Israel Declares 'Readiness for War' After Hamas Launches Rocket Barrage, Infiltration

[OriZ 3,157]

On 10/12/2023 at 4:34 PM, Boiler said:

Were you here in the days of the Muddy Ditch Left?

 

Man, those sure were the days...

 

On 10/12/2023 at 9:49 PM, EM_Vandaveer said:

I completely forgot visajourney has a politics forum, I never frequented it before.

I'm in Israel. I've been staying here on a (very) extended visit since March 2020 (with plans to make aliyah, eventually). Since March 2020, I believe this is my 3rd or 4th time that rockets are being fired from Gaza in bigger numbers - or at least I thought it will be just a "routine" occurrence like that....

Until I read about the massacres.

Although I live in a religious community, I myself am not 100% observant and so I went online after I was woken up by faint sirens (at the time it was not ours but the next sector's over from us) and explosions on Saturday morning.

 

I don't have words. I love Israel with all my heart, since the first time I set foot in this beautiful country, over 15 years ago and while walking towards passport control still inside the airport, I looked out the window, saw palm trees and the thought just hit me: "That's it, I'm home, one day I'll move to this country!" I cannot rightly explain it, other than it was like falling in love with a person except it was falling in love with a country, instead.

 

Now, Israel fights for its very survival, once again. It crossed my mind for a hot second to leave but I could not forgive myself. I'd betray who I am at the core. I converted to Judaism over 10 years ago. I knowingly accepted the Jewish people's fate as my own fate. There's no turning back now.

It's heartening to see this thread. It's disheartening to see social media.

Hamas supporters denying & celebrating the atrocities at the same time. (How does that work?).....

The false equivalency ("both sides are just as bad as each other")... What utter nonsense (I'd use a different word if it wasn't for the rules about profanity)!

 

I'm in a relatively safe area (in Judea, south of Jerusalem, in Gush Etzion, in a so-called settlement). We had sirens on the first day, 7/10 and one on 9/10. The rockets are not a major concern for this area. Possible infiltration from our neighboring Arab villages, however, is what I'm more worried about. There were gunshots nearby tonight and we had a notification that there was disturbance in the neighboring village which the army quickly took care of.

We hear faint rumblings day and night, that's Gaza being bombed. I hope each and every Hamas member is killed including the leaders who are safely in their palaces abroad. They deserve it. I hope for the least possible amount of civilian deaths in Gaza. It's war. War is horrible. Israel didn't start this war but Israel will finish it.

 

Anyway, thank you for reading my rant.

 

 

Nice, welcome. You call gush etzion safe? Haha. Hats off to ya. I grew up in Israel apart from 4 years in Boston (ages 4-8), but haven't lived there for 10 years now...however still have plenty of family there. I was fresh out of the army in 2006 when the war with hezbollah broke out, so quite familiar with the sirens. Something that appears a bit new though that I'm hearing about is what you also mentioned that even in central Israel you can sort of hear/feel the attacks in gaza, pretty intense

 

As you say, Israel is fighting for its survival, there's only one acceptable result to this war and that's destroying hamas, demilitarizing Gaza, and rescuing all hostages dead or alive. No negotiations or prisoner swaps. Anything short of this will signal to hezbollah and others that Israel is weak and completely evaporate what's left of deterrence.

 

It's really a no Brainer and yet it's stunning to see how many on social media (I'm pretty active on X myself and try to help hasbara a bit these days) or around the world seem to think what Israel is doing isn't justified or proportional or that it should just quit. Some of them because let's face it they are jew haters. But some also lack the strategic foresight and literally don't realize that will bring about the demise of it. People don't understand that it takes being tough to survive in the middle east. I for one truly hope Israel goes all the way this time and doesn't stop before mission accomplished. However long it takes, whatever toll it takes. It's time to finish the job.

[Boiler 45,525]

9 minutes ago, OriZ said:

 

As you say, Israel is fighting for its survival, there's only one acceptable result to this war and that's destroying hamas, demilitarizing Gaza, and rescuing all hostages dead or alive. No negotiations or prisoner swaps. Anything short of this will signal to hezbollah and others that Israel is weak and completely evaporate what's left of deterrence.

 

I am not denying the aims I just do see how that is possible, like playing wack a mole.

 

How do demilitarise Gaza, well without moving the population out which seems Politically impossible.

[OriZ 3,157]

49 minutes ago, Boiler said:

 

I am not denying the aims I just do see how that is possible, like playing wack a mole.

