Mistake costs illegal immigrant dishwasher $59,000

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

By this logic, if you fail to come to a complete, motionless stop at a stop sign, they should take away your drivers license? Are you free from sin? I highly doubt it.

We cannot punish by policy, only by law. If you mean that we need to educate the citizens of foreign countries as to all of our immigration laws and tax laws I think you will find that it would be a costly venture. How knowledgable are you of the tax and immigration laws of the Philippines? It is my opinion that Mr. Zapeta knew and understaood that he was breaking the law. He needs to be punished persuant to the laws and statutes that cover the issues at hand. No more, no less.

Until a law is changed or created to allow complete confiscation of all assets of an illegal alien in such situations we will just have to accept the penalty as provide by law.

Why don't you be the first kid on your block to draft a bill and submit it to your state legislature asking that this be done? Bitching about it here will not get the job done.

Apples and oranges. If I don't come to a complete stop and a cop sees me then I get a ticket. That is the penalty. This guy came here illegally, worked illegally and didn't pay taxes. He isn't entitled to keep his ill-gotten gains. If I were a drug dealer and got caught I would forfeit anything that I earned and have to give up any assets that I gained. The same applies here. We should make it policy to confiscate anything earned while they are here and use the money to enforce the immigration laws. And before some bleeding heart says that a drug dealer and an illegal alien isn't the same thing then remember that working without permission isn't the only law broken. Tax evasion, welfare fraud and ID theft go hand in hand with working illegally. To me they are criminals.

To you they may be criminals but your opinion does not mean a thing. Law is law. Policy is not law. When you can cite the laws that say what this man may be guilty of in any way closely resembles anti-drug laws, then I will shut my mouth and happily go away.

You seem to think you are better than this SOB. Running a stop sign is as illegal as crossing the border illegally. But since you're an American we'll only worry about it if you get caught. What a load of #######. You are already piling welfare fraud and ID theft onto this guys lists of crimes and from the information given that is not the case.

I do not have a bleeding heart for this guy. I just cannot tolerate ignorant people who think they know the laws and rush to judgement over issues they know nothing about. You are not even willing to let the legal process take its course before you throw the rope over the tree. You show little respect for the law.

Send him to trial, convict if appropriate, sentence as allowed by law. What is so hard to understand about this simple concept?

Not one of you "judges" have bothered to look up the US Code and other pertinent laws governing this case to see what he is actually guilty of and what the penalty guidelines are. Nope, let's just hang him from the nearest tree. A true American one and all!

You are my new hero.

That ignorant drivel makes him your hero? So sad. Running a stop sign is not the same as illegal entry. That's like comparing rape to sexual harassment in the workplace.

[Donna A 4]

lets not forget to make him pay 11 years of back EAD fees that he didnt pay.

[NavarreMan 10]

By this logic, if you fail to come to a complete, motionless stop at a stop sign, they should take away your drivers license? Are you free from sin? I highly doubt it.

We cannot punish by policy, only by law. If you mean that we need to educate the citizens of foreign countries as to all of our immigration laws and tax laws I think you will find that it would be a costly venture. How knowledgable are you of the tax and immigration laws of the Philippines? It is my opinion that Mr. Zapeta knew and understaood that he was breaking the law. He needs to be punished persuant to the laws and statutes that cover the issues at hand. No more, no less.

Until a law is changed or created to allow complete confiscation of all assets of an illegal alien in such situations we will just have to accept the penalty as provide by law.

Why don't you be the first kid on your block to draft a bill and submit it to your state legislature asking that this be done? Bitching about it here will not get the job done.

Apples and oranges. If I don't come to a complete stop and a cop sees me then I get a ticket. That is the penalty. This guy came here illegally, worked illegally and didn't pay taxes. He isn't entitled to keep his ill-gotten gains. If I were a drug dealer and got caught I would forfeit anything that I earned and have to give up any assets that I gained. The same applies here. We should make it policy to confiscate anything earned while they are here and use the money to enforce the immigration laws. And before some bleeding heart says that a drug dealer and an illegal alien isn't the same thing then remember that working without permission isn't the only law broken. Tax evasion, welfare fraud and ID theft go hand in hand with working illegally. To me they are criminals.

