Kohl's unveils plans to go solar in Wisconsin

[one...two...tree 2,762]

By Doris Hajewski and Thomas Content

Milwaukee Journal Sentinel

MILWAUKEE - Continuing the most sweeping rollout of solar power nationally ever by one company, Kohl's Corp. will install hundreds of solar panels on two stores in the Milwaukee area and on its new photo studio there.

The project, part of the company's energy conservation strategy, will make the Menomonee Falls, Wis., retailer the largest generator of solar power in the Midwest, according to We Energies.

"It's safe to say that these are the largest projects in the Midwest," said Carl Siegrist, senior project strategist for the Milwaukee utility's Office of Energy Options. "I'm fairly certain there isn't any one location" that has a bigger solar-power array, he said.

Construction on the roof panels at Kohl's department stores in Sussex and Waukesha, Wis., will start in April and be complete by July, according to Ken Bonning, executive vice president of logistics for Kohl's. Each store will have 890 panels.

The Kohl's photo studio is under construction. Solar panel installation also will start there in the spring.

Kohl's chose the two Milwaukee area stores because they are among the newest in the area with roofs in good condition, Bonning said. The panels will generate about 20 percent of the power needed to operate each store.

The announcement comes as Kohl's has just brought solar installations at five stores in California online. By spring of 2008, Kohl's expects to have solar panels in operation at all 63 of its stores in California.

SunEdison is installing the panels in California and in Wisconsin at no cost to Kohl's, Bonning said. In return, Kohl's has a 20-year contract to purchase green power from SunEdison.

"Kohl's energy cost is favorable to rates paid today," Bonning said.

In addition to California and the Milwaukee area, Kohl's has applications pending for solar installations at stores in New Jersey, Colorado, Connecticut, Oregon and Arizona.

The electricity produced by the panels that will be installed at the three Kohl's buildings next year will be enough to offset power used by 886 households in Wisconsin over the 20-year life of the contract, Bonning said.

We Energies is funding $4 million in incentives to help spur development of solar power here, even though Wisconsin is not as sunny as Florida, California or Arizona.

Wisconsin can generate more solar power than people might expect, experts say.

In fact, Wisconsin has better suited to solar power than Germany, according to energy-industry studies, Siegrist said. "And yet in Germany over the last couple years, they're installing about a megawatt a day."

A megawatt is equivalent to twice the power that will be generated by the three Kohl's projects being announced today.

"We're excited about helping customers that are putting in systems of this size," said Siegrist. "It lets you know that it does work in a climate like Germany's, or like Wisconsin's."

The utility is funding incentives projects "to get some large systems out there to let people know that solar works in Wisconsin and to give our company some experience in how solar really works."

We Energies plans to collect data about the power generated by the solar panels every 15 minutes and analyze it in correlation with local weather data.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/101...rkohls1019.html

[Reba 2]

Wow, that's awesome! Way to go Kohls!

[Jasman0717 9]

Right on My old house had solar panels for heating water, worked really well.

[Peikko 1,575]

Good for them.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

Good for them.

Exactly!!

[JODO 2]

Great!

[kaydee457 13]

How much energy, and how many resources were expended to manufacture the solar panels?

If this were a viable "clean/green" technology then you would see far more companies and individuals implementing it.

Thus far it's no more than a very expensive novelty.

[Reba 2]

probably no more resources than say your average output from the manufacture of furnaces and air conditioning units traditionally used to heat and cool a retail store. The difference is of course that they don't continue to belch waste and greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere after they're installed.

[kaydee457 13]

probably no more resources than say your average output from the manufacture of furnaces and air conditioning units traditionally used to heat and cool a retail store. The difference is of course that they don't continue to belch waste and greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere after they're installed.

The appliances you talk about are far more efficient in their use of energy than a solar panel, and therefore dollar for dollar more efficient in cranking out BTU's than a solar panel.

A typical solar panel that yields a mere 50 watt-hour output costs about $500.......That's because they're damn hard to manufacture, and yes, fossil fuels play a large part in manufacturing them. The fuel they consume in operation is "free" (sunlight) but the conversion of sunlight to electricity, and hence efficiency factor is extremely low as opposed to the appliances you mentioned earlier.

A typical furnace costs around $1500 retail (a non-recurring cost) and cranks out around 35000 BTU/hour. The recurring costs is the fuel; lets say gas. The costs to operate the furnace is just pennies/hour compared with the solar panel.

A solar panel (50 watt-hour) cranks out a whopping 170 BTU's/hour.... To replace the furnace you're talking about it will cost you around $103, 000.......and the panels don't last forever...they degrade over time and become even less efficient and eventually need replacement.

Some go 5 years, some 10. You pay more for the 10 year...

