A Difficult Situation

[Forever_After 4]

Hello all, I'm "Forever_After" and am now in my 40's.  I was adopted by my grandparents in 1998 just shy of my sixteenth birthday.  I lived with them prior to the adoption and up until March of 2000.  I'm a Scandinavian national.

 

I left to return back right before I got my green card.  I've been given so much bad information that I'm at my wits end.  One immigration lawyer swore to me that the N600K is what I needed.  I had to research myself prior to paying the fee to realize that I'm not eligible for the N600K!  Then I'm told "Oh you need the N-600!".  Now I'm being told that I may not be eligible for that either because A) I left prior to having my greencard and B) It's unsure if my adoption complied with the Hague convention. (Which I'm fairly certain it did, and that lawyer also doesn't have all the details as my grandparents are deceased and I no longer have any documents so they're running off of what I know).  My country is part of the Hague convention and my parents here gave up their rights locally prior to me returning to the U.S. with my grandparents.

 

I have the stamped and signed adoption papers in hand, I just find it hard to believe that "oh we'll, you're outta luck".  I met a woman and while we can get married etc. I just would like to stand on my own two feet and not have to rely on an I-130 etc. 

 

Anyone have any advice?

[R&OC 378]

Do you currently live in the US? Are your grandparents US citizens? Cn you provide a little more information?

[Hazelgreeneyes 9]

2 hours ago, Forever_After said:

Hello all, I'm "Forever_After" and am now in my 40's.  I was adopted by my grandparents in 1998 just shy of my sixteenth birthday.  I lived with them prior to the adoption and up until March of 2000.  I'm a Scandinavian national.

 

I left to return back right before I got my green card.  I've been given so much bad information that I'm at my wits end.  One immigration lawyer swore to me that the N600K is what I needed.  I had to research myself prior to paying the fee to realize that I'm not eligible for the N600K!  Then I'm told "Oh you need the N-600!".  Now I'm being told that I may not be eligible for that either because A) I left prior to having my greencard and B) It's unsure if my adoption complied with the Hague convention. (Which I'm fairly certain it did, and that lawyer also doesn't have all the details as my grandparents are deceased and I no longer have any documents so they're running off of what I know).  My country is part of the Hague convention and my parents here gave up their rights locally prior to me returning to the U.S. with my grandparents.

 

I have the stamped and signed adoption papers in hand, I just find it hard to believe that "oh we'll, you're outta luck".  I met a woman and while we can get married etc. I just would like to stand on my own two feet and not have to rely on an I-130 etc. 

 

Anyone have any advice?

What’s your classification as a green card holder and did you surrender your green card back to USCIS? You may be eligible based upon the answers you give as to being eligible for n-400

[Family 4,261]

3 hours ago, Forever_After said:

Hello all, I'm "Forever_After" and am now in my 40's.  I was adopted by my grandparents in 1998 just shy of my sixteenth birthday.  I lived with them prior to the adoption and up until March of 2000.  I'm a Scandinavian national.

 

I left to return back right before I got my green card.  I've been given so much bad information that I'm at my wits end.  One immigration lawyer swore to me that the N600K is what I needed.  I had to research myself prior to paying the fee to realize that I'm not eligible for the N600K!  Then I'm told "Oh you need the N-600!".  Now I'm being told that I may not be eligible for that either because A) I left prior to having my greencard and B) It's unsure if my adoption complied with the Hague convention. (Which I'm fairly certain it did, and that lawyer also doesn't have all the details as my grandparents are deceased and I no longer have any documents so they're running off of what I know).  My country is part of the Hague convention and my parents here gave up their rights locally prior to me returning to the U.S. with my grandparents.

 

I have the stamped and signed adoption papers in hand, I just find it hard to believe that "oh we'll, you're outta luck".  I met a woman and while we can get married etc. I just would like to stand on my own two feet and not have to rely on an I-130 etc. 

 

Anyone have any advice?

1. Do a free online FOIA to USCIS and DOS , ask for your ‘ complete records”. Give as much info as u have and mark unknown for any fields you don’t know . You will see green application (I-485) and final decision.

 

2. With a copy of adoptive parents death certificate and adoption decree, do same FOIA in adoptive parents name . This record will contain valuable info on the I-130 ( dates, supporting documentation used to establish adoption qualification..) It will be important to see what final decision was made on I-130. 

 

 

3. I am kinda assuming , back then  you came to the US as visitor stayed w adoptive parents and they did a US adoption ?  Please clarify.

 

4. Answer some dates specific questions, if you can:

Date you came to US w adoptive parents 

 

Date adoption was final is 1998 , what year do you THINK they applied for you? Is it maybe 2000 , the year you left the US?
 

 

 

[Forever_After 4]

19 hours ago, R&OC said:

Do you currently live in the US? Are your grandparents US citizens? Cn you provide a little more information?

 

I do not currently live in the U.S., no.  My grandfather was a U.S. citizen.

 

18 hours ago, Hazelgreeneyes said:

What’s your classification as a green card holder and did you surrender your green card back to USCIS? You may be eligible based upon the answers you give as to being eligible for n-400

 

I'm unsure about the green card, I did not do anything with the green card.  I never had it in my hands.

