Do these visa categories really contribute to US economy?

[Swimming_Upstream 13]

The following categories are most subscribed to, or gets the most number of Green cards on a regular basis:

 

1. IR5 - Parents of US citizens

2. DV - Diversity Visa

3. IR1 - Spouse of US citizens

4. FX - Spouse of lawful permanent residents (exempt from country quota limitations)

5. F4 - Siblings of US citizens

 

Let's see if and how these groups of people contribute to the US economy. There are some hard truths that need to be discussed. Twenty first century demands that to be successful, the workforce be technically knowledgeable and skilled.

 

Start with the easy one, DV. The basic premise is to make America more diverse, or representative of all countries/cultures, but does that automatically mean that it will help the economy? 

 

IR5, Parents and F4, Siblings. Bringing parents may give some peace of mind to new citizens, but are they not a burden to the healthcare system? Are all Siblings technically qualified or are skilled enough for the US job market? It doesn't make sense to allow residency for just being a parent or sibling of a citizen without any qualifications.

 

IR1, Spouse of US citizens. This is one of the most abused visa categories. People who have no other way of getting residency, or who can not afford to wait in the very long wait lists in other categories, typically attempt for this shortcut, and find a suitable citizen partner. Once green card in hand, they are not required to stay committed to the marriage.

 

And finally FX. Regular applicants of green cards typically include their Spouses and children under various employment and other categories, including F2A. But this FX is a special category for the spouses who are considered "Exempt". Why should some spouses be exempt from numerical limitations when vast majorities are not?

 

So which groups should ideally get the priorities?

 

A. IR2 - Children of US citizens

B. F2B - 21+ children of LPR

C. F1 - 21+ children of US citizens

D. E2, E3 - Employment based

 

Children should stay with their parents, so they should have the permanent resident status. Even if they are above 21 years of age, parents sponsorship helps them to gain education and subsequently employment. Other sources of sponsorship are increasingly hard to get these days. 

 

Please feel free to provide feedback on the topics discussed above. 

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Swimming_Upstream

[Rocio0010 5,579]

1 hour ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

but are they not a burden to the healthcare system? Are

Not really, because healthcare is private, so if they pay into it, how is it a burden ?

 

1 hour ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

shortcut

A shortcut that takes 2-3 years. That’s a long shortcut lol

 

1 hour ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

they are not required to stay committed to the marriage

Thank God they aren’t. So what you’re saying is that ideally, they would have to sign a sort of contract to stay “committed to the marriage” at all costs? Even if spouse is abusive or cheats?

 

1 hour ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

Why should some spouses be exempt from numerical limitations when vast majorities are not?

Have you ever heard of family reunification? So are you suggesting that LPRs leave their families behind? 

[Swimming_Upstream 13]

27 minutes ago, Rocio0010 said:

Not really, because healthcare is private, so if they pay into it, how is it a burden ?

 

A shortcut that takes 2-3 years. That’s a long shortcut lol

 

Thank God they aren’t. So what you’re saying is that ideally, they would have to sign a sort of contract to stay “committed to the marriage” at all costs? Even if spouse is abusive or cheats?

 

Have you ever heard of family reunification? So are you suggesting that LPRs leave their families behind? 

Thanks for your feedback!
IR5 - Parents: On average 10 thousand parents are getting their Green cards per month for the last few months. How many can afford to pay for private insurance? Medicare in many states are being used by them, in addition to emergency services.
IR1 - Spouses: Multiple immigration attorneys claim that the Spouse green card process takes 9 to 12 mths. So it is a shortcut, compared to 8 - 20 years for some other categories. And well, they don't have to sign a contract, and that's the point. Typically people become so frustrated from either (1) not getting sponsorship from their employers, or (2) waiting for too long in one of the other categories, that they are left with no other choice but to go for IR1/CR1.
FX - Exempt spouses for LPR's: They can apply jointly with their main applicant spouses, or they can apply under F2A. Can someone really explain the reason behind keeping two categories  (F2A and FX) for Spouses of LPR's?
 

[Rocio0010 5,579]

30 minutes ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

Medicare in many states are being used by them

Source? What statistics do you have? And also, they require a five year residency

 

30 minutes ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

Multiple immigration attorneys claim that the Spouse green card process takes 9 to 12 mths

Of course an immigration attorney is going to say that. I’d take whatever an attorney says with a packet of salt. 
 

Is F2A follow to join?

Edited June 28, 2023 by Rocio0010

[Boiler 45,447]

There is quite a lot wrong, but the first question is of course why does this matter, they system is what it is.

