Why was my friend denied a B1/B2 Visa?

[Boiler 45,446]

All I can know for certain is that the CO did her a big favour.

 

Could one reason, probably a combination I can see several.

[lilstar 4]

19 hours ago, Redro said:

 

Thank you, this is the kind of response i was hoping for. So i want to challenge some of your answers a bit

 

this is directly from a USA University school site

 

"If you are visiting the US on a B1/B2 tourist visa, join a Part-Time English Program at ***** to improve your English. Tourist visiting the United States  can use some of their free time to study. Federal law allows tourists to take short, part-time courses of study with a B1/B2 visa."

 

Now she was not going to take a course but a placement test. It's basically to see what English classes you would need to take depending on what level on English you currently at. 

 

But she was telling the CO she was thinking of giving all that up to go study in the US. 

 

Good point, but he never asked her if she was working or currently in school. If he did, she could explain that she was only going to go for the student visa once her studies were complete in Madagascar. Which she already has the bachelors degree, but a exam for a licensing was the last thing needed to be completed. 

 

her native language is French, and he spoke in French with her. - I'm assuming she was planning on going to school in the US to study English. Why the US? Why not a cheaper country like South Africa? Or studying English online for a few months. 

 

Because she would roommate with her friend, Who lives in the USA, 5 minutes from the university.

 

 

Her friend is also a female, who she would be staying with in the USA as well pay for the trip. -What proof did she have the friend was female? What type of evidence did she have that this was a friend helping her travel to the US and not a someone paying her for some type of work?

 

A Bank Statement  and pay stubs from friend's job.

 

So why did she get denied, because he claimed she lied on her ds160 even though she didn't? -Going to the US to travel vs going to the US to look at potential schools are two very different goals. 

 

She made it very clear and named the university were she was going to visit to take the placement test. I'm sure you are familiar with the ds160 but it does not ask you why you want to go to the usa but which visa are you applying for.

 

Because he doesn't like where she met her friend? - The CO is protecting her. This could be a potential human trafficking issue. Most people would not allow a stranger to pay for them to travel to a foreign country without expecting some type of string attached. 

 

 

In this case, this isn't a human trafficking issue, however he doesn't know that. But, i would assume he would have the intelligence to know that that a human trafficker is not going to give someone documents like their bank statement and pay stubs.

[lilstar 4]

23 minutes ago, Boiler said:

All I can know for certain is that the CO did her a big favour.

 

Could one reason, probably a combination I can see several.

 

You are certainly wrong, He did not do her any favor's.

[Redro 4,611]

1 hour ago, lilstar said:

Exactly why  she needed a visitor visa before enrolling. This school doesn't allow you to take the test online but in person on there computers. 

The school she wanted to go to- how many hours a week was she going to study? Going to the U.S. to study even for a short term program is very different to going to the US to visit friends. For example, my friend went to the US for a yoga teacher training course AND stay with some friends. She wrote both reasons on her DS160. She was also funding her own trip. 
Even if you think she didn’t lie the officer feels like she misrepresented her reason for going to the US. Next time she applies she should state all the reasons she wants to visit the US. She should also have a clearer idea of where she wants to study and how long the program is. Because the officer probably thought she was coming to stay and apply to study in an English school that requires a student visa.

[Redro 4,611]

26 minutes ago, lilstar said:

Thank you, this is the kind of response i was hoping for. So i want to challenge some of your answers a bit

 

this is directly from a USA University school site

 

"If you are visiting the US on a B1/B2 tourist visa, join a Part-Time English Program at ***** to improve your English. Tourist visiting the United States  can use some of their free time to study. Federal law allows tourists to take short, part-time courses of study with a B1/B2 visa." - Did she have a chance to show this to the officer?

 

Now she was not going to take a course but a placement test. It's basically to see what English classes you would need to take depending on what level on English you currently at. understood

 

 

Because she would roommate with her friend, Who lives in the USA, 5 minutes from the university.- very lucky! Did she find the school first or did she find her friend first and then decided to study at the school. 

 

 

 

In this case, this isn't a human trafficking issue, however he doesn't know that. But, i would assume he would have the intelligence to know that that a human trafficker is not going to give someone documents like their bank statement and pay stubs.- Human trafficking happens in many different ways. I would expect some human traffickers to do that... also how did she verify the bank statements and pay stubs were real? How could the officer verify those bank statements and pay stubs?