Pretty good huh <shrug>

Edited October 22, 2007 by kaydee457

[one...two...tree 2,762]

kaydee, why do you suppose Kohl's as a company would be doing this if it's not cost effective?

http://www.prometheus.org/research/solarrev

SOLAR REVOLUTION

SOLAR REVOLUTION

The Economic Transformation of the Global Energy Industry

By: TRAVIS BRADFORD

Published by: MIT Press, Summer 2006

(click here to see endorsements)

As the energy crisis escalates—and the price of gas and electricity with it—a new book predicts that in the next two decades, solar will become the cheapest energy source for most applications, and will be widely adopted by consumers in both the developed and developing worlds.

SOLAR REVOLUTION: The Economic Transformation of the Global Energy Industry goes beyond moral and altruistic arguments for solar energy to show how today’s dramatically changing market forces point to solar as the inevitable energy source of tomorrow’s self-interested consumers.

In SOLAR REVOLUTION, Bradford predicts an inevitable shift to solar energy that will transform everyday life as radically as did the last century’s revolutions in information and communication technologies. In the past three decades computers and telephones have become decentralized and wireless. Solar energy will do the same for the energy industry, using nearly identical semiconductor technologies and for the same economic reasons–harnessing the nearly limitless energy from the sun.

Bradford considers the pros and cons of other renewable energy sources including nuclear, hydroelectricity, wind, geothermal, and biomass. While all these energy sources will play a role in the future, Bradford predicts that solar energy will become the cheapest for two reasons. First, solar energy already cost-effectively supplies a portion of utilities’ needs for daytime electricity, and its competitiveness is growing rapidly. And secondly, photovoltaics, distributed on a small scale instead of on today’s industrial-size electricity grids, will begin to unravel the economies of scale that Edison’s electricity transmission created over the last century.

SOLAR REVOLUTION shows the steps that governments and businesses can take now to accelerate the solar revolution so that it becomes, not tomorrow’s dream, but today’s reality.

Advance Praise for SOLAR REVOLUTION

“Solar Revolution is an essential read because it analyzes the transformation of the global energy economy... a positive vision of a sensible, practical, sustainable energy future.”

—Bill Richardson, Governor of New Mexico and former US Secretary of Energy

“[solar Revolution] is a timely and much-needed book. With a business perspective and a wealth of knowledge about the solar industry and the wider energy economy, Travis Bradford provides an excellent account of solar energy today.”

—Dan Kammen, Founding Director of the Renewable and Appropriate Energy Laboratory, University of California, Berkeley

“Where others despair in the face of ‘peak oil’ and out-of-control climate change, Travis Bradford sees a unique opportunity to create a clean new energy economy.”

—Christopher Flavin, President, WorldWatch Institute

“This book is a rigorous but intensely practical analysis of how the world's energy future should evolve. It will be valuable not only for scholars dealing with the technological and policy aspects of energy, but also for the concerned citizen who may have no specialized knowledge of the issues. Solar Revolution should receive worldwide attention for exploring the pathways that can guide the world towards a renewable energy future.”

—R.K. Pachauri, Director-General, The Energy and Resources Institute, New Delhi, and Chair of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change

“Everyone who wants to understand the permanent energy answer that can reverse climate change, eliminate oil shocks, and avoid future Chernobyls should read this book. Bradford builds a compelling business case that solar energy is the most disruptive technology in history.”

—Denis Hayes, Former Director, U.S. National Renewable Energy Laboratory

“This book challenges the energy debate: it shows in a convincing way that atomic and fossil energies are dispensable and could be replaced totally by renewables within some decades.”

—Hermann Scheer, General Chairman, World Council for Renewable Energy, and member of the German Parliament

ORDER FROM AMAZON

ORDER FROM MIT

Edited October 22, 2007 by Mister Fancypants

[kaydee457 13]

kaydee, why do you suppose Kohl's as a company would be doing this if it's not cost effective?

http://www.prometheus.org/research/solarrev

SOLAR REVOLUTION

SOLAR REVOLUTION

The Economic Transformation of the Global Energy Industry

By: TRAVIS BRADFORD

Published by: MIT Press, Summer 2006

(click here to see endorsements)

As the energy crisis escalates—and the price of gas and electricity with it—a new book predicts that in the next two decades, solar will become the cheapest energy source for most applications, and will be widely adopted by consumers in both the developed and developing worlds.

SOLAR REVOLUTION: The Economic Transformation of the Global Energy Industry goes beyond moral and altruistic arguments for solar energy to show how today’s dramatically changing market forces point to solar as the inevitable energy source of tomorrow’s self-interested consumers.

In SOLAR REVOLUTION, Bradford predicts an inevitable shift to solar energy that will transform everyday life as radically as did the last century’s revolutions in information and communication technologies. In the past three decades computers and telephones have become decentralized and wireless. Solar energy will do the same for the energy industry, using nearly identical semiconductor technologies and for the same economic reasons–harnessing the nearly limitless energy from the sun.