[OldUser 6,608]

How do immigrants benefit US economy?

 

In my opinion, here is the minimal list:

 

Income taxes

Property taxes

Sales taxes

Purchases / services from local businesses

Supporting banking system by using credit and spending. More people translates into more spending, benefiting economy.

 

Also, how does staying / not staying in marriage change benefit to the US from all of those streams above? Why does it matter whether immigrant is skilled or not in the grand scheme of things? There's tons of unskilled job positions open that many US citizens won't take due to low pay. There's also no shortage of skilled immigrants coming to the US taking high paying jobs.

 

Edited June 28, 2023 by OldUser

[Lemonslice 4,831]

Some might be "unqualified" workers, whatever that means in your opinion... However, a lot of job postings around here are for level entry positions, so, seems like there's a need for workers with all levels of qualification. 

 

...

Part of my personal opinion is that I don't think everything has to be seen through economics glasses. Rest of my opinion, I'll keep to myself.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Lemonslice

[LucindaLou 43]

Quote

Start with the easy one, DV. The basic premise is to make America more diverse, or representative of all countries/cultures, but does that automatically mean that it will help the economy? 

By ensuring diversity you stand a much better chance to fill niche markets. It also will prevent certain societal changes that might be detrimental to the country. Homogenous societies do often not fare well do to the lack of outside impulses.

 

Quote

IR5, Parents and F4, Siblings. Bringing parents may give some peace of mind to new citizens, but are they not a burden to the healthcare system? Are all Siblings technically qualified or are skilled enough for the US job market? It doesn't make sense to allow residency for just being a parent or sibling of a citizen without any qualifications. 

Every person sponsoring an immigrant is financially responsible for said immigrant, meaning the sponsor is liable for cost. Also many parents and most siblings are still of working age when coming to the US and able to contribute. Additionally for some countries retirement benefits of the home country carry over, so little risk, decent pay out.

 

Quote

IR1, Spouse of US citizens. This is one of the most abused visa categories. People who have no other way of getting residency, or who can not afford to wait in the very long wait lists in other categories, typically attempt for this shortcut, and find a suitable citizen partner. Once green card in hand, they are not required to stay committed to the marriage.

Alright, I will bite. Marriage to a US citizen by no means is a short cut. As a German citizen marrying a US soldier in Germany the paperwork started even before we were married. We needed to file papers with the post commander to even get married, jump through hoops at the German court for my husband`s previous divorce from a USC and all that was not even starting the process of getting a green card.

While in the US I attended a community college and a university, worked, paid property taxes, ... and all while not being entitled to anything from the US government.

We have been back in Germany for some time and now my husband would like to return home. Guess what after 27 years of marriage I still have to jump through all the immigration hoops for a good year to two. A short cut it is not!

 

Quote

And finally FX. Regular applicants of green cards typically include their Spouses and children under various employment and other categories, including F2A. But this FX is a special category for the spouses who are considered "Exempt". Why should some spouses be exempt from numerical limitations when vast majorities are not?

So you do not believe that families should be allowed to live together. Why not prioritize the spouse of an American tex payer over someone without any ties to the US?

[Redro 4,611]

12 hours ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

The following categories are most subscribed to, or gets the most number of Green cards on a regular basis:

 

1. IR5 - Parents of US citizens

2. DV - Diversity Visa

3. IR1 - Spouse of US citizens

4. FX - Spouse of lawful permanent residents (exempt from country quota limitations)

5. F4 - Siblings of US citizens

 

Let's see if and how these groups of people contribute to the US economy. There are some hard truths that need to be discussed. Twenty first century demands that to be successful, the workforce be technically knowledgeable and skilled.

 

Start with the easy one, DV. The basic premise is to make America more diverse, or representative of all countries/cultures, but does that automatically mean that it will help the economy? 

 

IR5, Parents and F4, Siblings. Bringing parents may give some peace of mind to new citizens, but are they not a burden to the healthcare system? Are all Siblings technically qualified or are skilled enough for the US job market? It doesn't make sense to allow residency for just being a parent or sibling of a citizen without any qualifications.

 

IR1, Spouse of US citizens. This is one of the most abused visa categories. People who have no other way of getting residency, or who can not afford to wait in the very long wait lists in other categories, typically attempt for this shortcut, and find a suitable citizen partner. Once green card in hand, they are not required to stay committed to the marriage.

 

And finally FX. Regular applicants of green cards typically include their Spouses and children under various employment and other categories, including F2A. But this FX is a special category for the spouses who are considered "Exempt". Why should some spouses be exempt from numerical limitations when vast majorities are not?

