And speaking of jealousy....

[♥JP♥ 5]

I am starting to feel insulted. Is this how you make yourself feel worthy? If someone doesn't accept you clearly they must be jealous? Did it ever cross your minds that maybe they just don't like you? As Peezey said, they don't feel you are a good fit for their family member?

There is so much ####### being said here and so much ignorance I don't even know where to begin. You could be walking down the street and doing things you "think" are normal but locals may see not see it that way. Maybe you forgot to give someone a polite gesture? I highly dount that anyone in this forum including me, no matter how long you lived in another country all the cultural norms there.

I was in a restaurant once and we were paying the check. As I was waiting I put one knee on the chair. My fiance told me that was very rude, I had no idea it was rude or knew why the waitress was giving me a shocked look. So for those of you who keep pointing fingers at MENA women being jealous of you, why don't you take a look at yourself and see what needs improvement.

There is another thing. Its not that common in MENA for a woman who has kids to be accepted as a first time bride for the men in the family. So that could be another reason you are getting dirty looks.

I was talking about a woman my husbands aunt who was a first time bride and is from their culture. She was treated horribly and is very happy with her husband and she with him and have kids together and had to endure over 5 years of pain and to this day suffers immensely. You are making a very good point. You are saying that marrying a woman with kids perhaps could cause cruelty and animosity towards the woman marrying with kids. You proved one of the points I made in earlier points about cultural differences. Women with no kids and first time brides can still be used for greencards. And women with kids can be loved and accepted by an individual family. No matter what you think. the points Henia made were very valid. I stand behind her posts. I personally know 2 first time brides with no kids used for papers and dumped. So I am not really understanding your assault on previously married women. Anyone can be a target. Period.

Ok so now this is about women being targets for greencards? I said having kids can be one reason, there could be many others. Just because they treat her horribly doesnt mean they are jealous of her. Maybe they are just mean people, maybe the don't like her, maybe there were some pre-existing issues. You keep jumping all over the place with your arguements and none it makes any sense. Now you are talking about who is a target for a greencard which clearly has nothing to do with jealousy.

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Since you seem to not understand what has happened here, W, here is is simply broken down for you:

1 - No one objected to Henia

2- YOU dragged up this old thread

3- YOU posted YOUR comments (wherein YOU blasted Henia's private information she never posted here)

4- Objections in this thread are to YOU and YOUR statements not HENIA

If I said the sky was blue,peezy you would say its red. You have done your fair share of bullying all over the boards and Henia said she was leaving due to the comments. Second, you are again NOT EVEN IN THE IMMIGRATION process. I hope when I am done with this mess that I am not lurking around pissing in other peoples cornflakes or on the prowl for what do you call it "hyperbolic woman hating". You are a bully and you have been one since I started here and I have been reading the stuff you are saying and you just lurk around the immigration boards with nothing better to do. The people actually in the process do not seem to be nasty and bullying. You do not know everything and You do not see Henia on here posting because she has already been a victim of this catiness and nastiness earlier. Several NEW MEMBERS have left the boards... you know the PEOPLE THESE BOARDS ARE FOR? Hello. They are to help and to let people talk and vent. There is a big difference between some of these sweet newbies and me, I wouldnt leave because someone bothered me. I am here in VJ because I AM IN THE IMMIGRATION PROCESS and I like to read timelines and get advice on filing. I am not here to lurk and attack. If I have an opinion,its based on personal experience and I qualify it as such. I am not an expert on immigration. I am not an expert on all MENA countries ( only been to 3) but I know bullying when I see it and I still do not understand with your immigration process done why you are on here all the time. I do not see any advice from you on the timeline boards.Just harping on the mena boards. And its old. And I hope that Henia comes back because she ACTUALLY LIVES IN THE MENA COUNTRY and her advice is INVALUABLE. I hope she does not depart. She has gone through alot over in Algeria and wanted to share that wisdom with other people. I actually like reading her because she is going throught the I130 process presently and knows alot about the consulate in its present condition and arrangement and who is who. I am here to read immigration related postings and occasionally comment based on my assesment of things. It does not make me right... they could be just speculative opinions. BUT THEN AGAIN LET ME REEMPHASISE THAT I AM ACTUALLY GOING THROUGH THE THROES OF IMMIGRATION AND THE WAIT. I have the right to state personal experiences and comment as I like. This is not newsweek, its a forum. It is not a place for bullies and know it alls who are not even in the throes of this. If you were actually in the process I would have alot more respect for you. Don't you have anything elese to do than lurk around an immigration board when your spouse is already here and has adjusted status? Just wondering.

