Electric vehicles have an efficiency problem

[Dashinka 24,479]

13 minutes ago, Mike E said:

As we do not wear a diaper, my wife and I can’t go 500 miles without a bio break. She drinks 2 liters of H20 a day. I am drinking a six pack of caffeinated fluids every 500 miles. The beer is actually only when I celebrate surviving the latest encounter with an inept driver.

 

Drove a gasoline powered rental one way to Los Angeles 2 weeks ago: 530 miles. Stopped for gas 4 times to use rest rooms. Only once to fill up (on the AZ side of the state line to save on gas, given the gas in Blythe is apparently fortified with gold dust) and the other 3 times just a gallon so that I qualified as a  customer for rest room access.

 

Driving an ICE car saved me exactly zero minutes versus driving a Tesla. 

 

 

They are actually.

 

In the article it was after 10pm and the public rest room at shopping mall colocated with the fast charger was closed. Plausible, but

 

* with proper advance planning, this is avoidable, since most fast chargers for Interstate highway routings are co located with gas stations.

 

* most people do not do road trips after 10pm

 

* if I am still on the road after 10 pm, it won’t be to gas up or charge up. It will be to head to a place with a bed to sleep in, such as a hotel or my home.

 

Consider that Elon Musk might not be the moron the far right and far left makes him out to be. When they can figure out to land a rocket on a barge in middle of the ocean, then they just might have the standing to critique where he places his EV chargers.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My wife and I often plan road trips after 10pm to avoid the inept drivers.

[TBoneTX 45,248]

2 hours ago, Mike E said:

the other 3 times just a gallon so that I qualified as a customer for rest room access

Never heard of this.  More California tyranny?

[Mike E 11,739]

4 minutes ago, TBoneTX said:

Never heard of this.  More California tyranny?

I do not feel entitled to use a private establishment’s rest room unless I am a paying customer.

 

 

 

 

[Ban Hammer 13,327]

2 hours ago, Mike E said:

Driving an ICE car saved me exactly zero minutes versus driving a Tesla. 

 

 

how long were those bathroom stops? 

[Mike E 11,739]

4 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

how long were those bathroom stops? 

 

 

* 5 minutes to off ramp to station. Longer to avoid Chevron / Texaco which is harder to do in AZ and CA

* 5 minutes to pump a gallon of gas and pay at pump

* 5 minutes to clean windshield and head lights

* 2 minutes to move car from pump so that others can pump fuel

* figure another 3 minutes to wait for my wife to return from the rest room, since in California I don’t like to leave my vehicle with valuables unattended and her being a person lacking male genitals (what society used to call a female), her wait is usually longer 

*  5 minutes in the rest room for me if no wait, and paper towels available to dry hands after washing. Otherwise under the futility of the air dryer, and then 

* 5 minutes to on ramp to freeway

* This does not account for the overhead of pan handlers (a common problem in California, NM, and CO).

 

So at least 30 minutes.

 

Versus an EV:

 

* 10 minutes off/on ramp

* 20 minutes to charge, during which there is plenty of time to use the nearest rest room and pay the noble merchant for a token  product like a snack or beverage.  

* cleaning windshield and head lamps not essential since the car does most of the driving

 

As an immigrant, I am curious how a much time a natural born American spends on a bio stop while on an Interstate.  Perhaps there is some thing essential and actually practical that the Civics Test did not cover that I am missing.

 

As per the cited article, apparently it is good form to urinate in public, which admittedly would save significant  time. But this is not a habit I care to adopt.

 

 

 

[Ban Hammer 13,327]

10 hours ago, Mike E said:

 

 

* 5 minutes to off ramp to station. Longer to avoid Chevron / Texaco which is harder to do in AZ and CA

* 5 minutes to pump a gallon of gas and pay at pump

* 5 minutes to clean windshield and head lights

* 2 minutes to move car from pump so that others can pump fuel

* figure another 3 minutes to wait for my wife to return from the rest room, since in California I don’t like to leave my vehicle with valuables unattended and her being a person lacking male genitals (what society used to call a female), her wait is usually longer 

*  5 minutes in the rest room for me if no wait, and paper towels available to dry hands after washing. Otherwise under the futility of the air dryer, and then 

* 5 minutes to on ramp to freeway

* This does not account for the overhead of pan handlers (a common problem in California, NM, and CO).

 

So at least 30 minutes.

 

Versus an EV:

 

* 10 minutes off/on ramp

* 20 minutes to charge, during which there is plenty of time to use the nearest rest room and pay the noble merchant for a token  product like a snack or beverage.  

* cleaning windshield and head lamps not essential since the car does most of the driving

 

As an immigrant, I am curious how a much time a natural born American spends on a bio stop while on an Interstate.  Perhaps there is some thing essential and actually practical that the Civics Test did not cover that I am missing.

