May 24, 2022 -- Deadly shooting at Texas elementary school

[LIBrty4all 3,749]

1 minute ago, ROK2USA said:

https://www.vox.com/23125706/ukraine-aid-russia-invasion-us-40-billion

 

The Senate voted 86 to 11 to pass a $40 billion Ukraine aid package Thursday in the latest bipartisan signal of Washington’s deepening commitment to Ukraine’s grinding war against Russia.

The bill includes a huge one-time outlay of military and security assistance, along with funding for mounting economic and humanitarian needs. This latest legislation comes in addition to the $13.6 billion in emergency assistance for Ukraine that Congress approved in March, bringing the total of the United States’ Ukraine aid to a historic $53 billion since the start of the war.

 

$13.6 billion is emergency money (approved in March)

$40 billion is additional money. Part of the money goes towards securing embassies... reuters article I posted gives a little details of what the money will be used for. 

First article you posted was written in March. 

Articles I posted are from May. They just decided this on Thursday 16 May. 

 

Thank you, makes sense.  I guess I was overlooking the MAR/MAY thing.

[Redro 4,611]

6 minutes ago, LIBrty4all said:

https://theconversation.com/us-aid-to-ukraine-13-6-billion-approved-following-russian-bombardment-marks-sharp-increase-179172  Published: March 14, 2022 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/03/18/upshot/ukraine-aid-details.html - March 18

 

https://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2014/03/why-is-the-u-s-sending-1-billion-to-ukraine -  March 4, 2014

 

I can do that too.  SO... which is correct?

 

[Mike E 11,739]

Delete.  Never mind. 

Edited May 28, 2022 by Mike E

[Boiler 45,443]

Let us say you made all schools hardened surrounded by fences and guards, we would be talking about Supermarket killers.

[Carpe Vinum 2,327]

17 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Let us say you made all schools hardened surrounded by fences and guards, we would be talking about Supermarket killers.

Yesterday a man open carried a rifle into a supermarket here in St. Louis. As he left a man pulled out a gun and robbed him of his rifle. The man who was robbed then went to his car and pulled a gun and shot the man who robbed him. Then a second man arrived and shot the robber again. It never stops here. My wife and I drive 30 minutes to another county to shop.

[MarJhi 958]

7 hours ago, LIBrty4all said:

11:27 AM – Exterior door where shooter entered was propped open by a teacher.
11:28 AM – Shooter’s vehicle crashes into a ditch.
11:28 AM – Teacher runs to room 132 to retrieve her phone and door remains propped open.
11:30 AM – Teacher calls 911 to report the crash and a man with a gun.
11:31 AM – The suspect reaches last row of vehicles in the school parking lot.
11:31 AM – Shooter approaches school, shooting at the classroom windows as he approaches.
11:31 AM – Patrol vehicles arrive at funeral home.
11:32 AM – Multiple shots fired at the school.
11:33 AM – Shooter enters the school, begins firing into room 111 or 112; at least 100 rounds fired.
11:35 AM – Three Uvalde PD officers enter school through same door shooter entered, quickly followed by three more Uvalde PD and one sheriff’s deputy.
11:36 AM – Three Uvalde PD officers approach the classroom door and two are shot; they fall back.
11:37 AM – Shooter fires 16 rounds.
11:51 AM – Police sergeant arrived.
12:03 PM – Additional officers arrive; “There were as many as 19 officers at that time in that hallway.”
12:03 PM – 911 call from room 112 lasting 1 minute, 23 seconds.
12:10 PM – 911 call from room 112, advised multiple are dead.
12:13 PM – 911 call from room 112.

12:16 PM – 911 call from room 111, caller reporting there are eight to nine students alive.
12:15 PM – Members of BORTAC arrived, along with shields.
12:19 PM – 911 call from room 111, caller hung up when another student told them to.
12:21 PM – Shooter fired again, “It was believed to be at the door.”
12:21 PM – 911 call from room 111.
12:21 PM – Law enforcement moved down the hallway.
12:26 PM – 911 call from student lasting 26 seconds.
12:26 PM – 911 call from the same student, reports that the killer shot the door. Student was told to stay on the line and to be very quiet.
12:46 PM – 911 caller says she can hear police next door.
12:47 PM – Asked 911 to “please send the police now.”
12:50 PM – Officers breached the locked classroom door using keys provided by the janitor.

And the "shootout" with police before he entered the school never happened. The school resource officer was off campus when the whole thing started. 

