As much as 500,000 people marching in Dallas for the rights of illegal immigrants

[*Robert* 2]

Thank you for the lesson on the 14th amendment Scott.

Now to get people to properly interpret it!

[Fischkoepfin 1]

...neither of which make much sense, but neither does giving citizenship to a baby born in the US to illegal immigrants!

This has been the law in the US since whenever! Are you saying it does not make sense and should be changed?

It doesn't make sense, but the problem is not with the law, but an incorrect interpretation of the law.

The 14th Amendment:

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

The 14th Amendment was intended to ensure that former slaves could not be denied citizenship. It was NOT intended to grant citizenship to the children of foreign nationals. The way the amendment has been interpreted ignores the phrase "and subject to the jurisdiction thereof." Children of aliens are subject to the jurisdiction of their parents' home countries.

The answer is not to change the law, but to properly interpret it.

Your interpretation doesn't fly because the law applies to the individual born in the US, not to his/her parents. Children born in the US are "subject to the jurisdiction thereof."

Btw, the citizenship rule is older than the 14th amendment and has been changed since. The fourteenth amendment while emphasizing a birth right to citizenship is primarily about equal protection of the law and a right to due process.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

Please consider that many of the illegal immigrants have children who are born in the US and are citizens. If you send these illegals packing, would you deport their citizen children as well?

So, are you suggesting that we also keep people that have broken other laws out of jail for the sake of their US citizen children not having to go to foster homes?

[kc456 0]

So, are you suggesting that we also keep people that have broken other laws out of jail for the sake of their US citizen children not having to go to foster homes?

Being an illegal immigrant is not a criminal offense (yet), although some (mostly republicans) would like to have this changed.

I'm surprised at the overall anti-(illegal)-immigrant sentiment here. Don't forget that anti-illegal-immigrant is pretty close in most people's mind to anti-immigrant in general. I don't think that being an illegal immigrant is a picnic. I was hoping to see more compassion on this board.

Your interpretation doesn't fly because the law applies to the individual born in the US, not to his/her parents. Children born in the US are "subject to the jurisdiction thereof."

Btw, the citizenship rule is older than the 14th amendment and has been changed since. The fourteenth amendment while emphasizing a birth right to citizenship is primarily about equal protection of the law and a right to due process.

[faith 0]

So, are you suggesting that we also keep people that have broken other laws out of jail for the sake of their US citizen children not having to go to foster homes?

Being an illegal immigrant is not a criminal offense (yet), although some (mostly republicans) would like to have this changed.

I'm surprised at the overall anti-(illegal)-immigrant sentiment here. Don't forget that anti-illegal-immigrant is pretty close in most people's mind to anti-immigrant in general. I don't think that being an illegal immigrant is a picnic. I was hoping to see more compassion on this board.

being an illegal immigrant is just that: ILLEGAL

[LibCampFireClub 635]

Many of the invasion marchers were carrying signs. Let's take a look at a few of them:

No human is illegal.

Quite right. Being a human is not illegal. Humans take actions that are illegal. Coming to this country and then staying here without abiding with our laws is illegal. Their actions are illegal.

Today we march. Tomorrow we vote!

And don't the Democrats know it! Why do you think Ted Kennedy and Hillary were in full pandering mode yesterday? Remember, there are movements in areas of Hispanic population concentration for giving non-citizens the vote in local elections. In New York City there are calls for allowing illegal aliens to vote. After the next amnesty agreement the pressure will be on to get these Hispanics, citizens and non-citizens, to the polls.

We are America.

You are NOT America, neither do you want to be. America is citizens and legal residents who recognize and appreciate our rule of law, and who make every effort to abide by those laws.

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

[Scott & Lai 12]

Many of the invasion marchers were carrying signs. Let's take a look at a few of them:

No human is illegal.

Quite right. Being a human is not illegal. Humans take actions that are illegal. Coming to this country and then staying here without abiding with our laws is illegal. Their actions are illegal.

Today we march. Tomorrow we vote!

