Universal Health Coverage --- Call It Socialized Medicine

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

have you even read all the posts in this thread??

I asked that on the last page (#208)!

When you have posts like these.

I have read the posts but did not really respond earlier on. Especially to the posts like Canada having a better heath service.

What is wrong with post #214?

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

i just dont understand the train of thought really...to me its just logic...if we have public schools, that means that everyone who lives in america, regardless of economic status, is entitled to have an education...how come the same logic does not apply to healthcare? i dont think it takes much common sense to see why everyone having healthcare should be considered a right as a citizen of the richest country in the world...

the 'not having a choice of which care id receive' argument is nonsense, because the same thing applies to school...everyone should be covered, but there will always be people who will feel that they deserve better than the minimum...these people could then purchase private healthcare, kinda like having your kids go to private rather than public school...even the system i just described is not perfect, but far better than the system that we have in place now...

people complain about being taxed too much, but honestly theres not much of a difference between the average percentage of income tax in the united states and in countries that have socialized medicine...look it up, i dare you...in some cases, people in other countries actually pay less than we do, and they get more...maybe people wouldnt be so opposed to taxation if our government would actually show citizens what it is they are paying for...the reason people hate higher taxes is often because they dont think that they will be seeing the benefits of doing so...wed rather spend our tax money on war than on providing medicine for the lower class

Okay, I want you to buy me a house, I would also like you to buy my food, maybe you could throw in a BMW while your at it. Oh by the way my kids need some clothes too.

Now that your takin care of me, I think I'm gonna quit my job monday.

sorry it took me so long to reply, i havent had time to check up lately...

you didnt even rebut a single thing i have said, you just made me out to be a communist, which is not the case...took the easy way out

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

i just dont understand the train of thought really...to me its just logic...if we have public schools, that means that everyone who lives in america, regardless of economic status, is entitled to have an education...how come the same logic does not apply to healthcare? i dont think it takes much common sense to see why everyone having healthcare should be considered a right as a citizen of the richest country in the world...

the 'not having a choice of which care id receive' argument is nonsense, because the same thing applies to school...everyone should be covered, but there will always be people who will feel that they deserve better than the minimum...these people could then purchase private healthcare, kinda like having your kids go to private rather than public school...even the system i just described is not perfect, but far better than the system that we have in place now...

people complain about being taxed too much, but honestly theres not much of a difference between the average percentage of income tax in the united states and in countries that have socialized medicine...look it up, i dare you...in some cases, people in other countries actually pay less than we do, and they get more...maybe people wouldnt be so opposed to taxation if our government would actually show citizens what it is they are paying for...the reason people hate higher taxes is often because they dont think that they will be seeing the benefits of doing so...wed rather spend our tax money on war than on providing medicine for the lower class

Okay, I want you to buy me a house, I would also like you to buy my food, maybe you could throw in a BMW while your at it. Oh by the way my kids need some clothes too.

Now that your takin care of me, I think I'm gonna quit my job monday.

sorry it took me so long to reply, i havent had time to check up lately...

you didnt even rebut a single thing i have said, you just made me out to be a communist, which is not the case...took the easy way out

Why would I try to rebut something that you dont understand?

[no name 1]

have you even read all the posts in this thread??

I asked that on the last page (#208)!

When you have posts like these.

I have read the posts but did not really respond earlier on. Especially to the posts like Canada having a better heath service.

What is wrong with that?

Your replies in general have already been said or suggest you didn't read earlier, hence my question earlier.

