New travel restrictions may require rapid PCR test within 24 hours of departure.

[millefleur 5,047]

4 minutes ago, Mike E said:

* 400 people test positive then on average 159 of them are negative.  So 159 people are needlessly locked up for 2 weeks.  

And that is the PCR test. I would assume the rapid tests are even less accurate.

[Puppythecat 89]

42 minutes ago, millefleur said:

Looked it up because I was curious. Found some numbers here:

https://www.icd10monitor.com/false-positives-in-pcr-tests-for-covid-19

 

 

I have zero math skills so maybe someone much smarter can make sense of this.

It means 1 in 200 people trying to board the plane will test positive even though they don't have covid.

[igoyougoduke 1,662]

2 hours ago, Puppythecat said:

Ocean liners are an interesting alternative.  You wouldn't even have to test anyone before getting on the boat because it would be assumed that everyone on board would catch covid during the journey.  Then just wait in port at the destination until everyone is feeling better.

seriously what a waste with testing and money before boarding.  

[igoyougoduke 1,662]

2 hours ago, Mike E said:

Or just do what they now and not test anyone arriving in the USA.  

tests are useless unless everyone has a helmet around themselves that tests your inner nose every minute for infection 

[Mike E 11,741]

16 minutes ago, igoyougoduke said:

tests are useless unless everyone has a helmet around themselves that tests your inner nose every minute for infection 

Yes.  
 

Mexico still seems to be the least insane of all conveniently to access countries, though they are  deranged when it comes to masks. So Mexico will be getting most of my international travel budget for the remainder of my life (I don’t expect sanity to return again until there is a Covid treatment that actually works, I.e., never)

[Crazy Cat 41,984]

My wife talked to United Airlines.  Nothing official from them yet, but they told her about an antigen test which she can get the day before her flight in Taipei.  They said she will receive the results by 6:00 pm.  I guess we'll see what happens next Wednesday.

[Locito 85]

2 hours ago, Crazy Cat said:

My wife talked to United Airlines.  Nothing official from them yet, but they told her about an antigen test which she can get the day before her flight in Taipei.  They said she will receive the results by 6:00 pm.  I guess we'll see what happens next Wednesday.

And the problem with the major company call centers, whether an airline, a cruise line or something else, is that they often you give you conflicting,

or even straight up inaccurate information, depending on who you ask.

 

When I worked at a cruise terminal (pre-Covid), people were in this predicament all-llll the time. They called said company’s customer “care”, got wrong information (often as to what kind of citizenship information to have), and upon check-in were denied boarding… I would probably trust written information (as in on a company website) more, but with Covid the catch is of course that this information changes constantly.

[Locito 85]

22 hours ago, millefleur said:

I've heard it's not being enforced for any tourists coming from Mexico, this is why Russians (who have no access to any FDA approved vaccine) are considering land crossings via Mexico into the US. Rather strange, I wonder how long it will last.

I’ve understood the whole time that the testing requirement has only been in force for AIR travel into the US?

Of course before November 8 there wasn’t any “unessential” travel over the border either, but when my in-laws have driven  over the border for medical appointments (they go like once a month), no-one has ever asked them for a test when returning to the US.

[slavaskii 886]

Thankfully most airports will do rapid PCR testing, but like, this effectively just serves as another blanket travel ban against countries that don't have access to such luxuries. I have no problem with more stringent testing, but the goal of such testing should be realistic. I'm thoroughly convinced people think these measures will defeat COVID, which is just... absurd. All it takes is for one person on a flight with 300 people to have a false negative or catch COVID after their test to render it useless. Which is not that unimaginable, especially how you have to walk into a clinic where there is more than likely to be COVID to test if you have it.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the best tool we have to fight COVID at this point is herd immunity, aren't we doing ourselves a tremendous disservice if we're just stringing this out so long that it's allowed to mutate and destroy all the progress we made with vaccines? 

[millefleur 5,047]

1 hour ago, slavaskii said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the best tool we have to fight COVID at this point is herd immunity, aren't we doing ourselves a tremendous disservice if we're just stringing this out so long that it's allowed to mutate and destroy all the progress we made with vaccines? 

I think we need to be focusing a lot more treatment as well, because pretending like we can stop it from starting is just unrealistic at this point. It's here, it's among us, let's come at it from all angles instead of just prevention. There's still money to be made in developing treatments, I don't get why it hasn't been more focused on.

[Rocio0010 5,580]

4 minutes ago, millefleur said:

it's among us

This. It is not going anywhere, so we need to learn to live with it. It's our "new" normal, unfortunately.

[mam521 2,111]

3 hours ago, slavaskii said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the best tool we have to fight COVID at this point is herd immunity, aren't we doing ourselves a tremendous disservice if we're just stringing this out so long that it's allowed to mutate and destroy all the progress we made with vaccines? 

It's pretty much been agreed upon amongst scientific communities that we'll never reach herd immunity.  Unequal vaccine distribution, behavioral changes in the vaccinated, waning effectiveness of the vaccines as time rolls on...yep, all lead down the road of changed variables impacting herd immunity.  

 

1 hour ago, ra0010 said:

This. It is not going anywhere, so we need to learn to live with it. It's our "new" normal, unfortunately.

Exactly.  The new variants are already "distributed" before scientists have even realized they are an issue.  Pivoting the vaccines to fight the new variants isn't a bad thing, but targeted treatments are definitely needed.  It's unrealistic to think random lockdowns are actually doing much of anything at this point in time other than creating civil unrest and government distrust. 

[millefleur 5,047]

17 minutes ago, mam521 said:

Exactly.  The new variants are already "distributed" before scientists have even realized they are an issue.  Pivoting the vaccines to fight the new variants isn't a bad thing, but targeted treatments are definitely needed. 

With all the money the pharmas have made due to the success of the vax, I wish they would start developing treatments as we've also seen "breakthrough cases" so the vax is not a silver bullet. It's a good tool to stop spread and protect people from dying, but it's not going to stop Covid infections 100% and therefore treatments are absolutely needed.

[Rocio0010 5,580]

36 minutes ago, mam521 said:

Pivoting the vaccines to fight the new variants isn't a bad thing,

Plus, I wonder if creating new vaccines actually don't make the virus stronger. I think lockdowns at first were out of ignorance and fear; now we know that they are by far not the tool to fight the virus. And we might not need to actually fight the virus... Just learn to live with it.

[mam521 2,111]

By definition, a vaccine isn't bulletproof.  It is designed to generate an immune response, which it does.  People can be vaccinated for Smallpox and still get it, but the immune response happens quite quickly, so people's infection severity is typically lessened, as is the time they were sick for.  The current covid vaccines seem to be behaving in a similar manner.  

 

I don't disagree though - we're likely going to have to learn to live with this one.