71% Favor Requiring Foreign Visitors to Carry Universal ID Card

[Heracles 417]

Don't need to, by cloning the chip all you are is assuming someone else's identity.

There is no such thing as a read only database, the data has to get in somehow. Find the right person and pay them to not follow verification procedures and you have yourself a new ID.

Allow only a select few access to the database; which can include a 25 year jail sentence for any breach.. If someone's ID check retrieved their photo and fingerprint from a central database it would be easy for police to see that a card has been cloned as their face will not match that of the stored photo..

[Heracles 417]

Maybe a bit harder, just need a few corrupt employees in the National ID program and well free National Ids for all. You can be a citizen for a bit of a bribe to the right person. You really want to trust a process like that?

So what is the alternative?? do nothing and pretend the problem will go away. The US already tried that; hence the status quo..

Give more money to ICE to do their job. We will have to anyway, why do we need National ID to go with it?

Do their job? lol How are they supposed to do that without being able to quickly verify someone's status.

It is like the ACLU saying we want you to catch the terrorists; well as long as you don't monitor American's communications..

Edited August 20, 2007 by Boo-Yah!

[GaryC 7]

Maybe a bit harder, just need a few corrupt employees in the National ID program and well free National Ids for all. You can be a citizen for a bit of a bribe to the right person. You really want to trust a process like that?

So what is the alternative?? do nothing and pretend the problem will go away. The US already tried that; hence the status quo..

Give more money to ICE to do their job. We will have to anyway, why do we need National ID to go with it?

Do their job? lol How are they supposed to do that without being able to quickly verify someone's status.

It is like the ACLU saying we want you to catch the terrorists; well as long as you don't monitor American's communications..

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

More on VeriChips:

VeriChips cloned by hackers

I would like to see them clone something stored in a central database. Cloning chips is useless if your biometrics are stored in a read-only secure government sever..

Actually - the data storage is rarely if ever administrated by the government. Instead it is outsourced to privately contracted companies. Companies like the one who lost Veterans insurance information, like the payroll company at my work that 'mislaid' some of the employees financial data. Like the credit card company who discovered that one of its employees was stealing customer account information. You get the idea...

This should be a doozy for the "Don't trust big government" folks.

[Dan J 277]

Don't need to, by cloning the chip all you are is assuming someone else's identity.

There is no such thing as a read only database, the data has to get in somehow. Find the right person and pay them to not follow verification procedures and you have yourself a new ID.

Allow only a select few access to the database; which can include a 25 year jail sentence for any breach.. If someone's ID check retrieved their photo and fingerprint from a central database it would be easy for police to see that a card has been cloned as their face will not match that of the stored photo..

You haven't worked with security procedures in IT have you? Asking for someones password is much easier than trying to hack it. You would be surprised as to how many people will give you their password if you only ask for it. You can't limit access to the database, how else do you get the data in? You will have to have offices all over the country with people having access to the database.

Criminals usually commit crimes because they don't think they will get caught. Punishment isn't really a deterrence.

[mawilson 2,133]

Allow only a select few access to the database; which can include a 25 year jail sentence for any breach.. If someone's ID check retrieved their photo and fingerprint from a central database it would be easy for police to see that a card has been cloned as their face will not match that of the stored photo..

Not that simple.

For a very good analysis of the pros and cons of (UK) ID cards, read this:

Everything you never wanted to know about the ID card

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Gary if I'm an enabler - you're a fascist. How do you like that labelling?

[Dan J 277]

Maybe a bit harder, just need a few corrupt employees in the National ID program and well free National Ids for all. You can be a citizen for a bit of a bribe to the right person. You really want to trust a process like that?

So what is the alternative?? do nothing and pretend the problem will go away. The US already tried that; hence the status quo..

Give more money to ICE to do their job. We will have to anyway, why do we need National ID to go with it?

Do their job? lol How are they supposed to do that without being able to quickly verify someone's status.

It is like the ACLU saying we want you to catch the terrorists; well as long as you don't monitor American's communications..

How do you know the status they verified is correct? The legal system doesn't take sorta correct as an absolute.

[pedroh 21]

pedroh's got a point. I'm never going to be stopped and harassed by the police. I'm not Hispanic, I'm blondish, very pale, I don't have an accent. It would be sort of dumb for me to get up on my high horse and say "I don't mind the new law, and I would show my ID if asked and I wouldn't mind being detained I have nothing to fear!" because when push comes to shove, I know the cops would target Hispanic neighborhoods and Muslim immigrant communities.

And tourism is a big deal. They pushed back the passport requirement for Americans travelling by air to Canada and Mexico past the summer travel season.

