A military route to citizenship

[Ban Hammer 13,677]

These are NOT neutral terms. Imagine calling businessmen who once cheated on their taxes “illegal businessmen.” Imagine calling people who have driven over the speed limit “illegal drivers.” Is Tom Delay an “illegal Republican?”

and i suppose there is a problem with that? and tom is just a convict

[one...two...tree 2,762]

These are NOT neutral terms. Imagine calling businessmen who once cheated on their taxes “illegal businessmen.” Imagine calling people who have driven over the speed limit “illegal drivers.” Is Tom Delay an “illegal Republican?”

and i suppose there is a problem with that? and tom is just a convict

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way. I just don't see why some of you are so damned stubborn with this notion that being here illegally makes one a lawless individual. I think that's why you can get your head around the idea of granting citizenship to even those who volunteer for military service. I'm not sure how or why many of you have latched onto this flawed logic, but it really is at the heart of why you are so against illegal immigrants.

[BJZags 17]

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way.

I believe coming to America "illegally" isn't technically a criminal offense of much magnitude, simply results in deportation. So the fact that people are here "illegally" doesn't per se make them all criminals. Not allowing an "illegal" immigrant to serve in the military would be like not allowing me to serve because I got a speeding ticket once upon a time. Besides, America has a long tradition of non-citizens serving in the armed forces. Like many immigrants of his time, my grandfather served in WWI, and received citizenship after coming back from the war.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way.

I believe coming to America "illegally" isn't technically a criminal offense of much magnitude, simply results in deportation. So the fact that people are here "illegally" doesn't per se make them all criminals. Not allowing an "illegal" immigrant to serve in the military would be like not allowing me to serve because I got a speeding ticket once upon a time. Besides, America has a long tradition of non-citizens serving in the armed forces. Like many immigrants of his time, my grandfather served in WWI, and received citizenship after coming back from the war.

[Ban Hammer 13,677]

These are NOT neutral terms. Imagine calling businessmen who once cheated on their taxes “illegal businessmen.” Imagine calling people who have driven over the speed limit “illegal drivers.” Is Tom Delay an “illegal Republican?”

and i suppose there is a problem with that? and tom is just a convict

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way. I just don't see why some of you are so damned stubborn with this notion that being here illegally makes one a lawless individual. I think that's why you can get your head around the idea of granting citizenship to even those who volunteer for military service. I'm not sure how or why many of you have latched onto this flawed logic, but it really is at the heart of why you are so against illegal immigrants.

is it that easy to you, everyone who does not agree is xenophobic?

August 2007 - Mauro Cisneros, a Mexican illegal alien, who had been deported in March 2003, was arrested in Sheboygan, Wisconsin for endangering children. He was identified as a member of the California-based Sureno 13 gang with a record that includes an arrest in Nevada for kidnapping, in California for burglary and in Texas for robbery twice charged with felony drug offenses and convicted and sentenced to prison in cases filed in 1999 and 2002. (The Sheboygan Press, August 22, 2007)

August 2007 - Eddie Carbajal-Lile, a 27-year-old Mexican illegal alien, is being sought for the drunken driving death of a teenager in Wisconsin. (The Sheboygan Press, August 22, 2007)

August 2007 - Juan Felix Salinas, a Mexican illegal immigrant, was charged with intoxicated manslaughter for the deaths of a family of three in Houston, Texas. He had been previously arrested twice earlier in the year for assault and public intoxication, and in March had been arrested for domestic violence, but was released by posting a 'non-arrest' bond. (Houston Chronicle, August 21, 2007)

August 2007 - Israel Rivera Balderas, a 20-year-old Mexican illegal immigrant, is being sought for the gang-related shooting death of a teenager in Vallejo, California. Rivera pled in June 2005 no contest to felony second-degree robbery and received probation. In January 2006, his probation was revoked after he was charged as being a felon in possession of a firearm and carrying a concealed weapon, and he was deported to Mexico. (Times-Herald, August 18, 2007)

August 2007 - Jose Lachira Carranza, an illegal immigrant from Peru, was charged with the execution-style murder of three youth and the wounding of a fourth in New Jersey. He could have been turned over to federal immigration authorities after he was earlier arrested three times on criminal charges (one charge of aggravated assault and two of sexual assault). He was released on bail at the time of the murders. Five others, including two Nicaraguans, have also been arrested for the murders. (The New York Times, August 19, 2007)

