SSN run around

[RAS 0]

Hi all,

My fiancée arrived from China 11/24/05. We married 12/31/05. On 1/19/06, we went to Social Security Administration to apply for a SSN.

We had with us the following original, valid, unexpired documents;

Chinese passport

K-1 visa with 2/22/06 expiration date

I-94 with "A" number

Translated Chinese birth certificate

Chinese drivers license

California marriage license

Chinese Identification card

We did our homework, and were aware of the fact the DHS documents alone were adequate to prove age, identity and work authorization. We had used SS online to get info., and held an e-mail that stated what was necessary to obtain a SSN.

The Oceanside, CA. District SS Office insisted on sending my wife's Chinese birth certificate for a secondary translation, DESPITE our pointing out that it was unnecessary, AND that the official PRC notarized BC already contained an English translation. They would have none of that, and insisted they would send it for a translation. They gave us a letter indicating we were in on 1/19/06, and that if everything checked out with the translation, they would send us our SS card in about 4 weeks.

After 4 weeks, we began calling the SS District Office to follow-up. They refused to speak with me (since I was not the person who was applying for the card), and when my wife would call (and mind you, she's LEARNING English), they would instruct her to "wait longer."

After 7 weeks of waiting, I took off from work once again, and we visited the Oceanside SS Office. We were told the BC translation checked out, but unfortunately, my wife's K-1 visa was now expired, so they can't issue her a SSN. They instructed us to go to DHS and obtain I-765 (Authorization for Employment Document, $250 and who knows how long), or I-485 (Adjustment of Status, $395, 4-6 months wait.) Believe me, I was irritated. We did everything right, and even pointed out to SS their own rules for assigning a SSN for a K-1 visa. To make matters worse, the Oceanside District Office's manager (Kate Blum), maintained that "the social security office did everything it was required to do correctly", and blamed the situation on post-9/11 realities imposed by DHS.

We took this to the SSA regional level, where we were told "All I can say is that you did nothing wrong", and were advised to take our situation to the national level.

At the national level, after waiting a month, we were told that the Oceanside SSA District Office was wrong in sending my wife's Chinese BC for a translation, they regretted any inconvenience, and that an EAD or AOS are now required from DHS.

Inconvenience..... without the SSN, my wife cannot work, cannot obtain a CA drivers license, and can't be added to my auto insurance. And this was due to SSA not following their own rules!

What's happened to accountability? If we as applicants, trying to navigate the immigration laws legally unintentionally neglect one item or document, we pay the price of delays and fees. When the government errors... we also are expected to pay the price. What's up with that?

Would appreciate any suggestions you all might offer. Also, how long has it been taking to get I-485 approval?

If it wasn't this, it would be something else, right? Just seems that legal immigration processes have to work before turning attention to illegal immigrants.

Edited April 10, 2006 by RAS

[gag54611 1]

Seems like SSA did what I would have expected of them, except for the BC bit.

My wife applied for her SSN before we were married, and then we got her name changed after the EAD arrived. In your case, since you didn't apply until after you were married, you need to wait for the EAD. That's the rules I'm afraid.

G

[tjteru 0]

That's the real reason all these people are protesting....they don't want to have go through the trauma of dealing with Immigration process and its seemingly arbitrary interpretations. After what my wife and I went through at the Oceanside DMV on Friday, I can hardly blame them. Sounds like you really got screwed though. Hope the AOS goes a lot smoother for you. Ours took about 3 months, and my wife just got her Permanent Resident Card today.

You're almost there...just got to keep plugging away.

[I'm Gone 60]

Hi all,

My fiancée arrived from China 11/24/05. We married 12/31/05. On 1/19/06, we went to Social Security Administration to apply for a SSN.

We had with us the following original, valid, unexpired documents;

Chinese passport

K-1 visa with 2/22/06 expiration date

I-94 with "A" number

Translated Chinese birth certificate

Chinese drivers license

California marriage license

Chinese Identification card

We did our homework, and were aware of the fact the DHS documents alone were adequate to prove age, identity and work authorization. We had used SS online to get info., and held an e-mail that stated what was necessary to obtain a SSN.