And don't the Democrats know it! Why do you think Ted Kennedy and Hillary were in full pandering mode yesterday? Remember, there are movements in areas of Hispanic population concentration for giving non-citizens the vote in local elections. In New York City there are calls for allowing illegal aliens to vote. After the next amnesty agreement the pressure will be on to get these Hispanics, citizens and non-citizens, to the polls.

We are America.

You are NOT America, neither do you want to be. America is citizens and legal residents who recognize and appreciate our rule of law, and who make every effort to abide by those laws.

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

[bongogirl 0]

Many of the invasion marchers were carrying signs. Let's take a look at a few of them:

No human is illegal.

Quite right. Being a human is not illegal. Humans take actions that are illegal. Coming to this country and then staying here without abiding with our laws is illegal. Their actions are illegal.

Today we march. Tomorrow we vote!

And don't the Democrats know it! Why do you think Ted Kennedy and Hillary were in full pandering mode yesterday? Remember, there are movements in areas of Hispanic population concentration for giving non-citizens the vote in local elections. In New York City there are calls for allowing illegal aliens to vote. After the next amnesty agreement the pressure will be on to get these Hispanics, citizens and non-citizens, to the polls.

We are America.

You are NOT America, neither do you want to be. America is citizens and legal residents who recognize and appreciate our rule of law, and who make every effort to abide by those laws.

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

[anya-D 8]

Many of the invasion marchers were carrying signs. Let's take a look at a few of them:

No human is illegal.

Quite right. Being a human is not illegal. Humans take actions that are illegal. Coming to this country and then staying here without abiding with our laws is illegal. Their actions are illegal.

Today we march. Tomorrow we vote!

And don't the Democrats know it! Why do you think Ted Kennedy and Hillary were in full pandering mode yesterday? Remember, there are movements in areas of Hispanic population concentration for giving non-citizens the vote in local elections. In New York City there are calls for allowing illegal aliens to vote. After the next amnesty agreement the pressure will be on to get these Hispanics, citizens and non-citizens, to the polls.

We are America.

You are NOT America, neither do you want to be. America is citizens and legal residents who recognize and appreciate our rule of law, and who make every effort to abide by those laws.

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

So, are you suggesting that we also keep people that have broken other laws out of jail for the sake of their US citizen children not having to go to foster homes?

Being an illegal immigrant is not a criminal offense (yet), although some (mostly republicans) would like to have this changed.

My response was to your reasoning that innocent US citizen children would suffer if the gov't would crack down on illegals. All I am saying is that that's the way it is when the parents of kids break the law. The kids suffer. Criminal offense or not. By the way, those that illegally take up employment commit either ID theft and/or tax evasion which are both felony offenses as it is.

[Sister Fracas 5]

Many of the invasion marchers were carrying signs. Let's take a look at a few of them:

Excellent post...

[Traviesa 0]

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

Sorry, but no thumbs up from me on that one.

[Sister Fracas 5]

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

Sorry, but no thumbs up from me on that one.

so what is the correct term then for someone who continuously commits criminal acts?

[Traviesa 0]

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

Sorry, but no thumbs up from me on that one.

so what is the correct term then for someone who continuously commits criminal acts?

You call it whatever you want-but Javier's not a criminal. He has no criminal mind or mindset. When I talk to him he always tells me you never think of it as illegal what you're doing when you come over. It's not like, oh I'm going to go out and break the law today.

[Mr. Big Dog 10,747]

We are not criminals.

Yes you are. You violated the law when you crossed the border. You violated the law when you remained in this country. You violated the law when you obtained a job in this country. You continue to violate the law every day you are here. What is a criminal if not someone who violates the law? Deal with it ... you're criminals.

Sorry, but no thumbs up from me on that one.

so what is the correct term then for someone who continuously commits criminal acts?

You call it whatever you want-but Javier's not a criminal. He has no criminal mind or mindset. When I talk to him he always tells me you never think of it as illegal what you're doing when you come over. It's not like, oh I'm going to go out and break the law today.

Then what's all the fuzz about them living in fear? If they don't think they're braking any laws, then there's no reason to be afraid. And no reason to go to jail.