Bradford considers the pros and cons of other renewable energy sources including nuclear, hydroelectricity, wind, geothermal, and biomass. While all these energy sources will play a role in the future, Bradford predicts that solar energy will become the cheapest for two reasons. First, solar energy already cost-effectively supplies a portion of utilities’ needs for daytime electricity, and its competitiveness is growing rapidly. And secondly, photovoltaics, distributed on a small scale instead of on today’s industrial-size electricity grids, will begin to unravel the economies of scale that Edison’s electricity transmission created over the last century.

SOLAR REVOLUTION shows the steps that governments and businesses can take now to accelerate the solar revolution so that it becomes, not tomorrow’s dream, but today’s reality.

Advance Praise for SOLAR REVOLUTION

“Solar Revolution is an essential read because it analyzes the transformation of the global energy economy... a positive vision of a sensible, practical, sustainable energy future.”

—Bill Richardson, Governor of New Mexico and former US Secretary of Energy

“[solar Revolution] is a timely and much-needed book. With a business perspective and a wealth of knowledge about the solar industry and the wider energy economy, Travis Bradford provides an excellent account of solar energy today.”

—Dan Kammen, Founding Director of the Renewable and Appropriate Energy Laboratory, University of California, Berkeley

“Where others despair in the face of ‘peak oil’ and out-of-control climate change, Travis Bradford sees a unique opportunity to create a clean new energy economy.”

—Christopher Flavin, President, WorldWatch Institute

“This book is a rigorous but intensely practical analysis of how the world's energy future should evolve. It will be valuable not only for scholars dealing with the technological and policy aspects of energy, but also for the concerned citizen who may have no specialized knowledge of the issues. Solar Revolution should receive worldwide attention for exploring the pathways that can guide the world towards a renewable energy future.”

—R.K. Pachauri, Director-General, The Energy and Resources Institute, New Delhi, and Chair of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change

“Everyone who wants to understand the permanent energy answer that can reverse climate change, eliminate oil shocks, and avoid future Chernobyls should read this book. Bradford builds a compelling business case that solar energy is the most disruptive technology in history.”

—Denis Hayes, Former Director, U.S. National Renewable Energy Laboratory

“This book challenges the energy debate: it shows in a convincing way that atomic and fossil energies are dispensable and could be replaced totally by renewables within some decades.”

—Hermann Scheer, General Chairman, World Council for Renewable Energy, and member of the German Parliament

ORDER FROM AMAZON

ORDER FROM MIT

Um, probably because they're being subsidized, both Kohls and the Solar industry, as many other companies and business's around the globe to make it an attractive and viable source........in that way the manufacture's of this technology get needed exposure and needed "real world" experience as well as getting to sell their wares at below what it actually cost to manufacture it. BTW, you and I pay for some of these products to come to fruition as the govenment subsidizes, through tax incentives, this entire industry.

Unfortunately, this technology is not a viable source just yet.........Other fuels and technology dominate as more practical and efficient sources of energy.

The BTU's don't lie......Most engineers understand the economies of efficiency- I do.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

I don't know - the solar stock I bought in June has tripled in value in just 4 months

[kaydee457 13]

I don't know - the solar stock I bought in June has tripled in value in just 4 months

Nah, you need to buy into this.......

Only problem, what goes in (electricity in watts) he can't get out in Hydrogen.......efficiencies, effficiencies folks....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6vSxR6UKFM

Edited October 22, 2007 by kaydee457

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Getting the price right for solar

By Martin LaMonica

Staff Writer, CNET News.com

Electricity from PV panels now costs substantially more than power from conventional fossil-fuel sources. Industry executives say, however, that ramping up the volume of panel production--regardless of any solar cell technology improvements--will bring solar closer in line with today's power rates.

"We have to cut the cost in half of where we are today, and we can do that with a lot of the technologies and solutions available to us today," said Charlie Gay, vice president and general manager of Applied Material's solar business group, while speaking at Massachusetts Institute of Technology's Energy 2.0 conference last month. "What we need to do is scale as fast we can and go up the learning curve."

Solar makers stand to benefit from a global push to increase the production of polysilicon, the primary solar cell material, which at times has zoomed from $20 a kilo to $60 amid a worldwide shortage.

.....

Going down cost curve

Even with the investment boom, the industry still remains dependent on government incentives, from a cost perspective, for the foreseeable future, said Alex Klein, a senior analyst at Emerging Energy Research.

"It's sort of a race against time to drop down costs so that when subsidies (go away), the market will sustain itself," Klein said. "Ultimately, if you talk about the viability of solar PV, it has to become close to competitive with other forms of electricity, at least at peak power."