[sereia 0]

i reread my originaly reply from this post and wanted to clarify i wasn't sure if people were looking because they were jealous of me, they didn't like me, or whatever million other reasons there could be. i'm sure it was out of curiosity more than anything else. i rarely took offense to anyone looking at me... only if they made comments as i walked by (most of which i never understood anyway because it was in arabic. my fiance translated a few times which i was not happy about their comments. but again, it wasn't jealousy.)

i do know, however, that abdou experienced a lot of jealousy because there were many women who wanted to marry him and he was already taken. they were jealous of me without having ever met me. they were jealous that they couldn't have him. i think the argument that all MENA men who end up with an american wife must be undesirable is probably true in some cases but is defintely not the case in our relationship (or some others) he experienced a lot of problems over the jealousy factor that i will not post here.

i do think this is a valid conversation but some posters just don't understand exactly what jealousy is. but i don't think the opinions of all should be discounted, especially if they live among MENA and have had experiences only they know of and can't explain every detail here. but again, there are catty women everywhere in the world! i don't think anyone should take offense that people are saying it happens in MENA. that is just the majority of the experiences had in this forum.

[Ban Hammer 13,282]

and the browbeating continues....

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

Wahrania: It is completely pointless to waste the time typing. Time and time again ... here on MENA VJ people pick and choose what they comment on; bring back age old posts; twist words and manipulate to make their point. Personally, I made a vow to read only the immigration related topics. Unforunately I did not stick to it. I guess I have to. It is not good for my imen or my morale. Thanks ya'll!

Have you noticed the biggest bullies on MENA are people who are not even going through the immigration process. Whats the deal with that?Why are they here? If my husband was here I certainly would be doing other things than hanging out on an immigration forum and bullying and deriding people. I always have looked to your posts to find out what was going on in the algiers consulate and I hope you continue to post. I am thrilled for you and your husband and hope to see you in December . Cheers

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

i reread my originaly reply from this post and wanted to clarify i wasn't sure if people were looking because they were jealous of me, they didn't like me, or whatever million other reasons there could be. i'm sure it was out of curiosity more than anything else. i rarely took offense to anyone looking at me... only if they made comments as i walked by (most of which i never understood anyway because it was in arabic. my fiance translated a few times which i was not happy about their comments. but again, it wasn't jealousy.)

i do know, however, that abdou experienced a lot of jealousy because there were many women who wanted to marry him and he was already taken. they were jealous of me without having ever met me. they were jealous that they couldn't have him. i think the argument that all MENA men who end up with an american wife must be undesirable is probably true in some cases but is defintely not the case in our relationship (or some others) he experienced a lot of problems over the jealousy factor that i will not post here.

i do think this is a valid conversation but some posters just don't understand exactly what jealousy is. but i don't think the opinions of all should be discounted, especially if they live among MENA and have had experiences only they know of and can't explain every detail here. but again, there are catty women everywhere in the world! i don't think anyone should take offense that people are saying it happens in MENA. that is just the majority of the experiences had in this forum.

My general objection was that several people on the boards said that JEALOUSY was not something that happened. You yourself are stating that your husband did face some of it. MUCH IS BECAUSE HE WAS DESIRABLE. And you again are affirming what I stated. I never said all mena women are awful. I said that sometimes they can make it very hard for the american spouse. Which is very true. At least you are in accord with some of the things that I said

[peezey 0]

Wahrania: It is completely pointless to waste the time typing. Time and time again ... here on MENA VJ people pick and choose what they comment on; bring back age old posts; twist words and manipulate to make their point. Personally, I made a vow to read only the immigration related topics. Unforunately I did not stick to it. I guess I have to. It is not good for my imen or my morale. Thanks ya'll!

Have you noticed the biggest bullies on MENA are people who are not even going through the immigration process. Whats the deal with that?Why are they here? If my husband was here I certainly would be doing other things than hanging out on an immigration forum and bullying and deriding people. I always have looked to your posts to find out what was going on in the algiers consulate and I hope you continue to post. I am thrilled for you and your husband and hope to see you in December . Cheers

Have you ever noticed that the people who cannot formulate an articulate post let alone an articulate argument pull out the "why are you even here?" faux argument?

Have you ever stopped to think WHO IT IS THAT PROVIDES THE INFORMATION YOU NEED FOR IMMIGRATION if it were not for those people who have already completed immigration steps?

Do you read the posts? I am in the immigration process you crazy lulu.

Do you see that I am not the only person in this thread who disagrees with you?

Do you not read the many other women who HAVE LIVED IN MENA and have not experienced what you describe, and if they have, clearly do not see it as jealousy?