 

As per the cited article, apparently it is good form to urinate in public, which admittedly would save significant  time. But this is not a habit I care to adopt.

 

 

 

i suspect that 20 min of charging won't get one very far.........

[Mike E 11,739]

1 hour ago, Ban Hammer said:

i suspect that 20 min of charging won't get one very far.........

https://news.energysage.com/tesla-supercharger-guide/
 

Maximum miles added with Tesla Superchargers

TESLA MODEL	MAXIMUM SUPERCHARGING DISTANCED GAINED AFTER 15 MINUTES
Model 3	175 miles
Model S	200 miles
Model X	175 miles
Model Y	162 miles

[Dashinka 24,479]

14 hours ago, Mike E said:

I do not feel entitled to use a private establishment’s rest room unless I am a paying customer.

 

 

 

 

I agree.  If I need to use a restroom at a filling station and don’t need fuel, I always purchase something.

[Dashinka 24,479]

13 hours ago, Mike E said:

 

 

* 5 minutes to off ramp to station. Longer to avoid Chevron / Texaco which is harder to do in AZ and CA

* 5 minutes to pump a gallon of gas and pay at pump

* 5 minutes to clean windshield and head lights

* 2 minutes to move car from pump so that others can pump fuel

* figure another 3 minutes to wait for my wife to return from the rest room, since in California I don’t like to leave my vehicle with valuables unattended and her being a person lacking male genitals (what society used to call a female), her wait is usually longer 

*  5 minutes in the rest room for me if no wait, and paper towels available to dry hands after washing. Otherwise under the futility of the air dryer, and then 

* 5 minutes to on ramp to freeway

* This does not account for the overhead of pan handlers (a common problem in California, NM, and CO).

 

So at least 30 minutes.

 

Versus an EV:

 

* 10 minutes off/on ramp

* 20 minutes to charge, during which there is plenty of time to use the nearest rest room and pay the noble merchant for a token  product like a snack or beverage.  

* cleaning windshield and head lamps not essential since the car does most of the driving

 

As an immigrant, I am curious how a much time a natural born American spends on a bio stop while on an Interstate.  Perhaps there is some thing essential and actually practical that the Civics Test did not cover that I am missing.

 

As per the cited article, apparently it is good form to urinate in public, which admittedly would save significant  time. But this is not a habit I care to adopt.

 

 

 

Even if the car is doing the driving, how is it avoiding the bugs?  I thought Tesla used vision systems for their autopilot along with ultrasonic and radar.  Some of those cameras are mounted behind the windshield, so still subject to bug splatter.

 

My wife and I have never spent more than 15 minutes on a fuel stop.  We can combine filling with her bathroom break, then I can go, and in the end we have 500+ miles of added range.

 

One wonders if EVs were the main choice 100 years ago, would we be all agog for ICE right about now.

Edited September 10, 2023 by Dashinka

[Mike E 11,739]

9 hours ago, Dashinka said:

Even if the car is doing the driving, how is it avoiding the bugs?

I just have to keep the camera clean. It is behind the windshield. The wipers do the job, I suppose. I have never had autopilot refuse to work because of camera problems except when driving due west into a sunset or due east into a sunrise.

 

 

9 hours ago, Dashinka said:

would we be all agog for ICE right about now.

I can see it now:

 

Emerging ICE technology promises to reduce housing costs and change  transportation and aerospace

 

Imagine if you did not need a $100,000 electrical system and $300 / month electric bill to keep your car running?

Well, Elon Musk, the founder of Petro-X, a company that mines a substance called “oil” at Giga Mines in Pennsylvania, Texas, and California, has the answer.

 

“When we started Petro-X, our mission was focused on the problem of preventing kids in my mother’s homeland of Canada from freezing to death during electrical blackouts”. Musk is referring to Petro-X’s oil fueled backup electric generators that will keep an electric furnace running. “When we noticed some of our customers were using the generators all the time, we discovered it was cheaper for them than to pay the utility for electricity”. 
 

“So then we rolled out oil powered furnaces the skip the electricity generation for higher energy efficiency”

”Then we asked ourselves can we go from petroleum straight to energy in other ways?l

And that way was a oil burning “internal combustion engine” aka ICE. 

“We retrofitted ICEs onto cars, and found greater efficiency because batteries literally weigh  a ton and the equivalent energy in oil weighs under 200 pounds”.
 

But in Musk’s ancestral land, there were problems. 
 

“Oil does not flow well when it gets cold, and the ICE would not start. We could use batteries to keep it warm but then we lose efficiency. But our chemists came to the rescue.”

Petro-X figured out how to refine oil into a fuel called gasoline. 
 

“Gasoline, or just ‘gas’ as I like to call it, flows well at even -40 degrees.”

The improved gas powered cars have already rolled out in Duluth Minnesota.