 

How do demilitarise Gaza, well without moving the population out which seems Politically impossible.

I mean 30% of the population has already been moved. Doesn't really take much more than that. Alot of it is underground...if you can enter/exit tunnels in gaza city which is where the majority of forces are gonna be, chances are you can get the other side of them taken care of as well. There's really no other option. My understanding is that's exactly the plan- destroy their tunnels, find all the weapons caches and rocket factories and destroy them etc. More importantly though will be the day after. In order for things to not get to the same point 10 years from now, there will need to be strong intelligence and thwarting similar to what Israel's been doing in Syria. Anytning new coming in will need to be destroyed on the spot, not in the next war.

 

Also, think of it as something similar to what Israel did during operation defensive shield. If it was possible in the west Bank at the time, I can't see why it wouldn't be possible in gaza today 

Edited October 17, 2023 by OriZ

[OriZ 3,157]

I forgot to mention, as one of the goals also of course to kill the leadership, military and political. 

 

Also here's a wiki link about defensive shield...I think the goals are pretty similar...I also think it was a pretty successful operation for the time despite heavy cost (probably going to be heavier this time around)

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Defensive_Shield

[Boiler 45,525]

I have a reasonable knowledge of the wars since 1948

 

I have a better understanding of WW2 and recent events in Ukraine. The Russians took major losses fighting in BUA's even with massive artillery preparation, and I do not think that level is politically possible. And that is nothing of course comparable to the events of WW2.

 

Egypt's involvement is interesting, on one hand Hamas is an off shoot of the Muslim Brotherhood so I am sure they are rooting for Israel in that respect. On the other they have to show support to fellow Muslims from a regional perspective whilst at the same time minimising any direct involvement including allowing too many to pass over their border.

 

Destroying Hamas well there are apparently 25,000 active, they may have lost say 2,000 so far. But as has been repeatedly mentioned half the population is under 18 so even if they lost all of that force it would not take too long to rebuild. From a Hamas perspective the more casualties the better and they are well dug in.

 

Senior leadership is not there, I think the head honcho is based in Qatar.

 

 

[OriZ 3,157]

Deif and sinwar are both in gaza and should be executed. Anyone outside of gaza should be targeted as well (mossad should handle that as its done before. Qatar does not equal immunity).

 

It's impossible to kill all personnel, that's not the goal. The goal is to remove the weapons (and actively preventing them from replenishing afterwards) and the leadership/anyone involved in what happened, and find the hostages. These are minimal objectives imo. Anything less equals defeat.

[Boiler 45,525]

I am sure if it was known where they are there would be a 2,000lb bomb heading their way. My experience suggests that the martyrs tend to be the low levels of the organisation and that few of the upper echelons tend to be of that persuasion.

 

Obviously Iran is heavily involved and they are providing a lot of the logistics and support. They are effectively immune too far away, too big.

 

Reminds me of the Yom Kippur war when the IDF was 100km from Cairo, lets say they took it, then what?

 

The only logical option I can think of is to clear Gaza, bulldoze everything, but I cannot see that happening.

 

[TBoneTX 45,309]

Not the BB.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Do-do-do-do-do:  Video Apparently Shows Hamas Captives Being Tortured by 'Baby Shark' Like Kid's Song

 

A viral video seemingly shows captured Hamas terrorists being subjected to a novel form of torture – a "Baby Shark"-style children's song being played in a loop for eight hours.  [...]

 

https://twitchy.com/amy-curtis/2023/10/16/do-do-do-do-do-video-apparently-shows-hamas-captives-being-tortured-by-baby-shark-like-kids-song-n2388587

Edited October 17, 2023 by TBoneTX

[TBoneTX 45,309]

Hamas Clarifies They Meant To Start The Type Of War Where They Get To Do Whatever They Want And No One Fights Back

 

[...] "We believe our intentions have been misunderstood," said Hamas spokesman Zadiq Mohammed Al-Durkadurka.  "We didn't want to start the kind of war where the other side can retaliate and start shooting back.  We want the kind where we do the killing.  Only us, please.  We are sorry for the confusion.  Death to Israel, thank you."  [...]

 

https://babylonbee.com/news/hamas-clarifies-they-meant-to-start-the-type-of-war-where-they-get-to-do-whatever-they-want-and-no-one-fights-back

[TBoneTX 45,309]

Why Are So Few Talking About the Hostages?

 

One of the striking things about the coverage of the Israel/Hamas war is how underreported the story of the hostages Hamas took has been.