Generating electricity from photovoltaics costs between 18 and 23 cents a kilowatt hour. It is projected to go down to 11 to 18 cents by 2010 and then to 5 to 10 cents by 2015, according to the National Renewable Energy Labs. By contrast, electricity in the U.S. costs between 5 and 18 cents per kilowatt hour, according to the Energy Information Administration.

Klein agreed that higher manufacturing volume and improvement in the solar industry's supply chain can lower costs. Still, technology to improve cell efficiency or to greatly lower the cost of making solar cells will make a large impact, he said.

Companies are developing so-called thin-film solar cells and other materials such as CIGS (copper indium gallium selenide) to replace high-priced silicon as the dominant photovoltaic material. Nanosolar, for example, raised $100 million to take on incumbent suppliers with a plan to produce 430 megawatts of solar cells a year by using thin polymer films. Shell Solar, the solar division of the petroleum giant, has also become a big advocate of CIGS.

Established silicon-based panel manufacturers are hedging their bets by investing in alternative materials as well.

German company Q-Cells, for example, has invested in several smaller firms working with a range of materials and manufacturing techniques. Sharp, the world's largest silicon panel maker, is also tinkering with alternatives, including concentrators, which increase output by increasing the amount of sunlight that strikes a solar cell.

http://www.news.com/Getting-the-price-righ..._3-6173019.html

[kaydee457 13]

Getting the price right for solar

By Martin LaMonica

Staff Writer, CNET News.com

Electricity from PV panels now costs substantially more than power from conventional fossil-fuel sources. Industry executives say, however, that ramping up the volume of panel production--regardless of any solar cell technology improvements--will bring solar closer in line with today's power rates.

"We have to cut the cost in half of where we are today, and we can do that with a lot of the technologies and solutions available to us today," said Charlie Gay, vice president and general manager of Applied Material's solar business group, while speaking at Massachusetts Institute of Technology's Energy 2.0 conference last month. "What we need to do is scale as fast we can and go up the learning curve."

Solar makers stand to benefit from a global push to increase the production of polysilicon, the primary solar cell material, which at times has zoomed from $20 a kilo to $60 amid a worldwide shortage.

.....

Going down cost curve

Even with the investment boom, the industry still remains dependent on government incentives, from a cost perspective, for the foreseeable future, said Alex Klein, a senior analyst at Emerging Energy Research.

"It's sort of a race against time to drop down costs so that when subsidies (go away), the market will sustain itself," Klein said. "Ultimately, if you talk about the viability of solar PV, it has to become close to competitive with other forms of electricity, at least at peak power."

Generating electricity from photovoltaics costs between 18 and 23 cents a kilowatt hour. It is projected to go down to 11 to 18 cents by 2010 and then to 5 to 10 cents by 2015, according to the National Renewable Energy Labs. By contrast, electricity in the U.S. costs between 5 and 18 cents per kilowatt hour, according to the Energy Information Administration.

Klein agreed that higher manufacturing volume and improvement in the solar industry's supply chain can lower costs. Still, technology to improve cell efficiency or to greatly lower the cost of making solar cells will make a large impact, he said.

Companies are developing so-called thin-film solar cells and other materials such as CIGS (copper indium gallium selenide) to replace high-priced silicon as the dominant photovoltaic material. Nanosolar, for example, raised $100 million to take on incumbent suppliers with a plan to produce 430 megawatts of solar cells a year by using thin polymer films. Shell Solar, the solar division of the petroleum giant, has also become a big advocate of CIGS.

Established silicon-based panel manufacturers are hedging their bets by investing in alternative materials as well.

German company Q-Cells, for example, has invested in several smaller firms working with a range of materials and manufacturing techniques. Sharp, the world's largest silicon panel maker, is also tinkering with alternatives, including concentrators, which increase output by increasing the amount of sunlight that strikes a solar cell.

http://www.news.com/Getting-the-price-righ..._3-6173019.html

Well. quote what you want but the fact remains that it's simply still not there, "tinkering" is a good description of the science that's going into panel design......

One more shortcoming of solar power is the fact that storage cells are needed; these are usually batteries and in themselves questionable as to the economies-. People tend to think of solar power as "clean" energy but don't think of the materials and energy to manufacture the panels and batteries.

Let's face it, you don't mine solar power as you do with coal and oil......you need to manufacture it!

One last thought- did you ever ponder the impact to the Global Ecosystem if everyone, and all nations went solar?

Let's discount the materials in the manufacture of the batteries and the panels themselves but rather focus on multi-billions of square miles across the globe absorbing solar energy via these panels.....

That's right, these panels consume sunlight (energy) that would have otherwise gone to plant life, humans, or just reflected back into the atmosphere. Nothing's free.....

Something to think about.