Utah County Proxy (Zoom) wedding

[godspeed 41]

16 minutes ago, W199 said:

Usually, but admittedly not always, there is more to the story than this. 

 

My fiancée just did the online CFO. It was excellent, and very easy. They didn't need any paperwork except the scanned visa and the passports

  - She signed up for the online class in the morning. 

   - They sent her a bunch of questions to answer such as my details, when  we met, where/when have we ever traveled together before, etc. She just replied to them on WhatsApp to them. 

  - The next day she had the online video class and the phone interview

   - Then  the same day received the digital CFO certificate.

 

She said the seminar was very eye opening due to all the domestic abuse that so many end up having. They want them to be safe and know the laws and emergency contacts.   In fact, during the online video seminar, the CFO got a message from a Filipino who said she wanted to come back due to the abuse from her husband, which included abuse in public.

 

Her phone interview with the CFO was about 30 seconds to just confirm her details, and said the paperwork is all in order. They said if they suspect anything then the call will be as long as it takes. 

 

The ONLY paper work they needed was a scanned copy of her passport, my passport, and her visa. But to be on the safe side, we also sent our relationship photos.

 

They did NOT even ask for her cenomar, my divorce certificate, etc..  She said there is no need for other paperwork because they know we are doing the K-1 process and the embassy is already very thorough with all the K-1 paperwork. They only need to ask for things like the cenomar, criminal record, etc during special cases such as when they have never even met before (there was one or two in my fiancee's class that were going to meet their fiance for the very first time, I think on a tourist visa) or  when they report some kinds of abuse, or so many other unique circumstances.

 

There really are so many cases of domestic abuse and human trafficing, fake paperwork, etc.. that they are on the lookout. There were even cases where their agent did the CFO and interview for them. So now they need to show their passport or do something to prove its really them in the seminar. Many of the Filipinos are just not wise enough to prevent being tricked or just so desperate enough they will do anything to help their families.   So I can't really blame the CFO for sometimes going crazy with paperwork and other checking when they see a risk of this happening.

 

 

 

 

 

 

they get alot of money by making you buy copies of documents instead of messaging departments to verify information or simply checking in their databases...

 

that's partly how they pay for the bureaucracy

 

the domestic abuse and trafficking happen most INSIDE the philippines, and they don't make much of any effort to stop the rampant prostitution in the country, with Duterte hanging with prostitutes on the campaign trail and saying it's not a priority to stop it...

 

also, they pimp out the entire population to the WEF and WHO

 

it's about systems of control and building up the strength to force things on the people, COVID should be an eye opener about allowing government to have too much power and using it to prevent a threat to power systems at the top

 

it's about making you respect the big daddy pimp hand at the top, not keeping you safe

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 16, 2023 by godspeed

[W199 335]

12 minutes ago, godspeed said:

 

they get alot of money by making you buy copies of documents instead of messaging departments to verify information or simply checking in their databases...

 

that's partly how they pay for the bureaucracy

 

the domestic abuse and trafficking happen most INSIDE the philippines, and they don't make much of any effort to stop the rampant prostitution in the country, with Duterte hanging with prostitutes on the campaign trail and saying it's not a priority to stop it...

 

also, they pimp out the entire population to the WEF and WHO

 

it's about systems of control and building up the strength to force things on the people, COVID should be an eye opener about allowing government to have too much power and using it to prevent a threat to power systems at the top

 

it's about making you respect the big daddy pimp hand at the top, not keeping you safe

 

 

 

 

 

 

First, we didn't have to buy any documents. As I said they only needed a scanned copy of our passports, and VISA.  We did have to pay $8 for the courier fee to received the permanent copy .. But CFO said they are already putting plans in place to abandon that and keep only the digital copy. 

 

Oh, so you are saying because there is prostitution inside the country, they should let them them also be human trafficked and abused outside the country as well? Its not about control, the CFO was put in place due to the extensive abuse which is very real and widespread. 

 

[John & Rose 7,239]

We didn’t pay anything for documents for CFO. We did have to get them for the visa process. CFO was started by nuns trying to sell credit cards to people leaving!  It has a lot of power now but it really isn’t a for profit thing. There is no way the cost of CFO pays for all the employees. 
 

there is human trafficking. That includes people trying to claim a family member as their biological child to try to give them a better life. The heart is in the right place but the law is strict. As far a prostitution I don’t think the Philippines is much different than any Asian country. I don’t really understand that argument. 

[John & Rose 7,239]

Do you know for a fact that the PSA documents she showed were real?  Forgeries are very common since annulments are so expensive and divorce is not allowed. There are hundreds of cases a year where people try to use fake documents for both the visa and CFO. I’m not saying that happened here but “fixers” and “helpers” make a lot of money giving fake PSA CENOMARs, annulments and recognition of foreign divorce. It is a lucrative business and costs about the same as a real annulment but can get papers in a day or two. There is always more to the story. 