Petro-X car owner Lars Hansen says:

”When it gets cold, my car battery would lose range just from

sitting outside. With my gas car, the energy stays in the fuel tank.”

But what about re-fueling? Musk has the answer.

”At first we thought about extending our home heating oil delivery service to deliver gasoline. But after too many fatal house fires, we realized we needed the car owners to come to us to safely refuel.”

Petro-X is creating a network of “Super Fuelers” where car owners can refuel, aka “pump gas”

”At most it will take 15 minutes out of the day to ‘fill  ‘er up’”
 

At  10 miles per gallon (mpg) a Petro-X family sedan will get 200 miles of range.

The result will be less demand on America’s power grid, and cheaper home prices.

”Think of it: the most expensive cost of a home today isn’t the walls. It is the electrical stuff: solar panels, batteries, 1000 amp electrical panels, copper wiring. We can reduce that cost from lver $100,000 to $10,000 less with gas cars, and oil powered home heating,  stoves, and ovens. And use the oil generator for the AC compressor”

Home builders are already talking about a concept called “multi family housing”, where homes would be stacked upon each other, as high as  5 levels, using a new material called ‘steel’ made possible with the high temperatures that petroleum can produce.

”If you don’t need solar panels, you don’t need a roof for every home. Remember, the main reason we have roofs is to keep us dry, not to capture energy. I feel we have lost sight of that. Not everyone needs a 7000 square foot house. These big homes have forced us to have too few people in this country. I think 30 million is too low. For our American race to survive, we need at least

100 million people. I get stared at for having 3 kids. I want at least 5 or 6.

But Musk’s vision does not end there.

“It takes 300 hours to fly coast to coast in a hot air air ship (blimp). While our oil burning heat exchanger has allowed air ship lines to reduce passenger ticket prices because we don’t need heavy batteries now, we are prototyping  winged aircraft the are propelled by a gas ICE turning a fan that blows air. We think we can fly LA to NY in 30 hours.”

Musk is also looking to revolutionize space by going back to an old idea: rockets.

”When the West learned of Chinese gunpowder  rockets, it improved the idea by using gun powder  to fire cannon balls. Now we use cannons to put satellites in space and deliver nuclear war heads to spread democracy. But in principle  can use refine oil to make fuels that are higher energy than gasoline to lift multi stage rockets into  space, and maybe even deliver payloads to the moon. And, hear me out, we could put humans in space with the power of oil!”

[TBoneTX 45,248]

Hilarious: Granholm's EV Road Trip Turns Into an Entitlement Clown Show, Family Forced to Call Police

 

Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm set out on a four-day trip this summer. The trip was to prove the worth of the Biden administration's spending a ton on pushing and "investing" in electric vehicles.  [...]

 

https://redstate.com/nick-arama/2023/09/10/granholms-roadtrip-to-prove-worth-of-electric-vehicles-goes-all-kinds-of-wrong-n2163646

[Dashinka 24,479]

5 hours ago, TBoneTX said:

Hilarious: Granholm's EV Road Trip Turns Into an Entitlement Clown Show, Family Forced to Call Police

 

Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm set out on a four-day trip this summer. The trip was to prove the worth of the Biden administration's spending a ton on pushing and "investing" in electric vehicles.  [...]

 

https://redstate.com/nick-arama/2023/09/10/granholms-roadtrip-to-prove-worth-of-electric-vehicles-goes-all-kinds-of-wrong-n2163646

Granholm was a failed MI governor and a Canadian Leftist.  It is not surprising her entitled trip was full of snafus.  I agree, it was telling they did not have an Tesla's in the EV group (it was also interesting the advanced team was using ICE vehicles).  As I have said time and time again, EVs are not bad vehicles, and they might be good for many folks, but they have limitations, and lack utility.  Sure they may be less likely to need maintenance except of course for their massive amount of software, and their tires. 

[Dashinka 24,479]

Pretty much as expected.  While I agree the insurance rates on EVs may come down some over time, the fact that the battery pack can be damaged even by a minor accident will leave them higher than their ICE equivalent.

 

'Our Tesla insurance is DOUBLE what we pay for our gas car!' Married couple is shocked to discover high cost of covering electric vehicles - so why DO insurers penalize eco-drivers?

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/yourmoney/electric-vehicles/article-12509077/Tesla-electric-vehicle-insurance-DOUBLE-gas-car.html

[TBoneTX 45,248]

British to Be Forced to Drive Electric

 

LONDON - British Prime Minister Rishi Sunak has rejected appeals from the Conservative Party to extend the deadline for requiring all new car sales in the UK to be electric by 2030.  The Tories say the goal is impossible to meet.  [...]

 

https://townhall.com/columnists/calthomas/2023/09/21/british-to-be-forced-to-drive-electric-n2628711

[Mike E 11,739]

The Tories have yet another reason to dump Rishi now.