9/11 Is Over

[Geist 0]

'bout time you joined the rest of us, Mr. Friedman.

[GaryC 7]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

[pedroh 21]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

supposedly terrorists, there's a bunch of guys that are held there, and the US says they're terrorists, but how can they prove it if they can't even go to trial for it?

[rclouse 0]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

supposedly terrorists, there's a bunch of guys that are held there, and the US says they're terrorists, but how can they prove it if they can't even go to trial for it?

THIS.

[GaryC 7]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

supposedly terrorists, there's a bunch of guys that are held there, and the US says they're terrorists, but how can they prove it if they can't even go to trial for it?

Yeah, the US is just grabbing innocent people off the streets and busting their nuts for no good reason. You want to give them lawyers and due process. They are not in America and they are not Americans. They don't rate those privilege's. They are terrorists captured on the battle field. Last time I looked the only trial a prisoner of war rated was war crimes trials. Other than that they are just held until the war is over.

[Ban Hammer 13,641]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

supposedly terrorists, there's a bunch of guys that are held there, and the US says they're terrorists, but how can they prove it if they can't even go to trial for it?

Yeah, the US is just grabbing innocent people off the streets and busting their nuts for no good reason. You want to give them lawyers and due process. They are not in America and they are not Americans. They don't rate those privilege's. They are terrorists captured on the battle field. Last time I looked the only trial a prisoner of war rated was war crimes trials. Other than that they are just held until the war is over.

or they can try them as a spy and summarily execute them since they are not wearing a uniform........

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

Yeah, the US is just grabbing innocent people off the streets and busting their nuts for no good reason.

actually, that does happen...heres the thing, i think you and i both know that the 'battle fields' in this war are the streets...i watched a documentary on gitmo, and it was about three twenty-something brits who were of pakistani decent...they were visiting pakistan because they had family there and one of the kids had fallen in love with a pakistani girl and wanted to go get married there as well...while they were in pakistan, they caught wind of some bombings that had occured in afghanistan, they wanted to help out the victims, so they crossed the border...while they were there, more bombings occured and as a result, they were captured by american soldiers and transported to gitmo...they were tortured and held there for THREE YEARS...imagine if that happened to you...

if youre denying that innocent people are being harmed at gitmo then you are choosing to turn a blind eye

[almaty 19]

Gitmo is a national disgrace..

[MrsAmera 41]

They are not even considered prisoners of war because if they were there is a certain level of decency that is imposed. They are classified as "enemy combatants" for a reason - so that the rules regarding POW's do not have to be applied. So basically they have to standing, as citizens or as prisoners of war. Why can't the US just charge them, or let them go? Why does this state of limbo need to apply? That's my argument. If they are terrorists well heck call them that and be done with it but to hold innocent people, indefinetely with no charges and no standing of any sense is ridiculous.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Since the Afghanistan war 775 detainees who have been brought to Guantanamo, approximately 420 have been released. As of August 09, 2007, approximately 355 detainees remained at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. More than a fifth have been cleared for release but may have to wait months or years for their freedom because U.S. officials are finding it increasingly difficult to line up places to send them, according to Bush administration officials and defense lawyers. Of the roughly 355 still incarcerated, U.S. officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial and free the rest. ---- So that's not very good odds. They've held these people with no sense of knowing when they would be released, and like 5% of them are actual going to be charged with anything not to mention once they are cleared they are still stuck in the same facilities because the US has now blackened their name and can't send them back or anywhere else. It just doesn't seem to make much sense. Arguing that torture is an effective measure to "get information" is fruitless because there are people on both sides of the argument who have opposing opinions. It's not scientific because it's not something you can really ah "test?" Different people react differently. And anyone who thinks this kind of behavior is going to stop terror attacks is kidding themselves, it's this kind of behavior that incites it!!

Gitmo isn't about deterrence or even punishment. It's a prisoner of war camp where the most dangerous terrorists are held.

And I thought Bush specifically claims that these guys ain't POW's. As POW's they'd have certain protections that the Bushies are not granting those folks - 90% of which are quite obviously not the "hardened terrorists" that the Bushies seem to have you made believe they are. Unless you're saying that the Bush rightfully claims these are "the worst of the worst" and then willfully releases them again so they can do more harm to US interests. Can't have it both ways, Gary. Either they are the scum you say they are - then they should be charged and punished accordingly. Or they are not - then they should be released. The vast majority has been and is due to be released. Those were then held for years for nothing. Which doesn't serve the US interest in any way, shape or form.

It's always worth remembering the founding fathers. Ben Franklin said something along the lines that 'those that are willing to give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety'. Ben Franklin most certainly was much wiser a man than Bush and all of his cronies will ever be combined.

[mRx 16]

while they were in pakistan, they caught wind of some bombings that had occured in afghanistan, they wanted to help out the victims, so they crossed the border...while they were there, more bombings occured and as a result, they were captured by american soldiers and transported to gitmo...they were tortured and held there for THREE YEARS...imagine if that happened to you...

What if the "victims" that these Pakistanis were aiding were members of the Taliban? That would be considered aiding the enemy. Before you condemn US policy, take into account that there may be more to the story than your documentary revealed. Then again, if the documentary stated that possibility, then viewers may not sympathize as much for detainees. Documentaries persuade you to believe exactly what they want you to.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Documentaries persuade you to believe exactly what they want you to.

Like the Bush administration.

[Ban Hammer 13,641]

Documentaries persuade you to believe exactly what they want you to.

Like the Bush administration.

so the bush administration employs mikey moore?

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Documentaries persuade you to believe exactly what they want you to.

Like the Bush administration.

so the bush administration employs mikey moore?

They have their equivalent.