Recognizng the signs

[caybee 21]

...normally, the abusive part of the relationship isn't revealed until after someone has been pulled into the relationship. Normally they are made to feel dependent on the abuser. So when the abuse happens, they may feel that they have no where to go. Or they may simply have no where to go. If you haven't seen "Waitress", I highly recommend it. Especially because the husband is a multidimensional character and is played very well.

I would add that another method is for the abuser to make himself/herself seem dependent on the victim. The abuser can't live without their partner. He/she will die or kill themselves or end up homeless without the victim. They hit because they are ill, and they don't really mean it. It's not really their fault. It's the illness/their parents/work/adjustment/stress/society/blah blah blah. The abused partner married them "in sickness and in health," so how can they then leave them alone to suffer???

This kind of manipulation works especially well, I think, if the abuser is a newcomer to the area/culture who plays the helplessness card. It's a pendulum swing between brutality and feigned helplessness to elicit compassion and forgiveness, and it can work very well on victims who have a strong need to nurture. They feel so guilty for taking any action against this "helpless" person who is all alone on this side of the ocean except for them. And on good days, their mind can tell them the abuse wasn't really that bad. It's not logical that a helpless person would strike out against their caregiver, so it must not be happening.

[joelunchbox 0]

...normally, the abusive part of the relationship isn't revealed until after someone has been pulled into the relationship. Normally they are made to feel dependent on the abuser. So when the abuse happens, they may feel that they have no where to go. Or they may simply have no where to go. If you haven't seen "Waitress", I highly recommend it. Especially because the husband is a multidimensional character and is played very well.

I would add that another method is for the abuser to make himself/herself seem dependent on the victim. The abuser can't live without their partner. He/she will die or kill themselves or end up homeless without the victim. They hit because they are ill, and they don't really mean it. It's not really their fault. It's the illness/their parents/work/adjustment/stress/society/blah blah blah. The abused partner married them "in sickness and in health," so how can they then leave them alone to suffer???

This kind of manipulation works especially well, I think, if the abuser is a newcomer to the area/culture who plays the helplessness card. It's a pendulum swing between brutality and feigned helplessness to elicit compassion and forgiveness, and it can work very well on victims who have a strong need to nurture. They feel so guilty for taking any action against this "helpless" person who is all alone on this side of the ocean except for them. And on good days, their mind can tell them the abuse wasn't really that bad. It's not logical that a helpless person would strike out against their caregiver, so it must not be happening.

Good Call.

[Ta Ta 1]

I agree with the fact that abuse does not happen immediately or early on in the relationship. However are there not very subtle clues

early enough that hint now and then at trouble to come ? Subtle clues of control issues when it seems best to reevaluate the relationship

BEFORE it gets out of hand ? That was my point earlier.

I think an abuser usually shows himself as controlling before he ever strikes. Therefore my suggestion to watch your boundaries early on.

That way the emotions are not so deeply invested and it is easier to just walk away.

Hindsight, were there any clues early on that were a red flag ? I was myself in a relationship were I ignored such early,subtle clues and wished

I had paid attention to them and ran.

The first time I was questioned why am I wearing white tops .......white tops are see through, every white top is no matter what the material I was told........

I should have said goodbye and have a nice live ! Also the same "why are you looking at everybody " control. It takes a piece of your identity

away and walking on eggshells soon gets old.

After that relationship I have made it a point to not tolerate any such nonsense again early on. He did not hit but was emotionally very jealous, insecure and unstable and had a need to control.

I left. Thank God.

I am very blessed to have met my fiance who respects and loves me. May God help us to continue that way.

[desert_fox 32]

Any woman who tolerates abuse and does nothing about it is as sick as the abuser.

First time it happens, you are a victim. If you do nothing to report it and make sure that it doesnt happen again, you are now a volunteer........enjoy.....its what you want.

wow... I'm glad you weren't around to "help" me when I was being hit by my ex-husband.

Help from me??

You pick up the phone and call 911...the police would help you. They would give you instructions on how to get an ex-part court order to keep the abuser away.

