My wife's N400 denied because we filed 88 days early (corrected version) (Merged)

[Wouter 143]

Hello, I am confused and frustrated,

She was just notified that her N400 application was denied because "at the time of filing Form N-400, August 18, 2024, you have been living in marital union with your U.S. citizen spouse for 2 years 9 months and 5 days".

We have been married since 02-02-2020. We applied for a CR1 visa shortly after and like so many my wife stayed in her home country while I waited in the US.

When the CR1 was finally approved and issued she entered the US on 11-13-2021 which was also the date on her temporary 2y green card. We filed for removal of conditions before 11-13-2023 and this was approved and she received her permanent 10y green card without problems. 

On 08-13-2024 we filed her N400 application for US citizenship, which is 88 days ahead of the 3 year mark of my wife being here with me, under the assumption the 90 day early filing rule would allow this.

She just had her interview on 12-11-2024 and was denied as I mentioned above. Not because her residence in the US at time of filing was less than 3 years but because she hasn't been living in "marital union" with me for 3 years at time of filing! Don't those two things go together for every CR1 situation? How can you be allowed to file 90 days early but then get denied because you didn't live together with your spouse for the full 3 years at time of filing?

It does say that you can request a hearing to overcome the grounds of this denial, but we would probably need a lawyer to help us with that and I have my doubts this would be successful. Should we just file the N400 again now that it definitely has been more than 3 years?

 

 

Edited December 13 by Wouter
typo

[Cw1977 109]

55 minutes ago, Wouter said:

Hello, I am confused and frustrated,

She was just notified that her N400 application was denied because "at the time of filing Form N-400, August 18, 2024, you have been living in marital union with your U.S. citizen spouse for 2 years 9 months and 5 days".

We have been married since 02-02-2020. We applied for a CR1 visa shortly after and like so many my wife stayed in her home country while I waited in the US.

When the CR1 was finally approved and issued she entered the US on 11-13-2021 which was also the date on her temporary 2y green card. We filed for removal of conditions before 11-13-2023 and this was approved and she received her permanent 10y green card without problems. 

On 08-13-2024 we filed her N400 application for US citizenship, which is 88 days ahead of the 3 year mark of my wife being here with me, under the assumption the 90 day early filing rule would allow this.

She just had her interview on 12-11-2024 and was denied as I mentioned above. Not because her residence in the US at time of filing was less than 3 years but because she hasn't been living in "marital union" with me for 3 years at time of filing! Don't those two things go together for every CR1 situation? How can you be allowed to file 90 days early but then get denied because you didn't live together with your spouse for the full 3 years at time of filing?

It does say that you can request a hearing to overcome the grounds of this denial, but we would probably need a lawyer to help us with that and I have my doubts this would be successful. Should we just file the N400 again now that it definitely has been more than 3 years?

 

 

it was rejected cos you filed too early. 90 days before Nov 13 is August 15th. That’s the earliest you could have filed. 
 

this is yet another reminder to others in similar situation. Why try and hit the perfect date when it makes very little difference given how long the process takes. File at 75-80 days before and remove any doubts or chance of this happening. 
 

 

[JeanneAdil 6,579]

any time outside the US also has to be considered for continuous residency

 

You may file Form N-400, Application for Naturalization, 90 calendar days before you complete your continuous residence requirement i

 

[KMG 131]

2 hours ago, Wouter said:

Hello, I am confused and frustrated,

She was just notified that her N400 application was denied because "at the time of filing Form N-400, August 18, 2024, you have been living in marital union with your U.S. citizen spouse for 2 years 9 months and 5 days".

We have been married since 02-02-2020. We applied for a CR1 visa shortly after and like so many my wife stayed in her home country while I waited in the US.

When the CR1 was finally approved and issued she entered the US on 11-13-2021 which was also the date on her temporary 2y green card. We filed for removal of conditions before 11-13-2023 and this was approved and she received her permanent 10y green card without problems. 

