Islam: a Plan for World Domination?

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Dan Gemvita's post clearly mentions percentages that constitute a non-trivial minority. Minority, yes. But definitely non-trivial.

[Dan J 277]

true, but there are many motives in life for anything...the majority is what i write about.///

Read that report I linked, at least when it was written, the largest number of people joined to get collage paid for . Duty to ones country was down in the 10-15 percent range. That probably surged a bit after 9/11, but considering how badly the war has gone and the deception used to start it. I would bet that has dropped back to the levels they were before 9/11.

While previous generations may have put more weight on joining the military as a duty to the country or as part of a family tradition. That has since changed. Mis-using the military for political vendettas reduced the number of people joining the military as duty to ones country.

[almaty 19]

true, but there are many motives in life for anything...the majority is what i write about.///

Read that report I linked, at least when it was written, the largest number of people joined to get collage paid for . Duty to ones country was down in the 10-15 percent range. That probably surged a bit after 9/11, but considering how badly the war has gone and the deception used to start it. I would bet that has dropped back to the levels they were before 9/11.

While previous generations may have put more weight on joining the military as a duty to the country or as part of a family tradition. That has since changed. Mis-using the military for political vendettas reduced the number of people joining the military as duty to ones country.

good point brother dan... i stand corrected..

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I this context I think the term "Mercenary" applies more to private military contractors than regular service personnel.

Edited September 11, 2007 by Number 6

[DeadPoolX 9]

I'm curious...

Dan, you're saying that soldiers enlist in the armed forces, not because they wish to serve their country, but due to the benefits the military presents them with, correct? I just have to ask: are the benefits in the military really good enough to warrant risking your life over?

Sure, some of the soldiers are young, single men who're looking for a ticket straight to college, but most are there purely by choice and have families back home. Do you honestly believe that the men and women serving in the military wouldn't rather take a reduction in benefits if it meant never leaving their loved ones? How many people -- even if they're chosen profession is that of a soldier -- really want to be shot at or have explosions going on all around them or rarely get to sleep in anything resembling a comfortable bed?

The point I'm trying to make is that while the soldiers did make the choice to voluntarily enter our military (and therefore knew the risks), I highly doubt they did it purely for the pay or benefits. The risk just isn't worth it. Instead, I believe that those serving truly believe they are making a difference, which is why they joined in the first place.

After all, if all these individuals really cared about was the pay and benefits, then why join the military? There are tons of civilian jobs where you can make not only much more per year in salary, but have a far greater benefits package. Of course, jobs differ, depending on your field, position, level of education and overall experience, but... at least the men and women in question (who're being called "mercenaries") would get to see their families everyday, sleep in a real bed, and wouldn't normally have to worry about bullets whizzing by their head or bombs exploding right next to them on a daily basis.

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

true, but there are many motives in life for anything...the majority is what i write about.///

Read that report I linked, at least when it was written, the largest number of people joined to get collage paid for . Duty to ones country was down in the 10-15 percent range. That probably surged a bit after 9/11, but considering how badly the war has gone and the deception used to start it. I would bet that has dropped back to the levels they were before 9/11.

While previous generations may have put more weight on joining the military as a duty to the country or as part of a family tradition. That has since changed. Mis-using the military for political vendettas reduced the number of people joining the military as duty to ones country.

You aren't a vet.... are ya? I am. And it wasn't for the benefits.

[Dan J 277]

I'm curious...

Dan, you're saying that soldiers enlist in the armed forces, not because they wish to serve their country, but due to the benefits the military presents them with, correct? I just have to ask: are the benefits in the military really good enough to warrant risking your life over?

Sure, some of the soldiers are young, single men who're looking for a ticket straight to college, but most are there purely by choice and have families back home. Do you honestly believe that the men and women serving in the military wouldn't rather take a reduction in benefits if it meant never leaving their loved ones? How many people -- even if they're chosen profession is that of a soldier -- really want to be shot at or have explosions going on all around them or rarely get to sleep in anything resembling a comfortable bed?

The point I'm trying to make is that while the soldiers did make the choice to voluntarily enter our military (and therefore knew the risks), I highly doubt they did it purely for the pay or benefits. The risk just isn't worth it. Instead, I believe that those serving truly believe they are making a difference, which is why they joined in the first place.