You seem to hate me so much, but where are your responses to jpaula and others who have lived in MENA and are attempting to un-burden your ego about this jealous argument?

Do you not understand that YOU OUTTED HENIA'S pregnancy?

Do you not see that someone created a poll because they were so disgusted with your posts?

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

I am starting to feel insulted. Is this how you make yourself feel worthy? If someone doesn't accept you clearly they must be jealous? Did it ever cross your minds that maybe they just don't like you? As Peezey said, they don't feel you are a good fit for their family member?

There is so much ####### being said here and so much ignorance I don't even know where to begin. You could be walking down the street and doing things you "think" are normal but locals may see not see it that way. Maybe you forgot to give someone a polite gesture? I highly dount that anyone in this forum including me, no matter how long you lived in another country all the cultural norms there.

I was in a restaurant once and we were paying the check. As I was waiting I put one knee on the chair. My fiance told me that was very rude, I had no idea it was rude or knew why the waitress was giving me a shocked look. So for those of you who keep pointing fingers at MENA women being jealous of you, why don't you take a look at yourself and see what needs improvement.

There is another thing. Its not that common in MENA for a woman who has kids to be accepted as a first time bride for the men in the family. So that could be another reason you are getting dirty looks.

I was talking about a woman my husbands aunt who was a first time bride and is from their culture. She was treated horribly and is very happy with her husband and she with him and have kids together and had to endure over 5 years of pain and to this day suffers immensely. You are making a very good point. You are saying that marrying a woman with kids perhaps could cause cruelty and animosity towards the woman marrying with kids. You proved one of the points I made in earlier points about cultural differences. Women with no kids and first time brides can still be used for greencards. And women with kids can be loved and accepted by an individual family. No matter what you think. the points Henia made were very valid. I stand behind her posts. I personally know 2 first time brides with no kids used for papers and dumped. So I am not really understanding your assault on previously married women. Anyone can be a target. Period.

Ok so now this is about women being targets for greencards? I said having kids can be one reason, there could be many others. Just because they treat her horribly doesnt mean they are jealous of her. Maybe they are just mean people, maybe the don't like her, maybe there were some pre-existing issues. You keep jumping all over the place with your arguements and none it makes any sense. Now you are talking about who is a target for a greencard which clearly has nothing to do with jealousy.

I didnt get any dirty looks. Re read the posts. I have only had one conflict and this person has had multiple problems with several family members. You are the one that said somehow that dirty looks would be based on the woman being previously married and having kids. Read what you wrote. Did I ever say I got a dirty look? Nope. read all the posts. its multiple people

[Jenn! 918]

This is just getting ridiculous. I think it's obvious that we all must have different definitions of what jealousy is, and different standards as to what makes one able to claim oneself as the victim of jealousy.

People can think what they want, obviously. Maybe though some people do not realize how it comes off when you go around telling everyone that other people are jealous of you. Quite frankly, it's boastful, it may or may not indicate an effort to overcompensate, and it's just in general a big turn off. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves.

Or maybe because it turns me off, it must be that I'm jealous of everyone considers themselves objects of jealousy, huh?

[peezey 0]

i reread my originaly reply from this post and wanted to clarify i wasn't sure if people were looking because they were jealous of me, they didn't like me, or whatever million other reasons there could be. i'm sure it was out of curiosity more than anything else. i rarely took offense to anyone looking at me... only if they made comments as i walked by (most of which i never understood anyway because it was in arabic. my fiance translated a few times which i was not happy about their comments. but again, it wasn't jealousy.)

i do know, however, that abdou experienced a lot of jealousy because there were many women who wanted to marry him and he was already taken. they were jealous of me without having ever met me. they were jealous that they couldn't have him. i think the argument that all MENA men who end up with an american wife must be undesirable is probably true in some cases but is defintely not the case in our relationship (or some others) he experienced a lot of problems over the jealousy factor that i will not post here.

i do think this is a valid conversation but some posters just don't understand exactly what jealousy is. but i don't think the opinions of all should be discounted, especially if they live among MENA and have had experiences only they know of and can't explain every detail here. but again, there are catty women everywhere in the world! i don't think anyone should take offense that people are saying it happens in MENA. that is just the majority of the experiences had in this forum.

My general objection was that several people on the boards said that JEALOUSY was not something that happened. You yourself are stating that your husband did face some of it. MUCH IS BECAUSE HE WAS DESIRABLE. And you again are affirming what I stated. I never said all mena women are awful. I said that sometimes they can make it very hard for the american spouse. Which is very true. At least you are in accord with some of the things that I said

Do you read? What people said was, how on earth could you possibly think, out of the hundreds of possibilities, that the only reason you might feel mistreated/uncomfortable/ogled is because of jealousy? No one said it's NEVER JEALOUSY. But you refuse to accept that it can be anything other than that.