To you they may be criminals but your opinion does not mean a thing. Law is law. Policy is not law. When you can cite the laws that say what this man may be guilty of in any way closely resembles anti-drug laws, then I will shut my mouth and happily go away.

You seem to think you are better than this SOB. Running a stop sign is as illegal as crossing the border illegally. But since you're an American we'll only worry about it if you get caught. What a load of #######. You are already piling welfare fraud and ID theft onto this guys lists of crimes and from the information given that is not the case.

I do not have a bleeding heart for this guy. I just cannot tolerate ignorant people who think they know the laws and rush to judgement over issues they know nothing about. You are not even willing to let the legal process take its course before you throw the rope over the tree. You show little respect for the law.

Send him to trial, convict if appropriate, sentence as allowed by law. What is so hard to understand about this simple concept?

Not one of you "judges" have bothered to look up the US Code and other pertinent laws governing this case to see what he is actually guilty of and what the penalty guidelines are. Nope, let's just hang him from the nearest tree. A true American one and all!

You are my new hero.

That ignorant drivel makes him your hero? So sad. Running a stop sign is not the same as illegal entry. That's like comparing rape to sexual harassment in the workplace.

One more person trying to put words in my mouth. I never said it was the same. I said it was just as illegal. There is a huge difference. I do not expect a shoplifter to get the death penalty as a murderer might. But I do expect both of them to be charged with a crime. A rapist and a person who commits sexual harassment should both be charged with a crime. provided they have violated existing laws.

I find it astonishing that you consider adherence to our laws "ignorant drivel".

Edited September 30, 2007 by NavarreMan

[KarenCee 3]

Remember the Pilgrim and all those folks from Europe who came to the us and took this land from the Native american, at one point or another we were all ILLEGAL ALIEN, but we kill the indians the few left we put them on the worst part of the country under so call name (Reservation) most money comes from Gambling CASINO. So this guy came here in the search of a better life, just like those white folks who came here centuries ago, IF his money is not already been taxed, Tax the money and give him his due share, this is his hard working, long hours sweat, He didn't steal, or robbed people to get that money as such he's entitle to what is His.

Really, in all fairness, do not lump this illegal in the same sentence as the First Nation People.

So so true

[KarenCee 3]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

[Nagishkaw 510]

Remember the Pilgrim and all those folks from Europe who came to the us and took this land from the Native american, at one point or another we were all ILLEGAL ALIEN, but we kill the indians the few left we put them on the worst part of the country under so call name (Reservation) most money comes from Gambling CASINO. So this guy came here in the search of a better life, just like those white folks who came here centuries ago, IF his money is not already been taxed, Tax the money and give him his due share, this is his hard working, long hours sweat, He didn't steal, or robbed people to get that money as such he's entitle to what is His.

Really, in all fairness, do not lump this illegal in the same sentence as the First Nation People.

So so true

[NavarreMan 10]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

There is a very good chance that the empoyer not only knew he/she was hiring an illegal but from what was reported they also may have broken some of the tax and workers comp laws as well. We do not have all the evidence but it is hard to imagine that they did not know what was going on in this matter. An investigation will deliver the truth.

[NavarreMan 10]

There seems to be the notion that ya'll think that I have a soft heart for this guy. Not so. But when you start waving the "follow our laws" flag, that goes both ways. We must also follow our laws during the prosecution or he might walk just like OJ. Maybe they forget to read him his rights, maybe they perform illegal search and seizure. Out goes the case.

I personally think that child pornographers and rapists deserve to be buried to their necks and let the ants go to work. But that is not the law and it just isn't going to happen. So my opinion on the appropriate punishment doesn't matter. If I want it changed then I need to take the steps to get it changed. Bitching will do no good.