August 2007 Manuel De Jesus Gonzalez-Geronimo, a Guatemalan illegal alien, surrendered a day after killing two construction workers and seriously injuring two others in a hit-and-run accident in Montgomery County, Maryland. He told police he ran because he “was scared and didn’t have a license.” (Washington Post, August 15, 2007)

August 2007 Alejandro Bautista, who admitted to entering the United States illegally from Mexico, was sentenced to 6 year in prison for criminal sexual assault and aggravated criminal sexual abuse against two teenage brothers. (Chicago Tribune, August 14, 2007)

August 2007 Jose Carranza, a Peruvian illegal alien, was charged with the execution-style shooting of four teenagers, three of whom were killed. Carranza had been indicted twice earlier in the year for sexual assault on a child and for a bar fight. He was free on bond, and immigration authorities had not been contacted in his case. Another suspect in the shootings, Rodolfo Godinez, reportedly obtained legal U.S. residence in 2001 despite a lengthy arrest record. (AP news in Washington Times, August 14, 2007)

August 2007 Alejandro Rivera Gamboa and Gilberto Arellano Gamboa, Mexican illegal immigrants, were charged with killing a teenage girl from Texas visiting in Oregon. Rivera Gamboa, who was in possession of an Oregon state ID, card had been arrested four times in Oregon since 2000 for drunken driving. Immigration authorities said they had never been contacted by Oregon authorities. (Associated Press Texas news, August 10, 2007)

August 2007 Rocca Mejia Cinto, a 19-year old Mexican illegal immigrant was apprehended in Pennsylvania after fleeing from New York City where he is accused of “a senseless act of violence” in the unprovoked stabbing death of a 44-year old father of two. Authorities speculated that Mejia Cinto’s action was provoked by his involvement in gang warfare. (Standard Speaker [Pa.], August 9, 2007)

July 2007 Nilssen Torres Paredes, an Ecuadorian illegal immigrant, pleaded guilty in New York to manslaughter for the drunken driving accident that killed two people when he struck a car while speeding and driving the wrong way. He had illegally reentered the United States after being deported in 1997 after a conviction on weapons charges. (Newsday, July 31, 2007)

July 2007 David Raigoza Franco, a 34-year-old illegal immigrant, was charged with criminally negligent homicide and drunk driving for an accident that killed his 8-year old daughter. He was using false identification, but was identified through his fingerprints to have a criminal record and outstanding warrants for arrest including for probation violation. (KTVB.com 7/24/07 and KRTV News, 7/25/07)

July 2007 Gilberto Cruz, an illegal alien, was convicted of first-degree murder for the shotgun slaying of his former girlfriend in Colorado. He commented at his trial (as translated), “If I knew how to use the shotgun, she wouldn’t have died in the street, she would have been dead in the house.”

July 2007 A 24-year old Mexican man was arrested in Arizona for entering the country illegally. He had been convicted in 2006 of child molestation in Florida and deported earlier this year.

July 2007 Marcelo Mota, a Brazilian illegal immigrant, was arrested in New Jersey on charges of serial rape and sexual assault in cases in the Boston and New York City areas dating back to at least 2003 to which he has confessed. He arrived in 2001 on a visitor’s visa and stayed illegally. (The Boston Globe, July 17, 2007)

July 2007 Jose Valenzuela, a Mexican, was arrested in Ohio for having returned following his deportation for having been convicted in 1998 of “gross sexual imposition involving a juvenile girl.” (The Dayton Daily News, July 11, 2007)

June 2007 Ricardo Contreras, an illegal alien crashed into two cars on I-40 in North Carolina while driving drunk. He had been deported twice before in 2004. (The NBC News Raleigh, June 6, 2007)

May 2007 Ezeiquiel Lopez, a Mexican illegal alien, shot and killed a Kenosha County Deputy Sheriff. He had been jailed for violent crimes twice before but not deported. (The Bloomberg News July 6, 2007)

November 2006 Diego Pillco, an illegal alien construction worker, killed actress Adrienne Shelly, the mother of a toddler, in New York and tried to make it look like a suicide. (The New York Daily News, November 7, 2006)

