National Health care in Britain.

[KaiserD 12]

That said, even in the hugely privately funded U.S. system those same types of stories appear, I think it's a separate issue.

Yup, mostly you're right

Except for the first one. She told them several times she needed her steroids but because they were so understaffed they forgot about her and she went into shock, we got a call at 4am saying she was in ICU. Luckily they managed to save her though, so I'm thankful for that at least.

The consultant was very upset with them, that's for sure.

At least for a service you pay for you can demand a bit more in return. When dealing with the NHS there's always "you should be greatful for what you get" thing even though people pay taxes to fund it.

Seems odd she left out the fact these places are filthy

I remember reading article in local paper saying "Man's dying request - please clean the windows" (about Warrington hospital)

My family feel the NHS is given lots of money but it's being sucked out by needless managers and not being put in the right places.

[Mags 112]

I'm not saying that the NHS is perfect, far from it, it has its problems just like any other government institution. You will find plenty of news stories about it because of this.

However, it IS making progress in certain areas. Since the MRSA outbreaks the majority of hospitals have sanitation equipment at the end of every bed. MRSA rates are dropping in many hospitals, but these kinds of news stories don't make good articles. People would rather read the bad things.

Management is another major problem. The Chief Executives get a HUGE salary, your looking in the region of half a million pounds in some cases (depending on the size of the trust). They are p!ss-poor at their jobs and their trust reflects that. Many are in debt. But for every hospital that is failing there are two or three that are improving. It is a gradual progress and can't be changed over night. Old buildings, old style nursing from nurses who were trained 30 years ago before MRSA and the sanitation that is required because of it, poor facilities are ALL being worked on.

New hospitals are being built and the Chief executives are FINALLY being held accountable. But again, this doesn't make a good news story. Believe all of the hype about bad things if you want but I worked for the NHS for a long time and I know how hard it is working to get itself back on track.

Incidentally, despite the MRSA our healthcare is still further up in the world rankings than the USA's. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it!

Edited October 20, 2007 by Mags

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

That said, even in the hugely privately funded U.S. system those same types of stories appear, I think it's a separate issue.

Yup, mostly you're right

Except for the first one. She told them several times she needed her steroids but because they were so understaffed they forgot about her and she went into shock, we got a call at 4am saying she was in ICU. Luckily they managed to save her though, so I'm thankful for that at least.

The consultant was very upset with them, that's for sure.

At least for a service you pay for you can demand a bit more in return. When dealing with the NHS there's always "you should be greatful for what you get" thing even though people pay taxes to fund it.

Seems odd she left out the fact these places are filthy

I remember reading article in local paper saying "Man's dying request - please clean the windows" (about Warrington hospital)

My family feel the NHS is given lots of money but it's being sucked out by needless managers and not being put in the right places.

Kinda says it all! I certainly dont want my loved ones depending on luck in a life and death situation.

I gotta go make my world famous jumbalaya,Takes dam near all day.

[Welshcookie 17]

Incidentally, despite the MRSA our healthcare is still further up in the wor'ld rankings than the USA's. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it!

Anyway...BRING BACK THE MATRONS!!! Back in the day when I did my nurses training, matrons ran the wards like bootcamp sgts

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

NHS slips down world healthcare league

Press Association

Friday November 14, 2003

SocietyGuardian.co.uk

The UK has plummeted in rankings of the world's healthcare systems, coming 18th out of 19 industrialised countries, after researchers looked again at what constitutes good performance.

In 2000, the World Health Organisation (WHO) published performance rankings for the world's health systems, looking at health outcomes, responsiveness and financing.

But the World Health Report received much criticism, with many saying it was misleading to look at deaths from all causes, no matter what the causes were.

Many said it would be more appropriate to look only at those deaths that were avoidable through timely and effective healthcare, such as some cancers and diabetes.

New research from the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine has reassessed healthcare performance in the industrialised countries, taking other factors - such as diet and smoking rates, accidents and suicides - out of the equation.

But while some countries saw their ranking improve, others slipped back, the research published in the British Medical Journal showed. Japan, top of the WHO rankings, dropped to number 13, while Norway shot up from 11th place to second.

The UK, which came in at 10th place in the WHO league table, dropped to 18th place out of the 19 countries included in the analysis, beating only Portugal.

Top of the new rankings was Sweden, up from 4th place in the WHO table.

Dr Ellen Nolte, who carried out the study, said: "We have looked at how the WHO's rankings of health system performance would change if only those causes amenable to healthcare were included. They show that, for some countries, the differences would be very substantial."

Dr Nolte said the complexity of the rankings showed how "fragile" the system was. She said WHO should take on board their findings as a better way of measuring the effectiveness of health systems.