After all, if all these individuals really cared about was the pay and benefits, then why join the military? There are tons of civilian jobs where you can make not only much more per year in salary, but have a far greater benefits package. Of course, jobs differ, depending on your field, position, level of education and overall experience, but... at least the men and women in question (who're being called "mercenaries") would get to see their families everyday, sleep in a real bed, and wouldn't normally have to worry about bullets whizzing by their head or bombs exploding right next to them on a daily basis.

Not everyone has opportunities, especially if you have no college education. The chance of earning much of anything with only a high school diploma is not much. Flipping burgers is not going to get you very far. Compared to the alternatives, joining the military may be worth the risk. Why do people do any job that is possibly dangerous? Its simple risk vs reward.

Military recruiters know this, why do you think they put so much focus on the benefits of going into the military? The idea of just serving your country isn't as appealing as it once was. Which has some to do with the way wars have been run in recent years.

[coolred38 0]

As an american living overseas I really get tired of hearing my fellow americans whine about the "poor us everyone hates us and all we do is try to help them" mentality....its really idiocy to assume that what the US govt is doing in various parts of the world is solely to 'help" the nationals in that country. Wake up and smell the greenbacks.

If you are an american, born and bred, fed on a diet of american tv, news and media in general....not to mention an education that barely hits on other cultures and histories...and if you've never so much as traveled outside your country for a week in france....then you my friend, have NO IDEA what the rest of the world thinks of america and americans....and this is a fact. Our media does not tell us really what other countries and its people really think of us...all our media tells us is that we are there to help them and they are resisting cause they are backward people and dont know whats good for them....we will drag them kicking and screaming into the New Millinia if we have to destroy every last bit of culture and history they have....

If an American had the opportunity to talk to a real live Iraqi, Saudi, Bahraini....any Arab or Muslim from some other country for that matter....I bet you will not find it easy to find one that says "I hate america and americans cause they have money and we dont....or cause they have freedom and we dont....or cause they are immoral in all ways and we arent"....what you will find time and again are people that are disgusted with Americas foreign policy and its unfair treatment of all others....and then how it deals with Israel(always comes back to that). These people are wearing our clothes. listening to our music, watching our movies, driving our cars, dreaming about the American dream and wishing it was theirs too.....but mention our govt to them and suddenly the eyes go hard, the words are clipped, and anger comes boiling out.

We cant just say...whats good for America is all that matters cause the world is shrinking and nobody is selfcontained little country or continent anymore....everyone is a neighbor to someone or just a click of a mouse or remote control button away...there is no excuse for the ignorance americans in general have about the rest of the world....why do so many americans thinks "only america" matters.....it doesnt matter nearly as much to other people that we are trying to impose our way of life on....just ask them and see what they say.

im curious if any soldiers in Iraq actually get the chance to talk to the locals and get a true understanding of how they feel....what they would probably find is bewilderment and confusion as to why a country on the other side of the planet with a completely different culture and history has landed right smack dab in the middle of them and tried to "clean the place up and make it all democratic and american like"....those people arent american and will never be american and my guess would be they dont want to be american....they are just as proud of being Iraqis as we are of being americans so why would they willingly submit to this "makeover"....it probably confuses them even more when they remember that the US govt helped Ol Saddam back in the day and had no problem with his heavy handed approach to running his country....matter of fact the US gave him alot of support to run it just the way he liked....so why the all the drama now? Explain that adequately to the Iraqi's...to the Arabs....to the Muslims and see if it makes them a little more willingly to submit to this..."we will bomb you and change you until you look, act, speak, and run your country just like us" in other words...until your docile and under our political and financial control.

Americans got to wake up and realize that its not all about us....we share this planet with a few billion other people...we are not its Warlords, its World Police and certainly not its Unofficial Dictators.

[chri'stina 190]

.....

If you are an american, born and bred, fed on a diet of american tv, news and media in general....not to mention an education that barely hits on other cultures and histories...and if you've never so much as traveled outside your country for a week in france....then you my friend, have NO IDEA what the rest of the world thinks of america and americans....and this is a fact.

........