If you are the friend in the US -I suggest you go to Madagascar to visit your friend. Once you have met in person she can try again. 

Alternatively, I suggest you tell your friend in Madagascar to encourage their US friend to come visit as this might be the only way they can meet.

Once they have met in person, she might be able to study in the US. But, I encourage her to pay for her own trip, too. 

[lilstar 4]

22 minutes ago, Redro said:

The school she wanted to go to- how many hours a week was she going to study? Going to the U.S. to study even for a short term program is very different to going to the US to visit friends. For example, my friend went to the US for a yoga teacher training course AND stay with some friends. She wrote both reasons on her DS160. She was also funding her own trip. 
Even if you think she didn’t lie the officer feels like she misrepresented her reason for going to the US. Next time she applies she should state all the reasons she wants to visit the US. She should also have a clearer idea of where she wants to study and how long the program is. Because the officer probably thought she was coming to stay and apply to study in an English school that requires a student visa.

 You continue to get it wrong,

 

She is not studying in the usa on a b1/b2 visa. She is visiting a university to take a placement test, that does not result in any academic credit. You are allowed to do that on a b1/b2 visa.

 

You do not write in a ds160 why you want to visit USA, instead you pick which visa you are applying for.

 

She made it clear to the officer, She is taking a placement test at university. She will then return to her home country and then apply for a student visa for the same university she took the placement test at. That includes applying and be accepted at the university before applying for the student visa.

[Boiler 45,446]

I have been on VJ for a long time, I know other people who have been here a long time.

 

Not one of them has offered to fly me half way around the world and cover my expenses

 

What am I doing wrong,?

[Redro 4,611]

1 hour ago, lilstar said:

 You continue to get it wrong,

 

She is not studying in the usa on a b1/b2 visa. She is visiting a university to take a placement test, that does not result in any academic credit. You are allowed to do that on a b1/b2 visa.- 

 

You do not write in a ds160 why you want to visit USA, instead you pick which visa you are applying for.

 

She made it clear to the officer, She is taking a placement test at university. She will then return to her home country and then apply for a student visa for the same university she took the placement test at. That includes applying and be accepted at the university before applying for the student visa.

Let me see if I understand the situation. 

1. Woman in Madagascar met a woman from the US on a Facebook group about tourism.

2. They become very good friends but have not yet met in real life.

3. They decide they will meet in real life. 

4. American friend offers to pay for friend in Madagascar to come to the US so she can visit and take a placement test at a local school that teaches English but she will not study in the US during that trip. Instead she will return to Madagascar complete her studies and then return to the US on a student visa at a later date.

5. American friend sends proof of financial support via pay stubs and bank statements. 

6. Friend from Madagascar goes to interview.

7. Friend from Madagascar is denied the tourist visa because the interview suspects she is trying to MOVE to the US not just visit. 

 

The part in bold is why your friend was likely denied. The interview suspects the friend will remain in the US because she expressed the desire to visit the US not only as a tourist but later as a student. If your friend had kept it simple and explained she is going to the US to visit friends and study a short English course she might have been okay. But, because she also has "a friend" (who might be a romantic partner) willing to pay for her entire trip (and maybe school?) the interviewer suspects once she arrives in the US she won't leave. 

In addition, you can see I was confused by what was happening - was your friend planning to studying during the first visit? Is it a university? Is it a language school? The interviewer was likely also confused and thought maybe your friend chose the wrong visa. Believe it or not. Many people apply to ESL schools in the US without visiting all of them first. You stated your friend wanted to take the placement test because she didn't know what courses she will take but usually language schools are very simple- you apply to go to the school and you choose the days/hours you want to study. Then when you arrive- you take a placement test and you are assigned a level. You do not take a placement test and then return a few months later - because your language level might have improved during that time. Even if your English level has not improved they would probably make you take the placement test again because if the school is like any of the language schools I've been to... placement tests are taken at the start of the course and at the end of the course. 

[Boiler 45,446]

1. She is form Madagascar
2. She is is female
3. Presumably young
4. She wants to fly halfway round the world to take a test to get into language school? Never heard of that.
5. She has no money of consequence
6. No spouse no children
7. A friend she met online is paying for this
8. She has never met the friend
9. A bank statement was provided, I doubt they looked at, if they did there is no way of verifying it and it just confirms 5 above.