 

17 hours ago, Family said:

1. Do a free online FOIA to USCIS and DOS , ask for your ‘ complete records”. Give as much info as u have and mark unknown for any fields you don’t know . You will see green application (I-485) and final decision.

 

2. With a copy of adoptive parents death certificate and adoption decree, do same FOIA in adoptive parents name . This record will contain valuable info on the I-130 ( dates, supporting documentation used to establish adoption qualification..) It will be important to see what final decision was made on I-130. 

 

 

3. I am kinda assuming , back then  you came to the US as visitor stayed w adoptive parents and they did a US adoption ?  Please clarify.

 

4. Answer some dates specific questions, if you can:

Date you came to US w adoptive parents 

 

Date adoption was final is 1998 , what year do you THINK they applied for you? Is it maybe 2000 , the year you left the US?
 

 

 

 

1) and 2) I'll do that. Thank you.

 

3) Yes, I arrived in 1996 as a visitor I presume.  They started the adoption proceedings immediately however it was finalized in 1998.  And I'm 95% they applied for me, probably as soon as they could, if that was 1998 or earlier.  I doubt it was 2000.

 

I appreciate everyone's input and valuable advice.  Thank you!

[Family 4,261]

As you learned w  varied attorneys brief consultations …your options depend on sorting out crucial details /dates. …as the law that applies to you depends on the When of Certain Events.

 

Example look at the chart for conditions those born between 1978 and 2001…that’s where you fit ..item f. …to meet legal and physical custody as well as adoption finalized before 18.

 

That all sounds promising….but your leaving may presume a disrupted ( though not formally dissolved adoption)

 

TO DO;

I would recommend applying for a US passport with just your adoption decree, adoptive parents death certificates and your best estimate on time frame.

 

It’s a super inexpensive way to get a real hands on analysis of WHAT law and conditions need to be met. You’re welcome 😂….just saved you $$. And you can apply more than once …without penalty.

 

No need to wait for FOIA results but you will be able to use those records to respond to inevitable request for evidence on passport application.
 

 

 

 

 

 

 

https://www.ilrc.org/sites/default/files/2024-04/Chart C - Derivative Citizenship (Updated April 16 2024).pdf

 

 

10/5/78 to 2/26/01
a. Both parents naturalized, or if only one parent naturalized, 1) the other parent was a U.S. citizen at the time of the child’s birth and remained a U.S. citizen, 2) the other
parent is deceased,35 or 3) the parents must be legally separated36 and the naturalizing parent must have legal custody;37 OR in the case of a child who was born out of
wedlock and has not been legitimated,38 it must generally be the mother who naturalizes;39

b. Parent or parents naturalized prior to the child’s 18th birthday;40
c. Child must be an LPR or have begun to reside permanently in U.S. (check circuit for whether that also means lawful permanent residence, or something lesser) before the
18th birthday;41
d. Child must be unmarried;42

f. Adopted child may derive citizenship if the child is residing in the U.S. at the time of the adoptive parent(s)’ naturalization,43 is in the custody44 of the adoptive parent(s), is
an LPR, and adoption occurred before s/he turned 18.45 Stepchild cannot derive citizenship.46

 

 

https://www.uscis.gov/form-i-130-filing-information-for-prospective-adoptive-parents-living-abroad#:~:text=Who can file Form I,behalf of an adopted child%3F&text=Your child must have jointly,for at least two years.

• Your child must have jointly resided with you and you must have had legal custody of the child (as a result of a formal grant of custody from a court or authorized governmental entity) for at least two years.
  • The legal custody and joint residence requirements may be met either before or after the finalized adoption, but any pre-adoption custody must be based on a formal grant of custody obtained according to the law of the country where you obtained legal custody. 
  • If your child is or was habitually resident in a Hague Convention country before the adoption and you adopted the child on or after April 1, 2008, the two-year legal custody and joint residence requirement generally must be satisfied outside the United States. 

 

[OldUser 8,336]

Hey @Family tons of useful information there.

 

Out of curiosity, can the following action backfire?

 

18 minutes ago, Family said:

TO DO;

I would recommend applying for a US passport with just your adoption decree, adoptive parents death certificates and your best estimate on time frame.

Say, somebody applies, gets denied. If they're not a US citizen, by applying did they make a false claim to US citizenship? Can this affect getting GC in the future?

Edited August 30, 2024 by OldUser

[Family 4,261]

13 minutes ago, OldUser said:

Hey @Family tons of useful information there.

 

Out of curiosity, can the following action backfire?

 

Say, somebody applies, gets denied. If they're not a US citizen, by applying did they make a false claim to US citizenship? Can this affect getting GC in the future?

Absolutely no false claim issues in applying…and other than a fee application cost, no negative impact. One just has to beef up initial app with a print out of the law in effect , state a claim. ..and give it a shot. 


 

[Forever_After 4]

I really appreciate it Family, I'll see if I can't do that!