Most everyone on VJ is marrying someone from another country, so many of us do know what some other countries think of us. Your post has a few good points, but it also is generalizing about what all Americans think about this situation. If you haven't talked to every American, like we haven't talked to every Muslim or Arab, then you can't say how we all feel.

im curious if any soldiers in Iraq actually get the chance to talk to the locals and get a true understanding of how they feel....what they would probably find is bewilderment and confusion as to why a country on the other side of the planet with a completely different culture and history has landed right smack dab in the middle of them and tried to "clean the place up and make it all democratic and american like"....those people arent american and will never be american and my guess would be they dont want to be american....they are just as proud of being Iraqis as we are of being americans so why would they willingly submit to this "makeover"....it probably confuses them even more when they remember that the US govt helped Ol Saddam back in the day and had no problem with his heavy handed approach to running his country....matter of fact the US gave him alot of support to run it just the way he liked....so why the all the drama now?

......

Well I know that many now feel the way you described, but can you ignore the celebrations there after Saddam was taken out of power? I know they probably hoped things would be much better over there by now, but you can't deny the happiness many felt there to see Saddam kicked out. Don't forget that part of the situation.

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

The point: most issues regarding the poor and the US is a myth.

i strongly disagree

That's because you don't know what you're talking about.

Stabu is dead on about Europe.

thanks for your comment, but i do know what im talking about...i didnt say that the figures were wrong, but poverty in america is not a myth, that is the point i was making with that post

i still fail to see how factors like literacy and infant mortality rate play no role in standard of living...so what if the HDI was created for developing nations, it still gets the point across...i still stand by my statement that money is a factor, not the only one

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Well I know that many now feel the way you described, but can you ignore the celebrations there after Saddam was taken out of power? I know they probably hoped things would be much better over there by now, but you can't deny the happiness many felt there to see Saddam kicked out. Don't forget that part of the situation.

No doubt this will be torn down as an example of 'biased media', but the results are rather disturbing nonetheless.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6983841.stm

About 70% of Iraqis believe security has deteriorated in the area covered by the US military "surge" of the past six months, an opinion poll suggests.

The survey for the BBC, ABC News and NHK of more than 2,000 people across Iraq also suggests that nearly 60% see attacks on US-led forces as justified.

This rises to 93% among Sunni Muslims compared with 50% for Shia.

The poll was conducted by D3 Systems and KA Research in more than 450 neighbourhoods across all 18 provinces of Iraq in August, and has a margin of error of + or - 2.5%.

It was commissioned jointly by the BBC, ABC and Japan's NHK.

Edited September 11, 2007 by Number 6

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

So what should the US do? They are damned if the do, damned if they don't.

The only mistake the US made with Vietnam, Iraq Afghanistan etc is not going all the way. You cannot win a war trying to minimize civilian loses. Its war. Therefore it is a case of go hard or go home.

It is really easy to focus on the bad stuff that the Us has been scapegoated for while ignoring anything good it has done or that has come from it. For Example, When the Serbs where butchering the ###### out of Croatians and Bosnians it was the US who saved them.

clearly, i am well informed on the conflicts in that region, have you seen what country my fiance is from???

because of this, they are actually one of the few general populations that has a somewhat favorable view of americans

theres a motive behind everything, we dont just help people because we are so nice and caring...we want control of their assets

were damned if we do, damned if we dont because we chose to go in and invade iraq...the answer, as was previously stated, was to never go in at all

[coolred38 0]

Of course they were happy....nobody likes to be ruled by a cruel dictator....but then they liked it even less when a the foreigners stuck around long after the bad guy was gone....and the resulting chaos ensued.

I apologize for generalizing what all americans think....but from my personal experience talking to those americans that i do meet....they pretty much fit the bill of the "nothin but america matters" group. Those that arent are the exceptions.....not the norms. Im really very glad when I meet americans that are enlightened or are married to a foreigner....gives one hope that we arent a lost cause to self deceit and self proclaimed moral superiority.

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

Why do people say that about Saudi Arabia. Okay we will wage a war on them because of x individuals. Now, will Democrats support it?

i still wouldnt support it (i dont know if you were referring to me, but im not democrat btw), but i was simply addressing the attitude that this war is a direct result of the attacks which occurred on 9/11

if that were true, then there should be some tie to the hijackers and the country of invasion

[BabyBlueSusie 1]

Do you think if Israel completely left that region they would have peace? I think history suggests otherwise..

there wouldnt necessarily be peace, but i think its quite clear that in some areas, there would be a SIGNIFICANT decrease...the only issue then would be 'what to do with the israelis? where do they go now?', which again could have been avoided by never starting the whole issue to begin with