[Dashinka 24,479]

7 hours ago, LIBrty4all said:

Where did this $40 billion figure come from?  I keep hearing it.  But...

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ukraine-aid-biden-signs-omnibus-bill-2022-03-15/

I posted an article in the Ukraine thread.  The great thing about this most recent outlay to the Ukraine is that there will be almost no oversight on the spending, what is delivered, and who gets it.

[Dashinka 24,479]

9 hours ago, Mike E said:

What we did have in the 1970s was students who committed suicide.   

 

Mass school shooters are students / ex-students who commit suicide  and  take others with them.  
 

So why are they taking others with them?

 

Someone thought of it first. Airplane hijackings weren’t a problem when commercial aviation started. Then someone thought of hijacking.  And the problem is escalated then plummeted when metal detectors and X-rays were added. 
 

The first mass school shooter get lots of news play. Eventually others realized this was the path to are immortality “better to burn out than fade away”  The 24 hour news cycle invented by CNN in the 1980s accelerated awareness and inspiration others. 
 

 It isn’t limited to schools. It happens in work places too. “Going postal” was a term invented in the 1980s.  
 

Why suicide?

many if not most of them are bullied. Most schools  don’t do anything about bullying. If anything it is worse than in the 1970s.    Schools have zero tolerance policies that punish victims for defending themselves.  
 

When kids l got access to the internet and mobile phones, this amplified bullying.   Social media made it worse.  
 

If you accept that bullying is the catalyst to create the mass shooter / suicider then we start to tackle this at the source:

 

* deny federal funding to schools that tolerate bullying.  This lets schools have flexibility to try local solutions. 
* encourage and teach coping strategies. My brother (RIP) was rarely bullied because he had a sense of humor and the would be bully would end up ROTFL.  
* ban minors from social media and much in the way liquor stores are sanctioned for selling alcohol to minors, do the same to social media sites 

* for schools with too much bullying, put the bullies in a lottery and winner is made a public example:

- removed from society for an attempt at rehabilitation. As part of this, if there are underlying issues that trigger this behavior in a bully (medical, abuse from parents, other bullies) these issues are dealt with

- the parents of other bullies pay the costs of rehabilitation of the lottery winner 

- the lottery winner is on a watch list until the winner convinces the bully parole board that there has been rehabilitation.  

 

 
 

 

Well said.  The only thing I would add is many of these perpetrators have an atrocious family life.  The kid in Michigan, even though he had both parents at home, it seems they were living their own lives, at least one having a fairly open affair, and all but ignoring the kid.

[Ban Hammer 13,327]

8 hours ago, LIBrty4all said:

I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy.

tagline thief!

[Redro 4,611]

54 minutes ago, Dashinka said:

I posted an article in the Ukraine thread.  The great thing about this most recent outlay to the Ukraine is that there will be almost no oversight on the spending, what is delivered, and who gets it.

I think Bill Maher had a whole thing about military spending in one of his episodes... 

We watch his show every week. I'm not really a fan but I know he has people on with different views. I find it informative. 

[Kai G. Llewellyn 832]

10 hours ago, LIBrty4all said:

We didn't need mental healthcare nearly as much 40 or 50 years ago.  Why are there so many wackadoos today that "need help"?  Why do people feel they need a psychiatrist to cope with life?  Not trying to come across as a jerk, but I truly don't understand it.  And I know I am not the only well-adjusted person around wondering the same thing.

Given that you've effectively called me a wakadoo, I'm out. I'm done here.

 

Go Google it yourself and learn something.

[yuna628 9,671]

13 hours ago, LIBrty4all said:

We didn't need mental healthcare nearly as much 40 or 50 years ago.  Why are there so many wackadoos today that "need help"?  Why do people feel they need a psychiatrist to cope with life?  Not trying to come across as a jerk, but I truly don't understand it.  And I know I am not the only well-adjusted person around wondering the same thing.

So, I just want to say this as gingerly as I can, as I think it is a topic that people really need to be mindful of others when discussing it..  It's not that we didn't *need* mental healthcare as much 50 years ago. If anything, people have always needed mental healthcare, but were unable to seek it, as people did not understand it. I come from a family that had a variety of 'issues', issues that would have made it a lot less dysfunctional if people had sought help. 50 years ago, we were locking people up and basically torturing them. Depression happened. Suicide happened. All sorts of things. We just didn't speak of it, as people were ashamed. It's never shameful to get help. We know some issues may very well be genetic, some issues are within the brain, and some are the result of trauma and abuse. I have been through some very difficult things in my life, never sought help, and pushed through it, because I know that there are some people in even worse experiences than me. It's probably pride, it's probably stubbornness.. and maybe I will talk to someone about it someday. I don't think that it's a bad thing to do so. 