Apparently you were a volunteer.

As my nephew the cop says...they go out on calls in California...offer the victim help. They never follow thru because "they love him" Guess what...they prosecute anyways....its a crime against the people of the state of California. They get them both in court. The state has barred immunity in domestic violence cases...the woman cannot refuse to testify...contempt of court.

[Emancipation 2]

Help from me??

You pick up the phone and call 911...the police would help you. They would give you instructions on how to get an ex-part court order to keep the abuser away.

Apparently you were a volunteer.

As my nephew the cop says...they go out on calls in California...offer the victim help. They never follow thru because "they love him" Guess what...they prosecute anyways....its a crime against the people of the state of California. They get them both in court. The state has barred immunity in domestic violence cases...the woman cannot refuse to testify...contempt of court.

I wonder what the police would have said to show up at my house and me not with a single mark on my body.. Not to mention the point that it was the "pastor" hitting his wife.. You honestly need a reality check.

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

I hope you are just trolling in this thread.. if not.. I am sorry you that you cannot see how complex this issue truly is.

[mawilson 2,133]

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

Why not poison the guy and deal with him while he's passed out sick?

[mybackpages 0]

Help from me??

You pick up the phone and call 911...the police would help you. They would give you instructions on how to get an ex-part court order to keep the abuser away.

Apparently you were a volunteer.

As my nephew the cop says...they go out on calls in California...offer the victim help. They never follow thru because "they love him" Guess what...they prosecute anyways....its a crime against the people of the state of California. They get them both in court. The state has barred immunity in domestic violence cases...the woman cannot refuse to testify...contempt of court.

I wonder what the police would have said to show up at my house and me not with a single mark on my body.. Not to mention the point that it was the "pastor" hitting his wife.. You honestly need a reality check.

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

I hope you are just trolling in this thread.. if not.. I am sorry you that you cannot see how complex this issue truly is.

Forget the troll like comments,you are doing a great job educating people about the complexity of domestic violence. The first step in tackling this crisis is to understand. Brava!

[joelunchbox 0]

I agree with the fact that abuse does not happen immediately or early on in the relationship. However are there not very subtle clues

early enough that hint now and then at trouble to come ? Subtle clues of control issues when it seems best to reevaluate the relationship

BEFORE it gets out of hand ? That was my point earlier.

I think an abuser usually shows himself as controlling before he ever strikes. Therefore my suggestion to watch your boundaries early on.

That way the emotions are not so deeply invested and it is easier to just walk away.

Hindsight, were there any clues early on that were a red flag ? I was myself in a relationship were I ignored such early,subtle clues and wished

I had paid attention to them and ran.

The first time I was questioned why am I wearing white tops .......white tops are see through, every white top is no matter what the material I was told........

I should have said goodbye and have a nice live ! Also the same "why are you looking at everybody " control. It takes a piece of your identity

away and walking on eggshells soon gets old.

After that relationship I have made it a point to not tolerate any such nonsense again early on. He did not hit but was emotionally very jealous, insecure and unstable and had a need to control.

I left. Thank God.

I am very blessed to have met my fiance who respects and loves me. May God help us to continue that way.

I see your point. If I was worried about something see-thru on my girl...I would probably buy her a camisole. But that is me.

[Ta Ta 1]

I agree with the fact that abuse does not happen immediately or early on in the relationship. However are there not very subtle clues

early enough that hint now and then at trouble to come ? Subtle clues of control issues when it seems best to reevaluate the relationship

BEFORE it gets out of hand ? That was my point earlier.

I think an abuser usually shows himself as controlling before he ever strikes. Therefore my suggestion to watch your boundaries early on.

That way the emotions are not so deeply invested and it is easier to just walk away.

Hindsight, were there any clues early on that were a red flag ? I was myself in a relationship were I ignored such early,subtle clues and wished

I had paid attention to them and ran.

The first time I was questioned why am I wearing white tops .......white tops are see through, every white top is no matter what the material I was told........

