies for a bigger check, that these people would be working their bums (for you UKers ) off at these jobs that "Amercians don't want to do"

JMHO

[Peikko 1,575]

And last, while it isn't an immigration issue as it is a welfare issue, I would be willing to bet if we limited the welfare programs the these Americans that like to sit on their @$$es pumping out babies for a bigger check, that these people would be working their bums (for you UKers wink.gif ) off at these jobs that "Amercians don't want to do"

Ah yes, those people that so enjoy the lazy life they are willing to live on welfare (Does anyone really believe this is some easy street idyll life?) I believe the term 'welfare queens' was a product of the Reagan administration. A useful device, but not something that is based in any reality...much like many of the fallacies that are spread about illegal immigrants.

However, facts don't change people's emotional responses very much.

[no name 1]

Ah yes, those people that so enjoy the lazy life they are willing to live on welfare (Does anyone really believe this is some easy street idyll life?) I believe the term 'welfare queens' was a product of the Reagan administration. A useful device, but not something that is based in any reality...much like many of the fallacies that are spread about illegal immigrants.

I worked with a girl in college who quit because she could make more money on welfare sitting home with her 2 kids. So it is done.