November 2006 Pastor Rios Sanchez, a Mexican illegal alien, was charged with the drunken driving death of three youths in North Carolina in October. He had been convicted in the state for driving without a license in 2005 and twice earlier in 2006. (The News Observer, November 7 2006)

October 2006 Pastor Rios Sanchez, a Mexican, killed three persons in a head-on collision while driving drunk in North Carolina. He was carrying a fake ‘green card’. (The Charlotte Observer, November 7, 2006)

September 2006 - Juan Leonardo Quintero, shot and killed a Houston police officer after being detained for speeding. Quintero, had been deported to Mexico in 1999 for molesting a 12-year-old girl. (World Net Daily, September 28, 2006)

June 2006 Dilfredy Rodriguez, a Cuban Mariel detainee released after a Supreme Court ruling against indefinite detention, who was shot dead after ramming a police car attempting to stop him for driving erratically while driving a stolen bus. (The Miami Herald, June 22, 2006)

June 2006 Nicolas Serrano, a Dominican, stabbed his girlfriend to death in Rockville, Maryland. In 1998 he was arrested for selling crack cocaine to police informants. He served four months in jail. He was convicted of a misdemeanor sex offense in Washington, DC in 2000 and later pled guilty in a federal drug case, but apparently was released for cooperating with the FBI. In 1997 he was charged with attempted murder of the same person he murdered in 2006. He was also charged with assault and battery by the mother of the victim. He was ordered deported in 2005 after charges of attempted murder were made against him, but he may not have been removed. (The Washington Post, June 6, 2006)

June 2006 Javier Rico, a Mexican, killed the mother of an 8-year old boy while driving drunk in Chicago. He had been convicted of DUI in 2005 and had jumped bail on still another DUI case. (The Chicago Tribune, June 1, 2006)

May 2006 Hugo Martinez, a Mexican illegal alien, murdered two women and attempted to murder a third in Nassau, New York all while high on crack cocaine. (Newsday, May 19, 2006)

February 2006 Domingo Esqueda, a Mexican illegal alien, crashed into and killed a California Highway Patrol officer on a motorcycle while driving drunk and without a license. (The Desert Dispatch, February 28, 2006)

November 2005 Jorge Humberto Hernandez-Soto was charged with involuntary manslaughter for killing a University of North Carolina female student by crashing into her while driving the wrong way on I-485 faster than 100 mph while drunk. He had been convicted twice before for DUI and had been removed from the United States 17 times. (The Charlotte Observer, November 22, 2005)

November 2005 Juan Lizcano, a Mexican who entered the country illegally in 2001, shot and killed a police officer in Dallas, Texas. He had been detained twice before by the police but immigration authorities had not been notified. (World Net Daily, November 28, 2005)

February 2005 Oswaldo Martinez, a Salvadoran illegal alien, raped a 16-year-old girl in James City, Virginia. A year earlier he had been arrested for drunk driving, and was found to be using a fake Social Security card. (The Virginia Gazette, February 26, 2005)

January 2004, David Diaz Morales, a Mexican illegal alien killed in her home an 18-year-old girl with whom he had worked in Austin, Texas. He had been detained two-years earlier for investigation of child molestation, but was released for insufficient evidence. (The Austin American Statesman, November 8, 2005)

October 2004 - Ricardo Cepates, a Honduran illegal immigrant, was found guilty of multiple cases of rape in New Jersey, including two of Rutgers university students between 2001 and 2003. In 1998, despite a deportation order, he was released on probation after pleading guilty to attacking a Brunswick woman on the street and holding a knife to her throat. (The Daily Targum, October 27, 2004)

link

[one...two...tree 2,762]

These are NOT neutral terms. Imagine calling businessmen who once cheated on their taxes “illegal businessmen.” Imagine calling people who have driven over the speed limit “illegal drivers.” Is Tom Delay an “illegal Republican?”

and i suppose there is a problem with that? and tom is just a convict

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way. I just don't see why some of you are so damned stubborn with this notion that being here illegally makes one a lawless individual. I think that's why you can get your head around the idea of granting citizenship to even those who volunteer for military service. I'm not sure how or why many of you have latched onto this flawed logic, but it really is at the heart of why you are so against illegal immigrants.

is it that easy to you, everyone who does not agree is xenophobic?