Oh puleeze! Enough with the melodrama.

Just last week I went to the urologist and they had the audacity to actually ask me for my driver's license along with my medical insurance card and they actually xeroxed both before rendering services. Do I have a case? Will the SPLC or the ACLU represent me? I have lost a lot of sleep over it you know. I'm terribly hurt that they didn't believe who I represented myself to be and actually required me to prove it. What an outrage!

And here is the clincher. I am 51 years old and was buying beer at the local Walmart recently. They now have a zero tolerance policy and are required to ask everyone for their ID to buy beer. I feel as if I have been raped because they did not believe I'm 51 years old and made me show them my ID. Where is the ACLU on that one? Do they only represent illegal aliens now-a-days?

You know, my dad had jet black hair and brown eyes. Doesn't that qualify me as a victim? I realize he had a Scottish surname and that I have brown hair and blue eyes, but shouldn't the fact that my dad was a bit swarthy count for something? I've lost a lot of sleep over this and I really should be compensated.

I feel as if I live in the USSR or Nazi Germany.

dont be silly peejay, u know im not talking about that kind of carding.. for services, to pay with credit cards or such... im talking of when the cops want to ID me only because i look hispanic (therefore according to the profiling, probably an illegal immigrant), using the profiling as a probable cause, which, is ridiculous, and i think, doesn't work as well as they wanna think it does.. and THAT is happening now..

Edited August 20, 2007 by pedroh

[Dan J 277]

Maybe a bit harder, just need a few corrupt employees in the National ID program and well free National Ids for all. You can be a citizen for a bit of a bribe to the right person. You really want to trust a process like that?

So what is the alternative?? do nothing and pretend the problem will go away. The US already tried that; hence the status quo..

Give more money to ICE to do their job. We will have to anyway, why do we need National ID to go with it?

Do their job? lol How are they supposed to do that without being able to quickly verify someone's status.

It is like the ACLU saying we want you to catch the terrorists; well as long as you don't monitor American's communications..

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Right, I bet if you asked a different question, like how do you feel about giving up your privacy to the government, you would likely 71% in the opposite direction. Polls are meaningless especially since its nearly impossible to ask a question that doesn't have some kind of bias.

[GaryC 7]

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Gary if I'm an enabler - you're a fascist. How do you like that labelling?

Well since I know I am not a fascist then you saying means less than nothing. But doing nothing does make the person not doing it an enabler.

[pedroh 21]

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Gary if I'm an enabler - you're a fascist. How do you like that labelling?

Well since I know I am not a fascist then you saying means less than nothing. But doing nothing does make the person not doing it an enabler.

isn't that a bush-esque 'if you're not with us, you're against us' kinda stand?? i think its very extremist..

[GaryC 7]

Maybe a bit harder, just need a few corrupt employees in the National ID program and well free National Ids for all. You can be a citizen for a bit of a bribe to the right person. You really want to trust a process like that?

So what is the alternative?? do nothing and pretend the problem will go away. The US already tried that; hence the status quo..

Give more money to ICE to do their job. We will have to anyway, why do we need National ID to go with it?

Do their job? lol How are they supposed to do that without being able to quickly verify someone's status.

It is like the ACLU saying we want you to catch the terrorists; well as long as you don't monitor American's communications..

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Right, I bet if you asked a different question, like how do you feel about giving up your privacy to the government, you would likely 71% in the opposite direction. Polls are meaningless especially since its nearly impossible to ask a question that doesn't have some kind of bias.

Since requiring aliens to carry a card only applies to aliens then you can't frame the question with us losing any part of our privacy.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

How do you know you are not a fascist Gary - when you support fascistic ideas (not just on this issue).

As several people have now mentioned - what is wrong with properly funding and reforming the existing agencies? Allow them to do their jobs and tell us what they need - rather than bring in complex, expensive ID schemes of dubious value to the taxpayer.

Hardly doing nothing is it? As it stands you're suggesting an idea that amounts to 'creating the appearance of doing something' while doing little to change the core problems.

[GaryC 7]

Forget it. No matter what we say there will be some that find some sort of flaw. They are the enablers and can't be talked out of it. I can take solace in the knowledge that a large majority of people agree with me. That means it is likely going to happen regardless of what these guys say.

Gary if I'm an enabler - you're a fascist. How do you like that labelling?

Well since I know I am not a fascist then you saying means less than nothing. But doing nothing does make the person not doing it an enabler.

isn't that a bush-esque 'if you're not with us, you're against us' kinda stand?? i think its very extremist..

I don't see the analogy. But thank you for bringing Bush into it. I was wondering when that would happen.