 

I spoke to the old lawyer who helped my grandparents with the adoption. She had quit and has been retired for 10+ years or so and all the old documents are gone, unfortunately.  However, she did say that a new birth certificate should have been made after I was adopted and that I should get a hold of that and give it to the immigration lawyer.  (It also says so on the adoption paper work I have)

 

Would that help me in any way?

[Family 4,261]

47 minutes ago, Forever_After said:

I really appreciate it Family, I'll see if I can't do that!

 

I spoke to the old lawyer who helped my grandparents with the adoption. She had quit and has been retired for 10+ years or so and all the old documents are gone, unfortunately.  However, she did say that a new birth certificate should have been made after I was adopted and that I should get a hold of that and give it to the immigration lawyer.  (It also says so on the adoption paper work I have)

 

Would that help me in any way?

Everything you gather could help…especially mining the info and tidbits you learn by examining your records closely. 

I personally think your adoptive parents filed an N-600 when they completed adoption ( not an I-130/I-485 “green card’’, as you seem to recall). But only FOIA will tell you for sure. 
 

Keep posting. You can do this

[Forever_After 4]

Thanks, this has been an arduous journey to say the least.  You guys have helped me more than 3 different immigration lawyers have.  My grandfather (adoptive dad) was a combat veteran for the USAF and he was "to the book" kind of guy, so that's what I'm falling back on in regards to hoping he did so with the adoption as well.

 

I'm born in Norway, but moved to the U.S. when I was under five years old.  I lived there throughout the 80's and the 90's.  The only school I've ever gone to was American schools.  Even when speaking my "native" tongue they hear my American dialect in the way I speak.  I've never been happy here, and longed to return back to what I consider home.  Especially now, since I've got a fiance whom I love dearly.  I've lived all across the U.S. from California to Florida and many places in between.  (Noteworthy Texas and Georgia - Bulldogs represent!)

 

I know we can get married and all that, but it would be nice to be able to stand on my own two feet and not have to rely on her to sponsor me in and all that.  Not that she could, anyway.  She's disabled (muscular dystrophy) but I have found a co-sponsor she can use that will help me if push comes to shove.

 

So I really do appreciate all of your help, especially you Family.  You've all provided great feedback and help, so know that it means a lot that you've all took the time to help me out.  And thought I'd just share a little about the person you're helping.   It's late here now, so nighty-night!

[Forever_After 4]

On 9/1/2024 at 3:27 AM, Family said:

...But only FOIA will tell you for sure.

 

Hi again, Family.  I'm just curious, who should I direct the FOIA towards?

[milimelo 4,591]

1 hour ago, Forever_After said:

 

Hi again, Family.  I'm just curious, who should I direct the FOIA towards?

USCIS is who you FOIA (back then it was called INS). 

[Forever_After 4]

Greatly appreciated, milimelo!

[Forever_After 4]

Ok, here's a slight update:

 

I visited the U.S. October of last year and got back this February.  I went to Texas, the DFW airport.  This whole trip has been like a time capsule.  Texas is the first state I ever visited as a 3-4 year old.  DFW was the airport we first ever went to in the U.S.  

 

Upon arrival, the BP agent scanned my prints and before saying anything else, he asked "Oh, are you coming in on your Visa?".  I stupidly said "no" and that I had a Visa.  He then said, "Oh good because then we'd have to spend 30 minutes in the other room (forgot the rest of the sentence)".  That interaction further strengthened my belief that I have had a green card as I don't think he would have asked me that after finger printing me, would he?

 

New question:

Due to Norwegians not being able to pronounce my name correctly I had it changed in 2005.  Let's just say it was "Johnny B. Good" and I changed it to "Johnny Not Bad".  Well, I've changed it back to "Johnny B. Good" but my issued Visa is in my other passport under the name of "Johnny Not Bad".  

 

From what I have understood, is that if I bring both passports and legal documentation of the name change this should be no issue?  I called the U.S. Embassy where I spoke to a lady with a very thick (and a little difficult to understand) Indian accent.  But from the parts I understood, she claimed I should re-apply for the Visa under my new name?  I honestly don't want to go through all that again.

 

So if I arrive at the border with my old passport with old name and my new passport WITH official documentation of name change should that cause me any issues?

 

I changed my name back to my original one as in order to get my birth certificate in Georgia I need proof plus, it makes things a lot easier.  But am hesitant to go get my passport changed if it requires a new Visa interview etc.

 

Finally, lawyers:

 

So far I've had two lawyers look into my history.  The first lawyer as mentioned above gave me blatantly false information.  He then said he'd file a FOIA on my behalf, after trying to pull a roosters tooth he finally gets back to my email where I ask if any new info has come back.  His response said "No, for difficult situations it can take months.".  But he just can never shoot me a quick email back with a question I have.  95% of the time I feel ghosted.  But he is very personable, I'll give him that.

 

Lastly, I've employed a new lawyer to look into things for me.  Besides what felt like some googling she provided me with nothing I didn't already know for $500+ bucks.

 

I need a lawyer that will respond to my questions and do a little more than just sitting on their fingers after having done minimal work.  I need a lawyer that feels like they're "fighting for me".  

 

Does anyone have any recommendations to a lawyer that they felt did that for them?

 

Thank you all for being here through this difficult journey. :)