I may have missed something, seems there are plenty of reasons to deny.

 

I would assume a one way trip, or worse.

[SalishSea 17,802]

5 hours ago, lilstar said:

You don't understand people sometimes because you can't relate to people sometimes. Not everyone has the ability to learn another language like you were able to using an app. Some people need a classroom setting. An USA was chosen because she would roommate with her friend who lives in USA.  

The "roommate" being the as yet unmet Facebook friend who is offering to pay for the trip?  

[SalishSea 17,802]

5 hours ago, lilstar said:

However she had the friends bank statement,

This is not normal.   People do not give bank statements to internet strangers unless something sketchy is underfoot.  Again, you were rightly denied.

Edited August 16, 2023 by SalishSea

[SalishSea 17,802]

5 hours ago, lilstar said:

Listen, i never said the officer was right or wrong for denying her. I was more focusing on what exact reason the officer denied her for. Did her feel like because she met someone online it wasn't safe?, was it because the officer claimed she lied on her ds160?, even though she didn't. Was it because of the 214(b) despite her having strong ties to her home country? 

It was because she likely has no intention of returning to her country, and due to the very sketchy circumstances with the Facebook friend.

[lilstar 4]

15 hours ago, Boiler said:

I have been on VJ for a long time, I know other people who have been here a long time.

 

Not one of them has offered to fly me half way around the world and cover my expenses

 

What am I doing wrong,?

 

Perhaps you and the members on VJ aren't in the same tax bracket of said friend.

[MaxP22 186]

7 minutes ago, lilstar said:

 

Perhaps you and the members on VJ aren't in the same tax bracket of said friend.

Just admit you are the US 'friend'.

 

The reasons your friend in Madagascar was denied are already listed in this thread, no point going over it again. She was rightly denied.

 

The solution here is so easy, go and visit her instead, like you should have done in the first place instead of getting her to apply for a B2.

[lilstar 4]

14 hours ago, Redro said:

 

 

The part in bold is why your friend was likely denied. The interview suspects the friend will remain in the US because she expressed the desire to visit the US not only as a tourist but later as a student. If your friend had kept it simple and explained she is going to the US to visit friends and study a short English course she might have been okay.

 

 

 

Maybe, however, you are told to be honest in the interview.

 

Earlier, you mention that she should as told the officer her long term goals and now that i mention to you that she did. You are now saying she should have kept it simple. 

 

But, because she also has "a friend" (who might be a romantic partner) willing to pay for her entire trip (and maybe school?) the interviewer suspects once she arrives in the US she won't leave. 

 

That's not the case but i do agree with you here. Visa denied because i feel like your friend is your romantic partner.

 

was your friend planning to studying during the first visit? Is it a university? Is it a language school? The interviewer was likely also confused and thought maybe your friend chose the wrong visa. Believe it or not. Many people apply to ESL schools in the US without visiting all of them first. You stated your friend wanted to take the placement test because she didn't know what courses she will take but usually language schools are very simple- you apply to go to the school and you choose the days/hours you want to study. Then when you arrive- you take a placement test and you are assigned a level. You do not take a placement test and then return a few months later - because your language level might have improved during that time. Even if your English level has not improved they would probably make you take the placement test again because if the school is like any of the language schools I've been to... placement tests are taken at the start of the course and at the end of the course. 

 

No, the first visit was only for the placement test.

No, it isn't a language school.

No the Officer wasn't confused he understood exactly what her intent was, the correct visa for selected for her intent.

 

. You stated your friend wanted to take the placement test because she didn't know what courses she will take but usually language schools are very simple- you apply to go to the school and you choose the days/hours you want to study. Then when you arrive- you take a placement test and you are assigned a level. You do not take a placement test and then return a few months later - because your language level might have improved during that time.

 

I agree with you on how the placement test works. However, your language skill is not going to improve during that time if she is returning back to a french speaking country with no intent to further her English until she is approved to study back at that school. 

 

Even if your English level has not improved they would probably make you take the placement test again because if the school is like any of the language schools I've been to... placement tests are taken at the start of the course and at the end of the course. 

 

Which wouldn't change anything then, she would be taking the same classes they recommended her to her before.