Nope. Just very dogmatic with a very narrow understand of crime and law. How many legal scholars have argued otherwise? Does Giuliani's opinion hold any weight for you? I just don't understand where this view came from. You've been around awhile...have you always believed that illegal immigrants in this country are lawless individuals?

[Ban Hammer 13,677]

These are NOT neutral terms. Imagine calling businessmen who once cheated on their taxes “illegal businessmen.” Imagine calling people who have driven over the speed limit “illegal drivers.” Is Tom Delay an “illegal Republican?”

and i suppose there is a problem with that? and tom is just a convict

Rudolph Giuliani, a former prosecutor and certainly not a 'softy' on crime, doesn't think illegal immigrants are criminals or that should be regarded that way. I just don't see why some of you are so damned stubborn with this notion that being here illegally makes one a lawless individual. I think that's why you can get your head around the idea of granting citizenship to even those who volunteer for military service. I'm not sure how or why many of you have latched onto this flawed logic, but it really is at the heart of why you are so against illegal immigrants.

is it that easy to you, everyone who does not agree is xenophobic?

Nope. Just very dogmatic with a very narrow understand of crime and law. How many legal scholars have argued otherwise? Does Giuliani's opinion hold any weight for you? I just don't understand where this view came from. You've been around awhile...have you always believed that illegal immigrants in this country are lawless individuals?

i've met a few who are/were illegal. the ones i've met are not what i'd trust around my house, that's for sure.

[Dan J 277]

The list of citizen lawbreakers is much much much longer, does that make citizens inherently lawless?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The list of citizen lawbreakers is much much much longer, does that make citizens inherently lawless?

...and this, Charles is why people bring up the issue of prejudice because you're saying there's a causality between their status here and being lawless in general when there is no rational basis for that argument.

[Ban Hammer 13,677]

The list of citizen lawbreakers is much much much longer, does that make citizens inherently lawless?

you tell me.

[peejay 327]

The list of citizen lawbreakers is much much much longer, does that make citizens inherently lawless?

That is so lame. As if it isn't obvious that there are more US citizens in the USA than illegal aliens.

[peejay 327]

This DREAM Act is the biggest self serving scam that the illegal alien cheerleaders have tried to shove up our arses so far.

Let's see...the illegal alien can choose 2 years in the military service in time of war...or they can choose 2 years of school at reduced in-state rates that they can get Federal loans to pay for.

Is this a no-brainer or what???? Any guesses as to the most popular option?

To attatch this kind of ####### to a military appropriations bill as pertaining to the military is so absurd it defies any kind of logical sense.

This is nothing more than pandering bullshit from the Democrats. Of course these illegal aliens with a fast track to US citizenship will vote Democratic in the 2008 elections.

I'm an independent voter and as far as I am concerned Durbin and the other sleazeballs that are pushing this self serving ####### can go to hell for stabbing the American people in the back and expecting us to shell out our tax dollars to fund this folly. Screw them and the jacka$$ they road into Washington on!

This lame legislation sucks big weenies.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

This DREAM Act is the biggest self serving scam that the illegal alien cheerleaders have tried to shove up our arses so far.

Let's see...the illegal alien can choose 2 years in the military service in time of war...or they can choose 2 years of school at reduced in-state rates that they can get Federal loans to pay for.

Is this a no-brainer or what???? Any guesses as to the most popular option?

To attatch this kind of ####### to a military appropriations bill as pertaining to the military is so absurd it defies any kind of logical sense.

This is nothing more than pandering bullshit from the Democrats. Of course these illegal aliens with a fast track to US citizenship will vote Democratic in the 2008 elections.

I'm an independent voter and as far as I am concerned Durbin and the other sleazeballs that are pushing this self serving ####### can go to hell for stabbing the American people in the back and expecting us to shell out our tax dollars to fund this folly. Screw them and the jacka$$ they road into Washington on!

This lame legislation sucks big weenies.

Your foam is showing and you're overlooking some minor details to proposal.

The Development, Relief, and Education for Alien Minors (DREAM) Act (S. 1545) introduced by Senator Orrin Hatch, (R-UT) provides immigration relief to young people who were brought to the U.S. as undocumented immigrant children, stayed in school, and kept out of trouble. In the House, a companion bill was introduced by Rep. Chris Cannon, (R-UT) called the Student Adjustment Act (H.R. 1684).