The Oceanside, CA. District SS Office insisted on sending my wife's Chinese birth certificate for a secondary translation, DESPITE our pointing out that it was unnecessary, AND that the official PRC notarized BC already contained an English translation. They would have none of that, and insisted they would send it for a translation. They gave us a letter indicating we were in on 1/19/06, and that if everything checked out with the translation, they would send us our SS card in about 4 weeks.

After 4 weeks, we began calling the SS District Office to follow-up. They refused to speak with me (since I was not the person who was applying for the card), and when my wife would call (and mind you, she's LEARNING English), they would instruct her to "wait longer."

After 7 weeks of waiting, I took off from work once again, and we visited the Oceanside SS Office. We were told the BC translation checked out, but unfortunately, my wife's K-1 visa was now expired, so they can't issue her a SSN. They instructed us to go to DHS and obtain I-765 (Authorization for Employment Document, $250 and who knows how long), or I-485 (Adjustment of Status, $395, 4-6 months wait.) Believe me, I was irritated. We did everything right, and even pointed out to SS their own rules for assigning a SSN for a K-1 visa. To make matters worse, the Oceanside District Office's manager (Kate Blum), maintained that "the social security office did everything it was required to do correctly", and blamed the situation on post-9/11 realities imposed by DHS.

We took this to the SSA regional level, where we were told "All I can say is that you did nothing wrong", and were advised to take our situation to the national level.

At the national level, after waiting a month, we were told that the Oceanside SSA District Office was wrong in sending my wife's Chinese BC for a translation, they regretted any inconvenience, and that an EAD or AOS are now required from DHS.

Who did you contact at the national level and who responded to you? I would saying sending the BC for translation was a judgement call, because I'm sure they didn't figure it was going to take that long. The translation you had done wasn't done by an SSA authorized translator, so that wasn't an acceptable translation.

GN 00301.340 Authorized Translators Defined:

https://s044a90.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0200301340

The problem I see is that she waited too long for to apply. She had been here 56 days when she applied, so that only left 20 days, before SSA could no longer assign her an SSN based on the K-1 status.

However, at this point who's at fault is a moot point, since her K-1 status has expired and she needs an EAD card or I-551 stamp or card to be assigned am SSN. She will need to apply for an ITIN if she needs a number for you to file taxes.

[RAS 0]

We dealt with Annie White, SSA Associate Commissioner, Office of Public Inquiries, and it is she we eventually heard back from (however, SSA operates like a black-box, making it as difficult as possible to even identify with whom you are dealing.)

Foreign Document Translation policy is identified here:

https://s044a90.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx...33;opendocument

and specifically states:

Foreign Language Documents

Follow GN 00307.000 for the acceptability of foreign documents.

EXCEPTION: Do not verify a foreign document. Ask for other evidence of age and identity if there is any reason to suspect that the foreign document is fraudulent.

The following chart explains the steps to take if a document is in a foreign language.

If... Then ...

The applicant has no immediate need for an and the translation can be done promptly, or

Have the document translated by an authorized translator (see GN 00301.340) and

The foreign language document is the only evidence available.

Use the document as evidence.

NOTE: Do not retain document translations. Do not attach them to the SS-5 when forwarding it for microfilming.

The applicant has a pressing need for an SSN, and

Request other evidence.

Evidence other than the foreign language document is available.

Process the application without the foreign language document.

SSA screwed up, attempted to cover-up their screw-up, blamed it on post-9/11 realities (isn't EVERYTHING blamed on 9/11 now!?).... and we all pay the price.

[I'm Gone 60]

We dealt with Annie White, SSA Associate Commissioner, Office of Public Inquiries, and it is she we eventually heard back from (however, SSA operates like a black-box, making it as difficult as possible to even identify with whom you are dealing.)

Foreign Document Translation policy is identified here:

https://s044a90.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx...33;opendocument

and specifically states:

Foreign Language Documents

Follow GN 00307.000 for the acceptability of foreign documents.

EXCEPTION: Do not verify a foreign document. Ask for other evidence of age and identity if there is any reason to suspect that the foreign document is fraudulent.