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

i just dont understand the train of thought really...to me its just logic...if we have public schools, that means that everyone who lives in america, regardless of economic status, is entitled to have an education...how come the same logic does not apply to healthcare? i dont think it takes much common sense to see why everyone having healthcare should be considered a right as a citizen of the richest country in the world...

the 'not having a choice of which care id receive' argument is nonsense, because the same thing applies to school...everyone should be covered, but there will always be people who will feel that they deserve better than the minimum...these people could then purchase private healthcare, kinda like having your kids go to private rather than public school...even the system i just described is not perfect, but far better than the system that we have in place now...

people complain about being taxed too much, but honestly theres not much of a difference between the average percentage of income tax in the united states and in countries that have socialized medicine...look it up, i dare you...in some cases, people in other countries actually pay less than we do, and they get more...maybe people wouldnt be so opposed to taxation if our government would actually show citizens what it is they are paying for...the reason people hate higher taxes is often because they dont think that they will be seeing the benefits of doing so...wed rather spend our tax money on war than on providing medicine for the lower class

Okay, I want you to buy me a house, I would also like you to buy my food, maybe you could throw in a BMW while your at it. Oh by the way my kids need some clothes too.

Now that your takin care of me, I think I'm gonna quit my job monday.

sorry it took me so long to reply, i havent had time to check up lately...

you didnt even rebut a single thing i have said, you just made me out to be a communist, which is not the case...took the easy way out

Why would I try to rebut something that you dont understand?

you did it again, charming really...

i prefer to argue points rather than painting a nasty picture (ie: being stupid or communist) of those who dont agree

[Empress of Groovy 373]

I have to hand it to you, Gary--you certainly get people engaged! B)

[GaryC 7]

I have to hand it to you, Gary--you certainly get people engaged! B)

I respect everyones point of view whether I agree or not. There have been a lot of good suggestions here mixed in with the flames. Now we just need to get the lawmakers to debate them rather than the all-or-nothing UHC ideas.

[Heracles 417]

What is wrong with that?

Your replies in general have already been said or suggest you didn't read earlier, hence my question earlier.

It would be silly to go back and reply to stuff posted many pages ago.

[no name 1]

What is wrong with that?

Your replies in general have already been said or suggest you didn't read earlier, hence my question earlier.

It would be silly to go back and reply to stuff posted many pages ago.

So you re-post it pages later so the cycle continues...? riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

i just dont understand the train of thought really...to me its just logic...if we have public schools, that means that everyone who lives in america, regardless of economic status, is entitled to have an education...how come the same logic does not apply to healthcare? i dont think it takes much common sense to see why everyone having healthcare should be considered a right as a citizen of the richest country in the world...

the 'not having a choice of which care id receive' argument is nonsense, because the same thing applies to school...everyone should be covered, but there will always be people who will feel that they deserve better than the minimum...these people could then purchase private healthcare, kinda like having your kids go to private rather than public school...even the system i just described is not perfect, but far better than the system that we have in place now...

people complain about being taxed too much, but honestly theres not much of a difference between the average percentage of income tax in the united states and in countries that have socialized medicine...look it up, i dare you...in some cases, people in other countries actually pay less than we do, and they get more...maybe people wouldnt be so opposed to taxation if our government would actually show citizens what it is they are paying for...the reason people hate higher taxes is often because they dont think that they will be seeing the benefits of doing so...wed rather spend our tax money on war than on providing medicine for the lower class

Okay, I want you to buy me a house, I would also like you to buy my food, maybe you could throw in a BMW while your at it. Oh by the way my kids need some clothes too.

Now that your takin care of me, I think I'm gonna quit my job monday.

sorry it took me so long to reply, i havent had time to check up lately...

you didnt even rebut a single thing i have said, you just made me out to be a communist, which is not the case...took the easy way out

Why would I try to rebut something that you dont understand?

you did it again, charming really...

i prefer to argue points rather than painting a nasty picture (ie: being stupid or communist) of those who dont agree

Your use of the school system as a comparison is kind of silly really. Last I heard the public school system was a mess. Let alone the education is k thru 12 not cradle to grave. I guess college should be paid for too.Right? After the college is taken care of, we apply for a job that has a crappy or no healthcare plan offered. I would advise NOT to even apply for a job that doesnt pass muster for what you need.

[Trompe le Monde 1,107]

Your use of the school system as a comparison is kind of silly really. Last I heard the public school system was a mess. Let alone the education is k thru 12 not cradle to grave. I guess college should be paid for too.Right? After the college is taken care of, we apply for a job that has a crappy or no healthcare plan offered. I would advise NOT to even apply for a job that doesnt pass muster for what you need.