On 08-13-2024 we filed her N400 application for US citizenship, which is 88 days ahead of the 3 year mark of my wife being here with me, under the assumption the 90 day early filing rule would allow this.

She just had her interview on 12-11-2024 and was denied as I mentioned above. Not because her residence in the US at time of filing was less than 3 years but because she hasn't been living in "marital union" with me for 3 years at time of filing! Don't those two things go together for every CR1 situation? How can you be allowed to file 90 days early but then get denied because you didn't live together with your spouse for the full 3 years at time of filing?

It does say that you can request a hearing to overcome the grounds of this denial, but we would probably need a lawyer to help us with that and I have my doubts this would be successful. Should we just file the N400 again now that it definitely has been more than 3 years?

 

 

If she has a 10 year green card, why not wait till the 3-year mark?  Why the rush? Yes you can start the process 90 days before, but as others have stated, the date you filed was too early. The wait times for all forms are ridiculous anyway, so it doesn't make much of a difference.

[OldUser 6,976]

If I could go back in time, I would have told you to send forms / file electronically at least 3 days after 90 day window opens, maybe even a week after. And definitely take into account time living together as a married couple for 3 year rule filing. This is common. You cannot blame USCIS for this. They're not required by law to provide any sort of calculators, advice when to file etc. It's up to immigrant to understand and prove they're eligible for immigration benefit.

 

The N-400 can be filed again.

Edited December 13 by OldUser

[Cw1977 109]

5 minutes ago, OldUser said:

If I could go back in time, I would have told you to send forms / file electronically at least 3 days after 90 day window opens, maybe even a week after. And definitely take into account time living together as a married couple for 3 year rule filing. This is common. You cannot blame USCIS for this. They're not required by law to provide any sort of calculators, advice when to file etc. It's up to immigrant to understand and prove they're eligible for immigration benefit.

 

The N-400 can be filed again.

this is 100% true, but ironically they actually DO provide a calculator!! Wish more people would use it!

 

https://www.uscis.gov/forms/uscis-early-filing-calculator

[OldUser 6,976]

7 minutes ago, Cw1977 said:

this is 100% true, but ironically they actually DO provide a calculator!! Wish more people would use it!

 

https://www.uscis.gov/forms/uscis-early-filing-calculator

I'm aware of this calculator, USCIS is doing something nice there, which they aren't even required to do by law. Even if OP used this calculator, he would have put Resident Since date + 3 years in the date field, but ignored other messages saying all other criteria should be met such as living in marital union.

 

This calculator can be improved by asking questions:

 

- 3 or 5 years rule

- How many days spent outside the US

- If 3 year rule, when started living together

- Any trips over 180 days

 

But again, this is not a service USCIS is required to provide.

 

I think I may build one for fun myself one day...

Edited December 13 by OldUser

[am2352 23]

As per USCIS, earliest you could've filed for is 08/15/2024. Tough luck bro! Understand it is waste of time and money but you can file again. Dont think it was rejected with prejudice.

 

 

 

[Wouter 143]

1 hour ago, Cw1977 said:

it was rejected cos you filed too early. 90 days before Nov 13 is August 15th. That’s the earliest you could have filed. 
 

this is yet another reminder to others in similar situation. Why try and hit the perfect date when it makes very little difference given how long the process takes. File at 75-80 days before and remove any doubts or chance of this happening. 
 

 

I don't understand this reply. I filed August 18th so clearly three days after August 15th.

Even a week after would not have changed the fact that it was less than exactly 3 years.

Of course in hindsight it would have been better to wait for the 3 year mark on Nov 11th 2024 but what is the 90 day rule for then?

As I mentioned, the denial is not because she did not meat the residence requirement, but for less than 3 years 'living in marital union': even if we were on a trip outside the US we would still be in marital union.

 

[Wouter 143]

APOLOGIES: I made a crucial typo in the original post (which I can't edit).