I can give you a ridiculous hypothetical for this situation:

Let's say that many years ago I was in desperate need of a job but I knew I could not get a decent job because I had no clothes for the interview. So I stole the clothes. I got the job and years later my photo is identified from the store camera.

1. I am guilty of shoplifting.

2. I have earned lots of money in the interim and bought a house and filled it with the usual house stuff.

3. When they come to arrest me for a misdemeanor charge do they get to confiscate my entire life?

4. Has the statute of limitations run out?

5. Does the punishment fit the crime?

These are all things to consider during the prosecution. If the job I got because of the suit was as a trafficker in drugs, then there are specific laws that allow for the confiscation of my material wealth earned as a result of the illegal activity. This law now applies to other criminal behavior as well. I do not believe there is any legal precedence for confiscating ones material wealth based on a misdemeanor charge of shoplifting. There may be but I am not aware of it.

A drug trafficker committed a crime every time drugs were bought or sold. My only crime was a one-time deal many years ago. Everyday I went to work was not a crime. Mr. Zapeta on the other hand was continually committing a crime by working illegally. He also appears to have committed several other crimes. Each aspect of Mr. Zapeta’s case must be looked at separately and as a whole. Did his employer tell him the law does not require him to pay taxes? Who knows? Does it make a difference? It might. Did he know that he entered the country illegally? Almost certainly. Should he be punished? If he is found guilty of violating our laws, yes.

We all agree that Mr. Zapeta needs to be punished, if proven guilty, for his alleged crimes. But please let the legal system take its course. There is too much “Springeresque” behavior as it is in today’s world. Trial by media and such. Do you remember Richard Jewell? He was tried and convicted by the media before the FBI dropped all charges against him and apologized profusely for his arrest for the Atlanta Olympic Park bombing.

I am definitely rambling here so I will leave this with two words: Due Process

They are extremely important words. We should all learn to honor and live by them.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

By this logic, if you fail to come to a complete, motionless stop at a stop sign, they should take away your drivers license? Are you free from sin? I highly doubt it.

We cannot punish by policy, only by law. If you mean that we need to educate the citizens of foreign countries as to all of our immigration laws and tax laws I think you will find that it would be a costly venture. How knowledgable are you of the tax and immigration laws of the Philippines? It is my opinion that Mr. Zapeta knew and understaood that he was breaking the law. He needs to be punished persuant to the laws and statutes that cover the issues at hand. No more, no less.

Until a law is changed or created to allow complete confiscation of all assets of an illegal alien in such situations we will just have to accept the penalty as provide by law.

Why don't you be the first kid on your block to draft a bill and submit it to your state legislature asking that this be done? Bitching about it here will not get the job done.

Apples and oranges. If I don't come to a complete stop and a cop sees me then I get a ticket. That is the penalty. This guy came here illegally, worked illegally and didn't pay taxes. He isn't entitled to keep his ill-gotten gains. If I were a drug dealer and got caught I would forfeit anything that I earned and have to give up any assets that I gained. The same applies here. We should make it policy to confiscate anything earned while they are here and use the money to enforce the immigration laws. And before some bleeding heart says that a drug dealer and an illegal alien isn't the same thing then remember that working without permission isn't the only law broken. Tax evasion, welfare fraud and ID theft go hand in hand with working illegally. To me they are criminals.

To you they may be criminals but your opinion does not mean a thing. Law is law. Policy is not law. When you can cite the laws that say what this man may be guilty of in any way closely resembles anti-drug laws, then I will shut my mouth and happily go away.

You seem to think you are better than this SOB. Running a stop sign is as illegal as crossing the border illegally. But since you're an American we'll only worry about it if you get caught. What a load of #######. You are already piling welfare fraud and ID theft onto this guys lists of crimes and from the information given that is not the case.

I do not have a bleeding heart for this guy. I just cannot tolerate ignorant people who think they know the laws and rush to judgement over issues they know nothing about. You are not even willing to let the legal process take its course before you throw the rope over the tree. You show little respect for the law.