All public universities receive state money - so if you go to a state university you are being partially funded by the state in addition to the tuition you pay.

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

Your use of the school system as a comparison is kind of silly really. Last I heard the public school system was a mess. Let alone the education is k thru 12 not cradle to grave. I guess college should be paid for too.Right? After the college is taken care of, we apply for a job that has a crappy or no healthcare plan offered. I would advise NOT to even apply for a job that doesnt pass muster for what you need.

All public universities receive state money - so if you go to a state university you are being partially funded by the state in addition to the tuition you pay.

You said it not me. Partially.

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

Your use of the school system as a comparison is kind of silly really. Last I heard the public school system was a mess. Let alone the education is k thru 12 not cradle to grave. I guess college should be paid for too.Right? After the college is taken care of, we apply for a job that has a crappy or no healthcare plan offered. I would advise NOT to even apply for a job that doesnt pass muster for what you need.

do you think that k-12 should be privately funded as well? i didnt say that there isnt room for improvement as far as public education goes, but that certainly doesnt mean that it should be abolished. college tuition in this country is outrageous...its silly to deny that fact. minus the few who get full scholarships, you either come from a super rich family and have no problem paying for it, or go thousands of dollars into debt in order to pay for it with loans. how come other countries can manage to budget these things for their citizens (ie: affordable college education for all), yet we cannot? might want to look at what we actually are spending our money on and whether or not it is beneficial to the bulk of american citizens. i know someone will want to argue 'oh, but american schools are better than foreign universities'...if you do the research, you will find that besides hardvard, yale and the like, that is not true...there are a handful of universities in this country that even hold up when compared those of other nations, and those schools are more or less reserved for legacies and people who buy their way in...pretty sweet, dont ya think?

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

Your use of the school system as a comparison is kind of silly really. Last I heard the public school system was a mess. Let alone the education is k thru 12 not cradle to grave. I guess college should be paid for too.Right? After the college is taken care of, we apply for a job that has a crappy or no healthcare plan offered. I would advise NOT to even apply for a job that doesnt pass muster for what you need.

do you think that k-12 should be privately funded as well? i didnt say that there isnt room for improvement as far as public education goes, but that certainly doesnt mean that it should be abolished. college tuition in this country is outrageous...its silly to deny that fact. minus the few who get full scholarships, you either come from a super rich family and have no problem paying for it, or go thousands of dollars into debt in order to pay for it with loans. how come other countries can manage to budget these things for their citizens (ie: affordable college education for all), yet we cannot? might want to look at what we actually are spending our money on and whether or not it is beneficial to the bulk of american citizens. i know someone will want to argue 'oh, but american schools are better than foreign universities'...if you do the research, you will find that besides hardvard, yale and the like, that is not true...there are a handful of universities in this country that even hold up when compared those of other nations, and those schools are more or less reserved for legacies and people who buy their way in...pretty sweet, dont ya think?

Then why did you use it as your model? I never said anything about the price of college. I love the judgement about being "super rich". All your comments show, that the class envy the liberals feed us has taken hold of you. Everything in your statement wreaks of, "I CANT".

[Empress of Groovy 373]

I don't think a comparison between taxpayer-funded health care and education is silly. They are quite different services, of course, but at the root of the comparison is the philosophy that both are crucial to a civilized society, so various levels of government should ensure that all citizens have access to both. Society as a whole benefits from an (at least somewhat) educated population. The same goes for a healthy population. It is true that K-12 education in the U.S. has myriad problems, which are largely based in how it is financed and its use of antiquated teaching methods that haven't changed in 150 years (but that's another topic!). The point is, education is seen as crucial, so it is compulsory, and all children must attend school in some form regardless of income. By this philosophy, health care, which is also crucial, should be treated similarly. This argument has to do with a society's ideas about providing services to all that ultimately benefit all. How this philosophy can be put into practice equitably, of course, is the basis for the strong feelings on both sides.