We filed on August 18th!

 

[Wouter 143]

Hello, I am confused and frustrated,

She was just notified that her N400 application was denied because "at the time of filing Form N-400, August 18, 2024, you have been living in marital union with your U.S. citizen spouse for 2 years 9 months and 5 days".

We have been married since 02-02-2020. We applied for a CR1 visa shortly after and like so many my wife stayed in her home country while I waited in the US.

When the CR1 was finally approved and issued she entered the US on 11-13-2021 which was also the date on her temporary 2y green card. We filed for removal of conditions before 11-13-2023 and this was approved and she received her permanent 10y green card without problems. 

On 08-18-2024 we filed her N400 application for US citizenship, which is 88 days ahead of the 3 year mark of my wife being here with me, under the assumption the 90 day early filing rule would allow this.

She just had her interview on 12-11-2024 and was denied as I mentioned above. Not because her residence in the US at time of filing was less than 3 years but because she hasn't been living in "marital union" with me for 3 years at time of filing! Don't those two things go together for every CR1 situation? How can you be allowed to file 90 days early but then get denied because you didn't live together with your spouse for the full 3 years at time of filing?

It does say that you can request a hearing to overcome the grounds of this denial, but we would probably need a lawyer to help us with that and I have my doubts this would be successful. Should we just file the N400 again now that it definitely has been more than 3 years?

[OldUser 6,976]

8 minutes ago, Wouter said:

APOLOGIES: I made a crucial typo in the original post (which I can't edit).

We filed on August 18th!

 

Doesn't matter in this case, you needed to physically live together as married couple for 3 years. Meaning you could not use early filing window to file, because you would be below 3 years of living together.

 

Challenging it is pointless, USCIS followed the law. Just refile when both conditions are true:

- She's been a resident for 3 years

- She lived in marital union with US citizen for 3 years. And US citizen has been a citizen for all 3 years.

 

Edited December 13 by OldUser

[SalishSea 17,970]

32 minutes ago, Cw1977 said:

this is 100% true, but ironically they actually DO provide a calculator!! Wish more people would use it!

 

https://www.uscis.gov/forms/uscis-early-filing-calculator

People conflate ‘90 days’ with ‘3 months.’

[Wouter 143]

5 minutes ago, OldUser said:

Doesn't matter in this case, you needed to physically live together as married couple for 3 years. Meaning you could not use early filing window to file, because you would be below 3 years of living together.

 

Challenging it is pointless, USCIS followed the law. Just refile when both conditions are true:

- She's been a resident for 3 years

- She lived in marital union with US citizen for 3 years. And US citizen has been a citizen for all 3 years.

 

OK yes thanks. We can just refile now basically.

So I conclude that this 90 day rule is basically useless for people coming in on a CR1 and even causes some confusion.

Even though it explicitly allows 90 day early filing for residency it does not allow 90 day early filing for marital union (which for CR1 situations is usually one and the same). Sadly it doesn't mention 'marital union' anywhere but I realize it falls under 'all other requirements'.

Thanks everyone. We will just file again soon.

 

 

 

[OldUser 6,976]

21 minutes ago, Wouter said:

OK yes thanks. We can just refile now basically.

So I conclude that this 90 day rule is basically useless for people coming in on a CR1 and even causes some confusion.

Even though it explicitly allows 90 day early filing for residency it does not allow 90 day early filing for marital union (which for CR1 situations is usually one and the same). Sadly it doesn't mention 'marital union' anywhere but I realize it falls under 'all other requirements'.

Thanks everyone. We will just file again soon.

 

 

 

90 day early window typically works for people who came on K-1 or were married living in the US for some time in different status before becoming a permanent resident.

It is trickier for CR-1.

 

Good luck and let us know how it goes!

 

If you happen to file this month, welcome to the club:

 

 

 

 

Edited December 13 by OldUser