....

Each year about 65,000 U.S.-raised students who would qualify for the DREAM Act graduate from high school. These include honor roll students, star athletes, talented artists, homecoming queens, and aspiring teachers, doctors, and U.S. soldiers. Even though they were brought to the United States years ago as children, they face unique barriers to higher education, are unable to work legally in the U.S., and must live in constant fear of detection by immigration authorities.

Our immigration law currently has no mechanism to consider the special circumstances of such students. The DREAM Act would eliminate this flaw. It is un-American to indefinitely and irremediably punish them for decisions made by their parents years ago. By enacting the DREAM Act Congress would legally recognize what is de facto true: these young people belong here.

...

What the hell is your beef about that? Sen. Orrin Hatch...yeah, now there's a real lily livered liberal. Some of you are just being vacuous over any type of immigration reform.

[peejay 327]

This DREAM Act is the biggest self serving scam that the illegal alien cheerleaders have tried to shove up our arses so far.

Let's see...the illegal alien can choose 2 years in the military service in time of war...or they can choose 2 years of school at reduced in-state rates that they can get Federal loans to pay for.

Is this a no-brainer or what???? Any guesses as to the most popular option?

To attatch this kind of ####### to a military appropriations bill as pertaining to the military is so absurd it defies any kind of logical sense.

This is nothing more than pandering bullshit from the Democrats. Of course these illegal aliens with a fast track to US citizenship will vote Democratic in the 2008 elections.

I'm an independent voter and as far as I am concerned Durbin and the other sleazeballs that are pushing this self serving ####### can go to hell for stabbing the American people in the back and expecting us to shell out our tax dollars to fund this folly. Screw them and the jacka$$ they road into Washington on!

This lame legislation sucks big weenies.

Your foam is showing and you're overlooking some minor details to proposal.

The Development, Relief, and Education for Alien Minors (DREAM) Act (S. 1545) introduced by Senator Orrin Hatch, (R-UT) provides immigration relief to young people who were brought to the U.S. as undocumented immigrant children, stayed in school, and kept out of trouble. In the House, a companion bill was introduced by Rep. Chris Cannon, (R-UT) called the Student Adjustment Act (H.R. 1684).

....

Each year about 65,000 U.S.-raised students who would qualify for the DREAM Act graduate from high school. These include honor roll students, star athletes, talented artists, homecoming queens, and aspiring teachers, doctors, and U.S. soldiers. Even though they were brought to the United States years ago as children, they face unique barriers to higher education, are unable to work legally in the U.S., and must live in constant fear of detection by immigration authorities.

Our immigration law currently has no mechanism to consider the special circumstances of such students. The DREAM Act would eliminate this flaw. It is un-American to indefinitely and irremediably punish them for decisions made by their parents years ago. By enacting the DREAM Act Congress would legally recognize what is de facto true: these young people belong here.

...

What the hell is your beef about that? Sen. Orrin Hatch...yeah, now there's a real lily livered liberal. Some of you are just being vacuous over any type of immigration reform.

I don't think you understand that I don't give a rat's azz whether the slimeball politicians are cheap vote Democrats or cheap labor Republicans. All these sleazy bills like the DREAM Act, AgJobs, etc. are self serving schemes (scams) that are nothing more than sugar coated illegal alien amnesties that get buried in unrelated legislation so that it flies under the radar of the American people. This ####### would never survive in the scrutiny of daylight on its own or in the public forum.

The American people are sick and tired of accomodating and pandering to every illegal alien that floats across the Rio Grande with a hand full of gimme and a sense of entitlement. These people are entitled to nada!

Neither are these sleazy politicians. Has anybody woke up to the fact that these creeps have absolutely no intention of doing anything about illegal immigration? They pass toothless laws they refuse to enforce and pass out endless streams of amnesties followed by more broken promises.

#### 'em all along with the horses and inner tubes they rode in on! The American people are weary and wary of this #######. The DREAM Act sucks!

[smoke20 0]

What the hell is your beef about that? Sen. Orrin Hatch...yeah, now there's a real lily livered liberal. Some of you are just being vacuous over any type of immigration reform.

might that be because we don't need reform we need enforcement?