Income - for sponsor on I-864

[sroberts3000 0]

Hey, my wife (I-184 primary sponsor) does not have enough income to sponsor me to come to the US, we have a joint sponsor. No questions about this part, just to get you up to speed. Here is the question.

She has been working in Canada for many years, her IRS filings all say $0 as her earnings have been foreign income exempt. So, when she is filling out "part 6. #23" on the I-864, does she report $0 (as her IRS file says) or does she report her actual Canadian income that was exempt. We know she cannot use it to meet the sponsor standard of support, this is simply a question on how to fill out the form properly. In #25, we reported 0, as that is what was filed with the IRS. So is that what we also put in section #23??

Like wise in section 24, which refers to my income (the immigrant), since it cannot be used to meet the poverty standard (since it is foreign income and not carrying over to the US) do I even need to report it? Or do I enter 0? Or do I actually report my Canadian income???

I am confused and the "detailed" instructions don't give the answer. It simply asks for my current income, as it does my wife's in section 23, so maybe just reporting our Canadian income is what we are to do. I don't know!!!

Anyone able to answer this or point me in the right direction.

SR

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

Hey, my wife (I-184 primary sponsor) does not have enough income to sponsor me to come to the US, we have a joint sponsor. No questions about this part, just to get you up to speed. Here is the question.

She has been working in Canada for many years, her IRS filings all say $0 as her earnings have been foreign income exempt. So, when she is filling out "part 6. #23" on the I-864, does she report $0 (as her IRS file says) or does she report her actual Canadian income that was exempt. We know she cannot use it to meet the sponsor standard of support, this is simply a question on how to fill out the form properly. In #25, we reported 0, as that is what was filed with the IRS. So is that what we also put in section #23??

Like wise in section 24, which refers to my income (the immigrant), since it cannot be used to meet the poverty standard (since it is foreign income and not carrying over to the US) do I even need to report it? Or do I enter 0? Or do I actually report my Canadian income???

I am confused and the "detailed" instructions don't give the answer. It simply asks for my current income, as it does my wife's in section 23, so maybe just reporting our Canadian income is what we are to do. I don't know!!!

Anyone able to answer this or point me in the right direction.

SR

I always thought that foreign income was not reportable on the I-864 if it is not reportable to the IRS. You could try to put it down on the form but some people have gone to their interview and had it disallowed. For the IRS I don't remember what the rule is exactly but it had to do with your location of domicile. I sure someone in this forum or elsewhere in VJ must know the answer, sorry I couldn't be of more help.

[trailmix 77]

Hi SR,

25. Federal income tax return information.

She should fill out the Canadian Gross income converted to U.S. dollars (it needs to match her earnings reported on her 1040) - here is a good reference, on the London Embassy website to the 'unofficial' exchange rates for the last 10 years: IRS - Unofficial Exchange Rates 1996/2006

Just so you know the IRS doesn't provide any 'official' exchange rate - they don't seem too concerned about which one you use from what I could tell, I used XE.com.

23. My current individual annual income is:

Enter your current individual earned or retirement annual income that you are using to meet the requirements of this form and indicate the total on this line.

Now for this question I entered zero, but I wasn't working at the time - but I also entered n/a for my Husband's (Canadian) income. The way I read this - with the item about 'using to meet the requirements of this form' - I would enter zero, because as you have already mentioned her/your income doesn't really count.

The reason I know the answer to #25 is that I got an RFE for it. I too thought as you did and I put zero for income. They told me the figures must match the gross income on the 1040.

You have probably noticed in the instructions that they specifically tell you not to include a copy of your foreign tax return. In that same RFE they requested my Canadian return for 2006 - I would recommend you have that with your I-864 as well. I have heard of a few others who had to submit this as well (granted we are going through NVC and you aren't - but I'm sure you have a copy so it can't hurt to have it handy - even a copy of the assessment for 06).

Hope this helps.

Edited October 11, 2007 by trailmix

[bradcanuck 1]

Trailmix... you're getting good at this. Sheesh I have a feeling the USCIS should be hiring us to process from now on, we know EVERY in and out!!! lol

[sroberts3000 0]

Trailmix, thanks for the reply, very helpful. However, if I filled out her IRS 1040 correctly, you list her income (say 20,000), then you enter the foreign income exemption wich is exactly equal to (20,000) which makes her gross income 0. Anyway, short version is that her gross income is listed as 0 on her IRS form, so that is what should go on #25 on the I-864 if I am following your reasoning.

We are waiting for word back any day from IRS to see if we filled the forms out properly, so I still have time (as we do not have an interview date yet) to fill out the I-864 when we hear back from the IRS. If we don't hear from them before the interview we will just take the photocopy of the 1040 we made and enter 0.