The following chart explains the steps to take if a document is in a foreign language.

If... Then ...

The applicant has no immediate need for an and the translation can be done promptly, or

Have the document translated by an authorized translator (see GN 00301.340) and

The foreign language document is the only evidence available.

Use the document as evidence.

NOTE: Do not retain document translations. Do not attach them to the SS-5 when forwarding it for microfilming.

The applicant has a pressing need for an SSN, and

Request other evidence.

Evidence other than the foreign language document is available.

Process the application without the foreign language document.

SSA screwed up, attempted to cover-up their screw-up, blamed it on post-9/11 realities (isn't EVERYTHING blamed on 9/11 now!?).... and we all pay the price.

Did you speak with Annie White or get a form letter with her name on it?

I still say it was judgement call at the time the application was taken to have the document translated. Did you or your wife specifically state at the time the application was filed that she had a immediate need?

SSA will not assign an SSN if your status is expired or within 14 days of expiring and your wife was 20 days away from that happening at the time she filed. Even if the BC didn't need to be translated she still had to deal with the status verification and that could have ate up 20 days.

Not to say you and your wife did anything wrong, but if she had filed right after getting here she would probably now have an SSN.

[ChristinaM 0]

Also in reference to the OP, you made the point that without an SSN your wife can't work...

She can't work without an EAD either, and that's one of the documents which can be used to obtain an SSN.

It will fall into place, but the wheels of bureaucracy turn slowly.

[RAS 0]

The eventual reply from national SSA (Annie White) was not a form letter..... It specifically responded to the particulars of our situation, and acknowledged that Oceanside CA. SSA District Office blundered, and that they should not have sent out the BC for a secondary translation[/u]. In other words, it was not a judgement call... they failed to follow their own procedures.

Yes, we did indeed inform them that there was an immediate need for the SSN to be issued (this was also acknowledged in Annie White's responsive letter.) There's only so much mild protestation, and pointing out of correct policy that's tolerated in SSA offices.... what is a person to do when they insist they are REQUIRED to send out a BC for a secondary translation, and blame it on 9/11?

As far as waiting too long... my wife entered the U.S. on 11/24/05. We applied for a SSN on 1/19/06 (with all the necessary, valid, unexpired documents to issue a SSN.) While that left 20 days before the 76 day cut off point, and the normal processing should have taken two weeks. Working is not the only issue.... without a SSN, my wife can not apply for a CA drivers license. Without a CA drivers license, I can not add her to my auto policy (so even though she can drive with her valid Chinese license, we are in questionable territory should she be involved, God forbid, in an accident.) We had extra steps to take to apply for a tax payer ID number, and the tax return could not be electronically filed, so we're still waiting for our refund.

But I guess the point of my post was 1) to vent a bit, 2) to inform, so this might not happen to others, and 3) to seek feedback and shared experiences from ya'll. This has been much more satisfying then our experiences with DHS/SSA... Thank you!

Sometimes you're the windshield, and sometimes you're the bug.

[kaydee457 13]

Seems like SSA did what I would have expected of them, except for the BC bit.

My wife applied for her SSN before we were married, and then we got her name changed after the EAD arrived. In your case, since you didn't apply until after you were married, you need to wait for the EAD. That's the rules I'm afraid.

G

Minor point of clarification here. There's no problem with applying after marriage as long as there is sufficient time to obtain a SSN based on the K1 and the I-94.

My wife and I married within two weeks of her arrival and we applied after the marriage for the SSN. We got it in a matter of a couple of weeks.

The only point of contention was SSA employee insisted that the SSN could only be issued in her maiden name; this is not true either.

[I'm Gone 60]

While that left 20 days before the 76 day cut off point, and the normal processing should have taken two weeks.

If her status could be verified through SAVE she should have her SSN card within two weeks. If the G-845 needed to be sent to verify here status it's questionable that could have been completed within 20 days.

If this happens to another person at another office, they are going to be in the same situation as your wife, their status will be expired before things can be straightened out. As I have told people numerous times apply as soon as possible after getting here, since you never know what could happen.