Edited August 8, 2007 by peezey

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

This is just getting ridiculous. I think it's obvious that we all must have different definitions of what jealousy is, and different standards as to what makes one able to claim oneself as the victim of jealousy.

People can think what they want, obviously. Maybe though some people do not realize how it comes off when you go around telling everyone that other people are jealous of you. Quite frankly, it's boastful, it may or may not indicate an effort to overcompensate, and it's just in general a big turn off. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves.

Or maybe because it turns me off, it must be that I'm jealous of everyone considers themselves objects of jealousy, huh?

I for one never said anyone was jealous of me. I don't know who exactly stated that, you would have to clip and paste from posts to see who said that exactly. I have just been posting my opinions. I have only had one bad experience. Henia and several others recounted individual experiences

[Ban Hammer 13,282]

Do you read? What people said was, how on earth could you possibly think, out of the hundreds of possibilities, that the only reason you might feel mistreated/uncomfortable/ogled is because of jealousy? No one said it's NEVER JEALOUSY. But you refuse to accept that it can be anything other than that.

conversely, you refuse to accept the possibility that it may well be jealousy.......

[Beauty for Ashes 257]

i reread my originaly reply from this post and wanted to clarify i wasn't sure if people were looking because they were jealous of me, they didn't like me, or whatever million other reasons there could be. i'm sure it was out of curiosity more than anything else. i rarely took offense to anyone looking at me... only if they made comments as i walked by (most of which i never understood anyway because it was in arabic. my fiance translated a few times which i was not happy about their comments. but again, it wasn't jealousy.)

i do know, however, that abdou experienced a lot of jealousy because there were many women who wanted to marry him and he was already taken. they were jealous of me without having ever met me. they were jealous that they couldn't have him. i think the argument that all MENA men who end up with an american wife must be undesirable is probably true in some cases but is defintely not the case in our relationship (or some others) he experienced a lot of problems over the jealousy factor that i will not post here.

i do think this is a valid conversation but some posters just don't understand exactly what jealousy is. but i don't think the opinions of all should be discounted, especially if they live among MENA and have had experiences only they know of and can't explain every detail here. but again, there are catty women everywhere in the world! i don't think anyone should take offense that people are saying it happens in MENA. that is just the majority of the experiences had in this forum.

My general objection was that several people on the boards said that JEALOUSY was not something that happened. You yourself are stating that your husband did face some of it. MUCH IS BECAUSE HE WAS DESIRABLE. And you again are affirming what I stated. I never said all mena women are awful. I said that sometimes they can make it very hard for the american spouse. Which is very true. At least you are in accord with some of the things that I said

Do you read? What people said was, how on earth could you possibly think, out of the hundreds of possibilities, that the only reason you might feel mistreated/uncomfortable/ogled is because of jealousy? No one said it's NEVER JEALOUSY. But you refuse to accept that it can be anything other than that.

I was never ogled nor have I personally experienced much in the way of any animosity or I would not go back all the time. I have seen others treated very badly

[Caladan 19]

Do you read? What people said was, how on earth could you possibly think, out of the hundreds of possibilities, that the only reason you might feel mistreated/uncomfortable/ogled is because of jealousy? No one said it's NEVER JEALOUSY. But you refuse to accept that it can be anything other than that.

conversely, you refuse to accept the possibility that it may well be jealousy.......

I think peezey's accepted the possibility. She's just questioning the assumption that if people are nasty and muttering in a language you don't understand, that it must be due to their jealousy.

[sereia 0]

This is just getting ridiculous. I think it's obvious that we all must have different definitions of what jealousy is, and different standards as to what makes one able to claim oneself as the victim of jealousy.

People can think what they want, obviously. Maybe though some people do not realize how it comes off when you go around telling everyone that other people are jealous of you. Quite frankly, it's boastful, it may or may not indicate an effort to overcompensate, and it's just in general a big turn off. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves.

not sure if this was directed at me or not... but i was pointing out an example of real jealousy. i'm not trying to boast or overcompensate for my fiance. my fiance humble and never considers himself an object of jealousy. quite the opposite actually. he doesn't understand it and hated the issues he had at home because of it. jealousy is an awful feeling (being jealous and being the object of it)

Or maybe because it turns me off, it must be that I'm jealous of everyone considers themselves objects of jealousy, huh?

LOL

Edited August 8, 2007 by sereia