Activism and U.S. History

[JoeMama 0]

As mention in another thread:

John Wilkes Booth was another (in)famous activist that had a cause he felt was right and just and worth fighting for

Yet, he was undeniably a US citizen

Actually, he was a confederate

Born May 10, 1838 in Maryland, It was still the US at that time.

He was only a confederate sympathizer who expressed vehement dissatisfaction with the South's defeat in the Civil War and Lincoln's proposal to extend voting rights to freed slaves.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Wilkes_Booth

[isleta521 5]

As mention in another thread:

John Wilkes Booth was another (in)famous activist that had a cause he felt was right and just and worth fighting for

Yet, he was undeniably a US citizen

Actually, he was a confederate

Born May 10, 1838 in Maryland, It was still the US at that time.

He was only a confederate sympathizer who expressed vehement dissatisfaction with the South's defeat in the Civil War and Lincoln's proposal to extend voting rights to freed slaves.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Wilkes_Booth

True, born a US citizen and technicly a US citizen. But he was a confederate activist and he claimed allegiance to them.

[keltic 1]

I'm going to start protesting against keeping murder illegal.

It's a matter of one following their conscience for what is right or just. Blind obedience to civil laws simply on the grounds that it is the law has never led to any social reforms.

here is an important point... its not 'blind'... i seriously believe that it is in the best interest of this country and its citizens to protect them by having laws that require criminal and medical background checks and getting permission to cross the borders into this country... and apparently, the vast majority of this country does also

i really dont care much if someone from another country doesnt like our laws... not anymore than they care if we like theirs or not

if you dont think it is right for america to invade iraq for our own purposes and change the way it is run, then why is it ok for someone from ANY other country to come into america and try it?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

[Leney 0]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

Or, move to Pennsylvania, sell your PC and join the Amish

Yes, some of your examples are activism, others I would argue not so much.

In your liberal definition of activist, let's not forget confederate activists (or as we may call them today - terrorists) Jesse James and Frank James, Bill Anderson, The Daltons, The Youngers, William Clarke Quantrill and his raiders, John Singleton Mosby - you can argue that activism is relative, but relative to whom? There's a very fine line throughout history when it comes to activism and terrorism if you want to go down that route. As you've illustrated well, much self proclaimed (or media proclaimed) "activism" is merely selfish pandering, and and attempt to justify illegal activity.

Sometimes I feel I'm the only one who thinks if you want to be a Radical (fill in the blank), be a Radical (fill in the blank) in your own country. Facilitate change there, so you don't have to illegally enter another country in oder to find a better way of life.

[keltic 1]

Sometimes I feel I'm the only one who thinks if you want to be a Radical (fill in the blank), be a Radical (fill in the blank) in your own country. Facilitate change there, so you don't have to illegally enter another country in oder to find a better way of life.

you are NOT the only one

[peejay 327]

Steven,

All those people were U.S. citizens.

Show me one historical act of "civil disobedience" when a group of citizens of one country

successfully disobeyed the laws of another country, and history proved them right.

Revolutionary War. More specifically the non-violent actions of the period.

The Revolutionary War led to the downfall of British rule in America and the rise of a new

independent nation. Unless you want Hispanics to take over America through overpopulation

and overthrow our government, I can't see how your example is relevant.

Unfortunately with ultra-liberals of the far Left that is exactly what they want. I have found from experience that they are usually White Americans that totally hate White America and only dwell on the bad in our history...none of the good. All the -isms that have ever occurred in American history can only be rectified by totally destroying America as we have known it. If it takes being overrun by endless hordes of illegal aliens...so be it. It is their Holy Grail.

[Scott & Lai 12]

I'm going to start protesting against keeping murder illegal.

It's a matter of one following their conscience for what is right or just. Blind obedience to civil laws simply on the grounds that it is the law has never led to any social reforms.

here is an important point... its not 'blind'... i seriously believe that it is in the best interest of this country and its citizens to protect them by having laws that require criminal and medical background checks and getting permission to cross the borders into this country... and apparently, the vast majority of this country does also

i really dont care much if someone from another country doesnt like our laws... not anymore than they care if we like theirs or not

if you dont think it is right for america to invade iraq for our own purposes and change the way it is run, then why is it ok for someone from ANY other country to come into america and try it?

Sometimes I feel I'm the only one who thinks if you want to be a Radical (fill in the blank), be a Radical (fill in the blank) in your own country. Facilitate change there, so you don't have to illegally enter another country in oder to find a better way of life.

you are NOT the only one

[Caladan 19]

I didn't realize there was a White America I was supposed to be defending. Nice to have that on the table, without its hood, as it were.

[almaty 19]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

got to pay those taxes folks, to prop up the iraq gov't..you all, are not cut and run patriots are you?

[isleta521 5]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

got to pay those taxes folks, to prop up the iraq gov't..you all, are not cut and run patriots are you?

Of course I pay my taxes, got to keep the welfare roles strong also you know

[almaty 19]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

got to pay those taxes folks, to prop up the iraq gov't..you all, are not cut and run patriots are you?

Of course I pay my taxes, got to keep the welfare roles strong also you know

good for you..a true patriot..same here..i want my congressman to go on exotic junkets..Iraq politicians to have numbered swiss bank accounts with y tax $$$...and pork barrel to help out all the good people in washington to get reelected...

[one...two...tree 2,762]

I think paying taxes is unjust.

Good. If you truly believe in your conscience that taxation is unjust, then fight it. The IRS may have you audited, but at least you are standing up for what you believe in strongly. That's what activism is all about.

Or, move to Pennsylvania, sell your PC and join the Amish

Yes, some of your examples are activism, others I would argue not so much.

In your liberal definition of activist, let's not forget confederate activists (or as we may call them today - terrorists) Jesse James and Frank James, Bill Anderson, The Daltons, The Youngers, William Clarke Quantrill and his raiders, John Singleton Mosby - you can argue that activism is relative, but relative to whom? There's a very fine line throughout history when it comes to activism and terrorism if you want to go down that route. As you've illustrated well, much self proclaimed (or media proclaimed) "activism" is merely selfish pandering, and and attempt to justify illegal activity.

Sometimes I feel I'm the only one who thinks if you want to be a Radical (fill in the blank), be a Radical (fill in the blank) in your own country. Facilitate change there, so you don't have to illegally enter another country in oder to find a better way of life.

Sure. There are some who will disregard just laws to fight another injustice. For example, someone deciding to shoot an abortion clinic doctor because they believe abortion is wrong or someone who plants a bomb in a crowded place to somehow bring attention to their cause. But that's terrorism and although terrorism can be classified under radicalism or activism, it certainly isn't what most people regard as activism.

Activism is standing up for what you believe is right, including being defiant of a law or set of laws that you truly believe are unjust. The examples I posted in the OP showed that activism historically has sparked social change.

Some here seem to think that anyone acting outside of any law makes that person lawless. A lawless individual is someone who has no regard for laws. An activist, IMO, is someone who will defy a specific rule or law that they find unjust. It doesn't matter whether you agree with their perspective or not, they are expressing activism through civil disobedience.

Edited August 16, 2007 by Mister Fancypants

[Gaby&Talbert 1]

If you honestly want to know where the US will be in the near future go to this website http://www.spp.gov/index.asp and you will see. This is an official US gov website some may say this will never happen but I wouldn't be so sure.

[isleta521 5]

I agree w/ you Brother Dean. All BS but I ain't Amish.