I should have said goodbye and have a nice live ! Also the same "why are you looking at everybody " control. It takes a piece of your identity

away and walking on eggshells soon gets old.

After that relationship I have made it a point to not tolerate any such nonsense again early on. He did not hit but was emotionally very jealous, insecure and unstable and had a need to control.

I left. Thank God.

I am very blessed to have met my fiance who respects and loves me. May God help us to continue that way.

I see your point. If I was worried about something see-thru on my girl...I would probably buy her a camisole. But that is me.

That was the crazy part........it was NOT see through but in his mind it was ! ALL white fabrics ! I wear modest clothing.

If a man does not like revealing clothes then I feel a camisole like you suggested is great and also ' honey is it possible you could cover

up a bit, it bothers me...........then he can either accept it or move on. The tone and intensity matters, is it a request or demand...........

But really in my case it was a nonsense demand for absolutely no reason.

[desert_fox 32]

[

I wonder what the police would have said to show up at my house and me not with a single mark on my body.. Not to mention the point that it was the "pastor" hitting his wife.. You honestly need a reality check.

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

I hope you are just trolling in this thread.. if not.. I am sorry you that you cannot see how complex this issue truly is.

You seriously let your ex drag you around by the hair and hold a knife to your throat and did nothing about it??

I know of no woman in my circle of friends that would have ever tolerated that. They would have been out of there that night. But oh well....

All I have read thru this thread that no woman would tolerate abuse....now Im seeing nothing but women who do or did tolerate it. That would be a volunteer.

[chri'stina 190]

[

I wonder what the police would have said to show up at my house and me not with a single mark on my body.. Not to mention the point that it was the "pastor" hitting his wife.. You honestly need a reality check.

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

I hope you are just trolling in this thread.. if not.. I am sorry you that you cannot see how complex this issue truly is.

You seriously let your ex drag you around by the hair and hold a knife to your throat and did nothing about it??

I know of no woman in my circle of friends that would have ever tolerated that. They would have been out of there that night. But oh well....

All I have read thru this thread that no woman would tolerate abuse....now Im seeing nothing but women who do or did tolerate it. That would be a volunteer.

If no one in your circle of friends have experienced it, they can't truly say what'd they do. We can all hope we would do the right thing in that situation. Some women never get out of the cycle and really leave. I think you should instead applaud those who did get out and not condemn them, because in the end they did stand up for themselves. Not everyone can do it at the same speed, the important part is that they do it. You don't know enough about the situations to be so harsh about it. If someone was holding a knife to your throat, someone probably much stronger than you, you can't do anything at that moment about it.

*oops said neck instead of knife

Edited August 17, 2007 by stina&suj

[joelunchbox 0]

I agree with the fact that abuse does not happen immediately or early on in the relationship. However are there not very subtle clues

early enough that hint now and then at trouble to come ? Subtle clues of control issues when it seems best to reevaluate the relationship

BEFORE it gets out of hand ? That was my point earlier.

I think an abuser usually shows himself as controlling before he ever strikes. Therefore my suggestion to watch your boundaries early on.

That way the emotions are not so deeply invested and it is easier to just walk away.

Hindsight, were there any clues early on that were a red flag ? I was myself in a relationship were I ignored such early,subtle clues and wished

I had paid attention to them and ran.

The first time I was questioned why am I wearing white tops .......white tops are see through, every white top is no matter what the material I was told........

I should have said goodbye and have a nice live ! Also the same "why are you looking at everybody " control. It takes a piece of your identity

away and walking on eggshells soon gets old.

After that relationship I have made it a point to not tolerate any such nonsense again early on. He did not hit but was emotionally very jealous, insecure and unstable and had a need to control.

I left. Thank God.

I am very blessed to have met my fiance who respects and loves me. May God help us to continue that way.

I see your point. If I was worried about something see-thru on my girl...I would probably buy her a camisole. But that is me.

That was the crazy part........it was NOT see through but in his mind it was ! ALL white fabrics ! I wear modest clothing.