 

Obviously, we know about the hostages.  How could we not, since they have been a key part of Hamas' strategy to hamstring Israel's conduct in the war?  Hamas has counted on those hostages to help shield themselves from attacks [...]

 

https://hotair.com/david-strom/2023/10/16/why-are-so-few-talking-about-the-hostages-n585260

[TBoneTX 45,309]

Between the eyes!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Why won't the Jews just let themselves be killed?

Nothing better captures the moral decay of our woke elites than their haughty disdain for the State of Israel.  [...]

 

https://www.spiked-online.com/2023/10/16/why-wont-the-jews-just-let-themselves-be-killed/

[EM_Vandaveer 2,408]

7 hours ago, OriZ said:

 

Man, those sure were the days...

 

 

Nice, welcome. You call gush etzion safe? Haha. Hats off to ya. I grew up in Israel apart from 4 years in Boston (ages 4-8), but haven't lived there for 10 years now...however still have plenty of family there. I was fresh out of the army in 2006 when the war with hezbollah broke out, so quite familiar with the sirens. Something that appears a bit new though that I'm hearing about is what you also mentioned that even in central Israel you can sort of hear/feel the attacks in gaza, pretty intense

 

As you say, Israel is fighting for its survival, there's only one acceptable result to this war and that's destroying hamas, demilitarizing Gaza, and rescuing all hostages dead or alive. No negotiations or prisoner swaps. Anything short of this will signal to hezbollah and others that Israel is weak and completely evaporate what's left of deterrence.

 

It's really a no Brainer and yet it's stunning to see how many on social media (I'm pretty active on X myself and try to help hasbara a bit these days) or around the world seem to think what Israel is doing isn't justified or proportional or that it should just quit. Some of them because let's face it they are jew haters. But some also lack the strategic foresight and literally don't realize that will bring about the demise of it. People don't understand that it takes being tough to survive in the middle east. I for one truly hope Israel goes all the way this time and doesn't stop before mission accomplished. However long it takes, whatever toll it takes. It's time to finish the job.

Right now, yes, we're getting less sirens than Tel Aviv & South Jerusalem, haven't had a siren for over a week. There are additional IDF troops staying in our village, too.

 

100% agree. I'm not on X but reddit, oy. Literally, today I read a comment that said "If someone is not condemning both Hamas & the IDF then they're extremely biased." I don't even know where to start!

People equating terrorist attack victims to civilian victims of the bombing of Gaza ("it's all murder") and don't misunderstand me, all CIVILIAN death is horrible but INTENT matters....

 

People saying "cease fire & negotiations should happen" and I ask them if the US should have negotiated with Al-Qaeda after 9/11 and they tell me Hamas isn't Al-Qaeda? Like, what???

 

I just get so discouraged sometimes.

[Dashinka 24,512]

On 10/16/2023 at 1:40 AM, TBoneTX said:

Is Israel Really an ‘Apartheid State’?

 

As pro-Palestinian demonstrations take place on campuses all across the nation, the idea is persistent and pervasive: yes, the Hamas attacks on Oct. 7 were terrible, but Israel had it coming because it is an oppressive apartheid state.  The "apartheid" word gets thrown around quite a lot in connection with Israel, yet like so many other charges leveled at the Jewish state, there is nothing to it.  [...]

 

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/robert-spencer/2023/10/14/is-israel-really-an-apartheid-state-n1735101

To me it seems these Leftist types crying that Israel is an "apartheid state" are the same ones also promoting segregated "safe spaces", restrictions on free political speech, and an expansion of the federal bureaucracy.  This is why I am all for exposing these collegiate types that are pro Hamas, and pro terrorism.  These names must be known as they will drive divisions as they move into the workplace.

 

Edited October 17, 2023 by Dashinka

[Dashinka 24,512]

11 hours ago, Family said:

I you Watch the video , the Sarcasm will be clear as day. Can’t believe @Boilerdid not splain for those who missed it .😂

 

 

 

And yet many of the LGBT... Leftist crowd are supporting Hamas.  Go figure.  I was told Leftist were smart, I guess not.

Edited October 17, 2023 by Dashinka

[Dashinka 24,512]

On 10/12/2023 at 4:12 PM, Boiler said:

I do not know the details but there was a clear out. I personally prefer a wide variety of views.

 

Somehow I survived. How I have no idea.

Off topic a bit, but I agree, CEHST does get quite boring without differing views, and I miss the back and forth.