The new rankings

Sweden

Norway

Australia

Canada

France

Germany

Spain

Finland

Italy

Denmark

Netherlands

Greece

Japan

Austria

New Zealand

United States

Ireland

United Kingdom

Portugal

[KaiserD 12]

Incidentally, despite the MRSA our healthcare is still further up in the world rankings than the USA's. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it! tongue.gif

I don't think I'm alone when I say many people want to be proud of the NHS. It is our system, healthcare for all is a symbol of the potential for human beings to do good things. Like I've discussed with people on this forum before, we are thankful for the hard work many of the nurses try to do under the conditions they are in, most of them are just trying to do their jobs.

But I would be hesitant to believe that it's better than US health care until I hear positive stories from every day people and not any government figures. Right now all I am hearing are horror stories - and I'm not talking about from the media or newspapers.

[Caladan 19]

MRSA killed more people than AIDS last year in the U.S. The problem isn't with how the health care is paid for, it's with the fact that we have antibiotic-resistant bacteria merrily running around.

Though it would be cool if we could kill the bacteria by waving cash at it. "Nurse, hand me an American Express card, stat."

[trailmix 77]

MRSA killed more people than AIDS last year in the U.S. The problem isn't with how the health care is paid for, it's with the fact that we have antibiotic-resistant bacteria merrily running around.

Though it would be cool if we could kill the bacteria by waving cash at it. "Nurse, hand me an American Express card, stat."

[Welshcookie 17]

I have always had a great passion for the NHS. When I did nurse I worked only for the NHS, was never tempted by private hospitals. My father, a dedicated nurse first in the military and then for the NHS in his 'retirement', quit 10 yrs ago and was very sad because he could see a downward spiral of good practice and cleanliness on the wards in general, even back then, and I think we are seeing a result of that now.

The same goes for the state of our police force ....too many 'targets' to achieve and too much paperwork.

I am sad to say that I no longer want to go to a hospital in this country. Kettering General, my local hospital, has the worst case numbers for C Diff in the country....luckily me and my son have the option to go to the US MoD hospital if we ever need it, and it really saddens me that I feel this way.

Last time my eldest son, who is diabetic, was in hospital for a nasty case of Quinsy, I was only happy for him to be in for 24 hrs once he got over any danger I encouraged him to sign himself out because I was afraid for him....at the time he was in a hospital that had the 2nd highest cases of MRSA.

NHS is in crisis.

[Lou Lou 1]

The NHS has its faults but, I assure you, it isn't a broken system. Give me the NHS, even with the MRSA, over American healthcare ANY DAY.

:thumbs:

My aunt died from MRSA after being in hospital for a month. She was 68. Ironically, the hospital that killed her saved her life 20 years earlier. She wouldn't have been able to afford that life saver operation 20 years ago if she had lived in the US. I would still take the NHS system over the healthcare system here.

[Welshcookie 17]

The NHS has its faults but, I assure you, it isn't a broken system. Give me the NHS, even with the MRSA, over American healthcare ANY DAY.

I do think that the time has come for people to set aside their emotional attachment to the NHS...it has been hard for me to do over the past few years I can assure you.....but it is broken....and I want it to be fixed...it IS a great institution and I want to be proud of it again.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...7/nnurse217.xml

Edited October 20, 2007 by thanksforthefish

[Mags 112]

NHS slips down world healthcare league

Press Association

Friday November 14, 2003

SocietyGuardian.co.uk

4 years old!

[Jamie76 0]

I developed a staph infection when I was in the hospital for my Crohn's disease. They were pumping antibiotics in to my arm for my entire stay in the ICU unit. It happened here the States too...imagine that.

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

NHS slips down world healthcare league

Press Association

Friday November 14, 2003

SocietyGuardian.co.uk

4 years old!

Sorry, I should have mentioned four years ago it was worse. Maybe someone could explain that to the people who died way back then due to the inadequacies of the system. I could call 911 right now, this very second and recieve the very same care has the richest guy around. I wouldnt have to "Pick a number".

[Widge 0]

USA

A landmark study indicating MRSA kills 18,000 Americans each year, along with reports of outbreaks in schools across the nation and the death of a high school student in Virginia, has renewed calls for more aggressive government action to help prevent the spread of the "super bug" — a bacteria named methicillin-resistant staphylococcus aureus.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-1...bug-staph_N.htm

Total road deaths 42000 USA

http://www.driveandstayalive.com/info%20se...s/stats-usa.htm

UK

the mentions of MRSA on death certificates increased by 22% to 1,168.in 2004

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4742770.stm

Total Road deaths UK 3,221 in 2004

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=1208

Kinda makes me think some people should take their head out of the proverbial a#$## and stop seeing the world through rose coloured glasses !!

Superbugs are prevalent in hospitals and communities across the globe and saying the US is bloody wonderful and the UK is shite is just wrong.

start doing some simple google searches (suggested search terms MRSA death UK USA) before posting #######.

Edited October 21, 2007 by Widge