If a man does not like revealing clothes then I feel a camisole like you suggested is great and also ' honey is it possible you could cover

up a bit, it bothers me...........then he can either accept it or move on. The tone and intensity matters, is it a request or demand...........

But really in my case it was a nonsense demand for absolutely no reason.

I have been struggling a little on how to say this but I will try now. Most of the traits listed might-again I say might be baggage from how someone is raised. Take the white top example. It could be construed as controlling leading to abuse or it might be that he always heard his father talk unfavorably about women in white tops. If asked about the why behind the comment--his answer will probably reveal a lot about his personality. I think this boils down to respect. If you respect someone, you don't do those things (at least intentionally--again, good communication helps). And if you respect yourself (that is not a given either) you will not accept the abuse. Having said that, how many of us could literally, right this instant, get up and walk out of our relationship? Why then do we browbeat people in a relationship about how they should just get up and leave? It can't be any easier for them than for us. We all need to be aware and stay read up on the subject so we can, 1) maybe help someone else, 2) see that maybe we need help and here is the toughie, 3) maybe recognize signs of controlling/abuse in ourselves. ouch! Everyone has done it at some level either as a child or as an adult.

[desert_fox 32]

If no one in your circle of friends have experienced it, they can't truly say what'd they do. We can all hope we would do the right thing in that situation. Some women never get out of the cycle and really leave. I think you should instead applaud those who did get out and not condemn them, because in the end they did stand up for themselves. Not everyone can do it at the same speed, the important part is that they do it. You don't know enough about the situations to be so harsh about it. If someone was holding a knife to your throat, someone probably much stronger than you, you can't do anything at that moment about it.

*oops said neck instead of knife

I have friends that have experienced this. ONE TIME!!!!

I even have a married daughter with a 14 yr old daughter...and I know that she would not tolerate this for an instant. She would call the police and be out of there that night...and would be at the lawyers office the next morning.

Of course, she was trained my me and my ex, where this is not tolerated under any circumstances.

Guess it depends upon from where you got your belief system and how you became a co-dependent.

[doodlebug 3]

[

I wonder what the police would have said to show up at my house and me not with a single mark on my body.. Not to mention the point that it was the "pastor" hitting his wife.. You honestly need a reality check.

My ex was smart enough never to leave a mark, but don't think for an instant that I just laid down and allowed the abuse to continue... If I had resisted him, fought back etc. He would have slit my throat with that butcher knife that he had held against my throat.. It's kinda hard to call 9-11 when you are being dragged across the floor by your hair. I did get out thank you very much.. but there's no magical fairy wand to wave to get yourself out of domestic violence. There are economics involved, the feeling that no one will believe your story as well as the fact that you are threatened within an inch of your life to not say anything to anyone or you will be hunted down and killed.. I can't even imagine how women deal with threats against their children.

I hope you are just trolling in this thread.. if not.. I am sorry you that you cannot see how complex this issue truly is.

You seriously let your ex drag you around by the hair and hold a knife to your throat and did nothing about it??

I know of no woman in my circle of friends that would have ever tolerated that. They would have been out of there that night. But oh well....

All I have read thru this thread that no woman would tolerate abuse....now Im seeing nothing but women who do or did tolerate it. That would be a volunteer.

May I ask what you are contributing to this thread. The purpose was for those women/men who are in the beginning stages or later of an abusive relationship to recognize the signs and help them to identify what the abuse is.

All I see you doing is abusing these women even more by belittling them. I really don't think you should be commenting in here any further. If I had been abused and read your comments I'd hesitate to share my story for fear of you belittling my experience.

And btw as for "letting" someone drag you by the hair, ever stop to think that SOME of these women are tinier than the men. Have you NOT EVER lost a fight? If you have lost a fight what are you some kind of wimp? You couldn't hold your own? What a loser!!! (that's what you're saying to these women.....)

[Hilarious Clinton 452]

If battering is explained away as 'culture' it's a crappy culture.