 

In 1935, my great grandfather committed suicide. He lived in a tiny town. A farmer and father of nine children. I can only imagine the stigma my great grandmother went through, and how she had to cope. This is something I discovered while investigating my family tree in around say... 2010. This was kept a great secret of shame for that long. The story passed from generations was that he had passed in an accident or passed due to TB. The truth was, something snapped in him during WWI, and the man that came home was not the same man. He had no one to help him through that, and he suffered mentally. I have a family member that is bipolar. For many years they had no help, and it is always difficult when they are not taking their medication or are having mental breaks. You don't really know what it's like, unless you've been there or seen people go through it.

 

I just know this kid was not a good person, fundamentally because he also came from a family life that created that personality. And whether by part mental illness, part being taught to hate others, this conditioned him into the evil we are finding out about now. Not every kid will turn out this way. He needed help and did not get it. I know that may come off sounding sympathetic, it's not.. and I'm glad he's dead. But I wish we could get to a point where we could stop these people before they harm others.

[Ban Hammer 13,327]

2 hours ago, yuna628 said:

In 1935, my great grandfather committed suicide. He lived in a tiny town. A farmer and father of nine children

 

1935 was right in the middle of the great depression too - it must have been stressful to provide for 9 kids during that.

[TBoneTX 45,250]

Wow.  WOW.  Read and comment, please.

Quote

No Duty to Protect

 

The May 24 massacre in Uvalde, Texas outrages the conscience, though not for the facile and stupid reasons spewed by every prominent Democratic Party politician, half-witted newspaper columnist, and vapid television talking-head.  [...]

 

https://amgreatness.com/2022/05/28/no-duty-to-protect/  

 

 

Edited May 29, 2022 by TBoneTX

[LIBrty4all 3,749]

22 hours ago, Kai G. Llewellyn said:

Given that you've effectively called me a wakadoo, I'm out. I'm done here.

 

Go Google it yourself and learn something.

Well, you're here having rational conversation with us and not out murdering innocent people, so the term wackadoo doesn't exactly fit you.  And I have read up on it (only a.little, admittedly).  And I still don't get it. I grew up poor.  My parents (and aunts/uncles) fought and argued.  I lived with my grandparents for a while when my parents nearly got a divorce (they never did, ended up married for 50+ years).  But we led what I would imagine is pretty normal for many families trying to get along in life.  We kids were not spoiled with things, only love.  And sometimes it sucked.  And sometimes it was good.  IOW... "normal".  And no one in my family (at least up until my generation) ever needed "counseling".  About 3 years ago, I have a cousin who's kid decided they wanted to be a different gender, and I know it rocked his world for awhile, and there might have been some psychiatrist involvement there, but cannot say for sure.

 

Prior to 1987 there were no mass school shootings. (1999 seems to be the first one I can find).  Guess what happened in 1987?  Prozac was unleashed on the public.  And then over-prescribed in an attempt to "fix" people.  And from thinking back on these mass shootings, particularly the ones at schools, pretty much ALL the shooters were either on, or withdrawing from, mood drugs of some variety.

 

And for @yuna628, I meant to comment sooner on the violent games that you and your husband played... I guess I wasn't clear that violent games themselves are not the problem.  Heck, my son and I played them together, and he's well past teenhood and a well-functioning married adult now.  As am I (most days).  But perhaps you, your husband, I, and thousands more like us are PERFECTLY CAPABLE of playing any sort of game, turning it off, and it has no effect on our psyches nor our daily lives because the proper synapses are firing in our heads.  Or, we are simply not evil creatures just waiting for an outlet?  IDK.  But I wasn't blaming the games alone.  It takes more than that.

Having said that, I play 2-3 games on my phone for free, and they are full of ads for other games.  One was for a game that modeled the "Squid Game" movie.  Very sick graphics.  And targeting kids.  Another one I just saw in the past few days involves bad guys driving up behind little girls and kidnapping them, then the mother (parents?) need "your help to find their little girl".  How sick is THAT???  But it's going to appeal to some sickos out there, and inspire them to do it IRL, I am sure.