Send him to trial, convict if appropriate, sentence as allowed by law. What is so hard to understand about this simple concept?

Not one of you "judges" have bothered to look up the US Code and other pertinent laws governing this case to see what he is actually guilty of and what the penalty guidelines are. Nope, let's just hang him from the nearest tree. A true American one and all!

You are my new hero.

That ignorant drivel makes him your hero? So sad. Running a stop sign is not the same as illegal entry. That's like comparing rape to sexual harassment in the workplace.

I have yet to see anyone here demonstrate that what he has said in legal terms is not accurate. You can chew on that and call it tobacco...the facts remain the same.

[nin 1]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

One way to lower illegal immigration: A strong incentive to make employers check that the name on the social security card matches the name of the person claiming it's his/her number. A hefty fine for every undocumented worker ever found to have been paid by said employer.

Social security number X need to match name Y, which need to match the name of the valid ID the person carries... And if person Y can't show an american birth certificate or passport (for those naturalized ones) to match name Y, ask to see a green card or EAD.

Y should not be deceased or live and work in umpteen other places at once. Nationwide database anyone? (Right, this infringes on our privacy...)

And make sure there's a way for people who DO want to do all those "jobs Americans won't do" to come here legally.

[NavarreMan 10]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

One way to lower illegal immigration: A strong incentive to make employers check that the name on the social security card matches the name of the person claiming it's his/her number. A hefty fine for every undocumented worker ever found to have been paid by said employer.

Social security number X need to match name Y, which need to match the name of the valid ID the person carries... And if person Y can't show an american birth certificate or passport (for those naturalized ones) to match name Y, ask to see a green card or EAD.

Y should not be deceased or live and work in umpteen other places at once. Nationwide database anyone? (Right, this infringes on our privacy...)

And make sure there's a way for people who DO want to do all those "jobs Americans won't do" to come here legally.

[Caladan 19]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

One way to lower illegal immigration: A strong incentive to make employers check that the name on the social security card matches the name of the person claiming it's his/her number. A hefty fine for every undocumented worker ever found to have been paid by said employer.

Social security number X need to match name Y, which need to match the name of the valid ID the person carries... And if person Y can't show an american birth certificate or passport (for those naturalized ones) to match name Y, ask to see a green card or EAD.

Y should not be deceased or live and work in umpteen other places at once. Nationwide database anyone? (Right, this infringes on our privacy...)

And make sure there's a way for people who DO want to do all those "jobs Americans won't do" to come here legally.

The trouble is that the current law has a lot of ways for the employer to get out of responsibility. In some ways, this is fair; the guy making $10 an hour as an assistant manager at McDonald's should not be tasked with immigration enforcement! But the end result is that if the paperwork looks more or less official, the employer has to accept it, and if the number bounces, they're supposed to just ask for the paperwork again. So the restaurants that hired the dude might technically have done everything they needed to under the law.

The trouble with making a stricter law is that absent a clear and easy way for the employer to verify someone's work status, all cracking down will do is either a) catch legally here, married women, when the SSA office screws up their card after marriage or b ) lead straight to discrimination for anyone who has an accent and non-standard paperwork (like a legally present K-1.) I know the DMV can have access to a database that checks someone's legal presence with a few hours turn-around time; some thing similar for work authorization would be great.

[NavarreMan 10]

*raises hand* Just a thought here...and I think I've seen ONE post throughout this whole thread that even remotely mentioned this but....doesn't the EMPLOYER have some responsibility here for hiring an illegal? Didn't the employer break the law regarding the hiring of illegal immigrants? Or am I still asleep and seriously need another cuppa coffee this morning?

One way to lower illegal immigration: A strong incentive to make employers check that the name on the social security card matches the name of the person claiming it's his/her number. A hefty fine for every undocumented worker ever found to have been paid by said employer.