 

So which groups should ideally get the priorities?

 

A. IR2 - Children of US citizens

B. F2B - 21+ children of LPR

C. F1 - 21+ children of US citizens

D. E2, E3 - Employment based

 

Children should stay with their parents, so they should have the permanent resident status. Even if they are above 21 years of age, parents sponsorship helps them to gain education and subsequently employment. Other sources of sponsorship are increasingly hard to get these days. 

 

Please feel free to provide feedback on the topics discussed above. 

 

Am I understanding your question correctly? 

So, you are comparing:

1. IR5 - Parents of US citizens

2. DV - Diversity Visa

3. IR1 - Spouse of US citizens

4. FX - Spouse of lawful permanent residents (exempt from country quota limitations)

5. F4 - Siblings of US citizens

TO

A. IR2 - Children of US citizens

B. F2B - 21+ children of LPR

C. F1 - 21+ children of US citizens

D. E2, E3 - Employment based

And list number ONE is  most subscribed (and that is bad) but applicants from list number TWO should be prioritized?

 

[Crazy Cat 41,813]

10 hours ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

Typically people become so frustrated from either (1) not getting sponsorship from their employers, or (2) waiting for too long in one of the other categories, that they are left with no other choice but to go for IR1/CR1.

Please show me the data to support that statement.  

Edited June 28, 2023 by Crazy Cat

[Swimming_Upstream 13]

13 hours ago, Rocio0010 said:

Source? What statistics do you have? And also, they require a five year residency

 

Of course an immigration attorney is going to say that. I’d take whatever an attorney says with a packet of salt. 
 

Is F2A follow to join?

Yes, while they just have to wait for five years, applicants from F1, F2B have to wait for 8+ years, and E2, E3 applicants from India have to wait for 12+ years just to get their priority dates current. 
The time line mentioned for IR1 - Spouse, is for applicants already living in the US.
F2A is defined in the Visa Bulletin as Spouse and Children of Permanent residents.

[Swimming_Upstream 13]

11 hours ago, Boiler said:

There is quite a lot wrong, but the first question is of course why does this matter, they system is what it is.

And the system is not working for many of the applicants who can be valuable contributors to the economy. If you compare the priorities given to first group of applicants (1-5) vs to those of group A-B, it's clear.

[Daphne . 1,852]

16 hours ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

IR1, Spouse of US citizens. This is one of the most abused visa categories. People who have no other way of getting residency, or who can not afford to wait in the very long wait lists in other categories, typically attempt for this shortcut, and find a suitable citizen partner. Once green card in hand, they are not required to stay committed to the marriage.

Wait, what?! I am the foreign national and working my ### off to help US Citizens and LPR's find a job, I work at a Staffing Firm. So I would be the exception to your assumption, because my job literally impacts the US economy!

 

Are you suggesting that most foreign spouses don't join the workforce? Even if they leave their spouse, the foreign national will still contribute to the US economy by working and spending their hard earned cash.

[Swimming_Upstream 13]

9 hours ago, OldUser said:

How do immigrants benefit US economy?

 

In my opinion, here is the minimal list:

 

Income taxes

Property taxes

Sales taxes

Purchases / services from local businesses

Supporting banking system by using credit and spending. More people translates into more spending, benefiting economy.

 

Also, how does staying / not staying in marriage change benefit to the US from all of those streams above? Why does it matter whether immigrant is skilled or not in the grand scheme of things? There's tons of unskilled job positions open that many US citizens won't take due to low pay. There's also no shortage of skilled immigrants coming to the US taking high paying jobs.

 

Sure, Immigrants benefit the economy. But the topic is , who is being given priority? Most people in the first group (1-4) have no numerical limits and so the only delay is the procedural delay. Whereas people in the second group (B-D) have numerical or country based limits, which is forcing them to wait 8+ years just to become current.

And of course there are tons of unskilled job positions open. But for those jobs do we really need to invite green card applications from foreigners with no numerical limitations and higher priority? Isn't a work permit system that can be renewed every 3 or 5 years a better option?

Edited June 28, 2023 by Swimming_Upstream

[Redro 4,611]

7 minutes ago, Swimming_Upstream said:

Sure, Immigrants benefit the economy. But the topic is , who is being given priority? Most people in the first group (1-4) have no numerical limits and so the only delay is the procedural delay. Whereas people in the second group (A-D) have numerical or country based limits, which is forcing them to wait 8+ years just to become current.

IR2 has no numerical limits…