Thanks again for the help. Hope that all made sense.

SR

[IR5FORMUMSIE 850]

Trailmix, thanks for the reply, very helpful. However, if I filled out her IRS 1040 correctly, you list her income (say 20,000), then you enter the foreign income exemption wich is exactly equal to (20,000) which makes her gross income 0. Anyway, short version is that her gross income is listed as 0 on her IRS form, so that is what should go on #25 on the I-864 if I am following your reasoning.

We are waiting for word back any day from IRS to see if we filled the forms out properly, so I still have time (as we do not have an interview date yet) to fill out the I-864 when we hear back from the IRS. If we don't hear from them before the interview we will just take the photocopy of the 1040 we made and enter 0.

Thanks again for the help. Hope that all made sense.

SR

SR, I agree with your analysis like I posted above but I hope for your sake that Trailmix is correct.

Brad, in many cases the people of VJ do know more than the USCIS folks which is just a bit more than troubling.

[trailmix 77]

Trailmix, thanks for the reply, very helpful. However, if I filled out her IRS 1040 correctly, you list her income (say 20,000), then you enter the foreign income exemption wich is exactly equal to (20,000) which makes her gross income 0. Anyway, short version is that her gross income is listed as 0 on her IRS form, so that is what should go on #25 on the I-864 if I am following your reasoning.

Hi SR,

It's funny, I should have worded it differently and the reason why it is funny is that I had this same conversation with the NVC - they kept saying - you put in zero but you have to put in the total income and I kept saying (like 3 times) - the 'total income' is zero because of the foreign income exemption. etc (she kept telling me the line number, I kept saying it's zero haha)

I finally understood what she was getting at when she said 'the earnings on your I-864 must match what is on your 1040'. So technically it is Gross Income but on the 1040 it is (for 2006) line 21 as opposed to line 22. Now of course, because of the foreign credit, line 21 is a negative number - just put it in as a 'reg' number on the I-864.

If she had any other income, like RRSP income for instance, you need to add it in as well (as it also appears on your 1040). So for instance for the I-864 for the 2006 tax year I put something like this:

2006: 30,000 U.S. *

* 25678.00 Salary and 4322.00 RRSP withdrawal

I actually put that little note at the bottom of that section so they would be able to see where I got my numbers from easily.

Edited October 12, 2007 by trailmix

[trailmix 77]

One question for your SR,

Since you are filing DCF - at what point do you give the I-864 to Montreal?

Edited October 12, 2007 by trailmix

[sroberts3000 0]

One question for your SR,

Since you are filing DCF - at what point do you give the I-864 to Montreal?

Sorry Trailmix, I was just reviewing this and realized you had asked me a couple of questions a couple of weeks ago and I missed it.

With a DCF filing you take the I-864 with you to your interview.

I have a few more questions about the form if you are up to it.

SR

[Toshiya 0]

Trailmix, thanks for the reply, very helpful. However, if I filled out her IRS 1040 correctly, you list her income (say 20,000), then you enter the foreign income exemption wich is exactly equal to (20,000) which makes her gross income 0. Anyway, short version is that her gross income is listed as 0 on her IRS form, so that is what should go on #25 on the I-864 if I am following your reasoning.

Hi SR,

It's funny, I should have worded it differently and the reason why it is funny is that I had this same conversation with the NVC - they kept saying - you put in zero but you have to put in the total income and I kept saying (like 3 times) - the 'total income' is zero because of the foreign income exemption. etc (she kept telling me the line number, I kept saying it's zero haha)

I finally understood what she was getting at when she said 'the earnings on your I-864 must match what is on your 1040'. So technically it is Gross Income but on the 1040 it is (for 2006) line 21 as opposed to line 22. Now of course, because of the foreign credit, line 21 is a negative number - just put it in as a 'reg' number on the I-864.

If she had any other income, like RRSP income for instance, you need to add it in as well (as it also appears on your 1040). So for instance for the I-864 for the 2006 tax year I put something like this:

2006: 30,000 U.S. *

* 25678.00 Salary and 4322.00 RRSP withdrawal

I actually put that little note at the bottom of that section so they would be able to see where I got my numbers from easily.

Trailmix: I have a clarifiying question. So, for purposes of the I-864, when you have excluded ALL foreign earned income on your 1040, you should report 0 gross income? this applies to question 25, where they ask you for "total income" for the past three years?

Edited November 2, 2007 by Toshiya

[trailmix 77]

I have a few more questions about the form if you are up to it.

SR

Absolutely SR, fire away.

And Toshiya, I answered you in your other post, let me know if you need further clarification