Social security number X need to match name Y, which need to match the name of the valid ID the person carries... And if person Y can't show an american birth certificate or passport (for those naturalized ones) to match name Y, ask to see a green card or EAD.

Y should not be deceased or live and work in umpteen other places at once. Nationwide database anyone? (Right, this infringes on our privacy...)

And make sure there's a way for people who DO want to do all those "jobs Americans won't do" to come here legally.

The trouble is that the current law has a lot of ways for the employer to get out of responsibility. In some ways, this is fair; the guy making $10 an hour as an assistant manager at McDonald's should not be tasked with immigration enforcement! But the end result is that if the paperwork looks more or less official, the employer has to accept it, and if the number bounces, they're supposed to just ask for the paperwork again. So the restaurants that hired the dude might technically have done everything they needed to under the law.

The trouble with making a stricter law is that absent a clear and easy way for the employer to verify someone's work status, all cracking down will do is either a) catch legally here, married women, when the SSA office screws up their card after marriage or b ) lead straight to discrimination for anyone who has an accent and non-standard paperwork (like a legally present K-1.) I know the DMV can have access to a database that checks someone's legal presence with a few hours turn-around time; some thing similar for work authorization would be great.

So the employer makes copies of the ID presented and states that "based on the presented identification, we hired the employee". I don't think we expect McDonald's to do a background check on a fry cook, just look at the applicants ID and verify that it looks legal. As for the other situations, I guess I would have to see what is required to be accepted as legal documentation by prospective employers. I have not been through the entire process yet so I guess whatever the temporary GC is or the GC itself should be adequate proof of eligibility to work. I would have to research this one to find if there is a definitive answer to this.

You are absolutely right in your concern that altering an existing law, or sometimes by creating a new one, can bring about unforeseen and sometimes troubling consequences. Look at the legalization of medical marijuana in California. It was meant to help those in real need and now any pothead with a quack doctor can pay a small exam fee and get a prescription for pot. The law was well intended but badly abused, and probably poorly written. And it is still in violation with federal law.

It is not an easy answer. If you require computer checks on these people I think you open the door to "Big Brother" and the amount of info the feds keeps in their computers on each of us. Tough call. Very interesting subject.

[GaryC 7]

They should take the money away from anyone working here illegally and use the money to enforce our immigration laws, period. I don't care if some here think I am heartless. I think those people are bleeding hearts. These people come here in violation of our laws, they work here in violation of our laws and do not deserve any sympathy at all. They should not gain by their illegal activities in any way. If this were done in every case we catch then a lot less people will be willing to take the risk to come here. That is one way to reduce the illegal problem. We should also fine the sh!t out of anyone that knowingly hires an illegal, for repeated offenses they should go to jail. It's time to get tough on this problem. We need to take back control of our border and to hell with those that think this isn't a big deal.

[KarenCee 3]

They should take the money away from anyone working here illegally and use the money to enforce our immigration laws, period. I don't care if some here think I am heartless. I think those people are bleeding hearts. These people come here in violation of our laws, they work here in violation of our laws and do not deserve any sympathy at all. They should not gain by their illegal activities in any way. If this were done in every case we catch then a lot less people will be willing to take the risk to come here. That is one way to reduce the illegal problem. We should also fine the sh!t out of anyone that knowingly hires an illegal, for repeated offenses they should go to jail. It's time to get tough on this problem. We need to take back control of our border and to hell with those that think this isn't a big deal.

Thank you Gary...you're one of the very few on this thread that has mentioned this.

IMHO if this one thing were seriously adhered to and it was considered a very serious offense for an employer to hire illegals, wouldn't the illegal worker issue become less of an issue? All I read on here is how illegals are hated, despised, whatever adjective you care to use. I've not seen much mentioned about the idiot employer who knowingly breaks the law and hires the illegal. It seems most of you have focused on the illegal immigrant part and forgotten that somebody here in the US hired him and this person is just as responsible, if not more so. Why aren't more of you angry as he!! about that!