[W199 335]

On 4/16/2023 at 1:20 PM, godspeed said:

[Quoted post containing profanity has been removed]

There is a well stated rule that if it is your first time traveling, then you are sent to secondary,  That also happened to me and Filipina gf at the time when I took her on a vacation to Vietnam.  They didn't ask for her cenomar, or any other documents.  

 

The very first thing  they asked her is what my full name was The fact is, very often they do not know the guys full name. So what you said having your ID and being there does not mean anything in regards to human trafficing.

 

They gave a good example, a girl left with her bf on a vacation recently, and the embassy had to rescue her because they got into a fight, he beat her and left her abandoned in the foreign country.  So now they wanted to see was proof that she really knew me and that we have traveled and been together for a long enough time, and ultimately proof that it was safe to travel with me.  Many guys just meet the girl for the first time and take them oversees for a "vacation".  Unfortunately, all the abuse makes it difficult for us who are sincere. You just need to be tolerant and empathetic.

 

As you probably have seen in the news, there has been a lot of abuse of this at secondary, asking a lot of irrevalent questions like '"are your parents married".. and causing people to miss their flights, and lose out on their non-refundable tickets. People have started filing cases against those immigration officers, and they are being re-asssigned.  This has been a big issue, that is true.  And this needs to be cleaned up, which they recently started to do due to all the public shaming.  For first time travelers, they should have a better process in place so you will not be offloaded at the airport and have your travel plans and ticked ruined.  But they do have such a process if she is your fiancee, then you can get a CFO GCP certificate to solve that risk. Then when you get the k-1 visa, you just update the registration of the GCP certificate without needed to retake the the cfo class.  Its tricky since they can not implement any rules that would look like they are restricting their right to travel.  Though its very concerning that  10's of thousands that get offload, but only a few hundred are for human trafficking, minors, or illegal working.  They do need a better system.

Edited April 18, 2023 by TBoneTX
remove profane quoted post

[RO_AH 1,659]

3 hours ago, godspeed said:

they should be able to look in their databases and find info online instead of making people buy copies of documents to provide other departments 

 

it’s inexcusable 

Come on, don't be one of "those" foreigners. Philippines is no where near as technologically advanced as the USA so don't base your expectations on what you are familiar with. Besides, are you trying to say that the government bureaucracy is smooth and efficient here? You really need to change your expectations.

[John & Rose 7,239]

I love it there and while they are not perfect, either are we. CFO is a joke but we all know about it. It isn’t expensive and there is a lot of fraud with PSA documents. Other than the lies told to my step kids, CFO was pretty easy and uneventful. We didn’t have to pay anything for documents we didn’t already have and they did not keep any originals so we can reuse them if needed. 

[RO_AH 1,659]

8 minutes ago, John & Rose said:

I love it there and while they are not perfect, either are we. CFO is a joke but we all know about it. It isn’t expensive and there is a lot of fraud with PSA documents. Other than the lies told to my step kids, CFO was pretty easy and uneventful. We didn’t have to pay anything for documents we didn’t already have and they did not keep any originals so we can reuse them if needed. 

We already had scans of all our documents. Uploaded the ones needed, had a < 10 minute interview and were done. Not to say that others don't have issues, but unfortunately most of what you see is the people that had complaints. I will say I have never heard of anyone not getting one. Just some are made to jump through more hoops than others.

[W199 335]

16 minutes ago, RO_AH said:

Come on, don't be one of "those" foreigners. Philippines is no where near as technologically advanced as the USA so don't base your expectations on what you are familiar with. Besides, are you trying to say that the government bureaucracy is smooth and efficient here? You really need to change your expectations.

Exactly. In fact, try getting a National (all States) Cenomar in the USA, you can't even do that. But in the Philippines, you can easily order one quickly online, It is is delivered right to your door in less than a week for only $8 including the courier fee. I was quite impressed,

 

=

 

 

 

[John & Rose 7,239]

19 minutes ago, RO_AH said:

We already had scans of all our documents. Uploaded the ones needed, had a < 10 minute interview and were done. Not to say that others don't have issues, but unfortunately most of what you see is the people that had complaints. I will say I have never heard of anyone not getting one. Just some are made to jump through more hoops than others.

There are stories of people who did not get the certificate or sticker but that was usually because of fake documents. If you are married in the Philippines without a recognition of foreign divorce or annulment they have stopped both K-1 and spousal until they deal with their current marriage. 

[W199 335]

2 minutes ago, John & Rose said:

There are stories of people who did not get the certificate or sticker but that was usually because of fake documents. If you are married in the Philippines without a recognition of foreign divorce or annulment they have stopped both K-1 and spousal until they deal with their current marriage. 

One guy, I think it was on here, posted that his fiancee did not pass the CFO, and claimed it because she was "too shy."  But as we know there is always more to the story.   

[John & Rose 7,239]

7 minutes ago, W199 said:

One guy, I think it was on here, posted that his fiancee did not pass the CFO, and claimed it because she was "too shy."  But as we know there is always more to the story.   

One thing my wife did mention was they do tend to “attack” the shier ones. They seemed to fight and pile on the “weaker” looking beneficiaries. She felt is was very unfair but all they had to do was push back a little and the CFO councilor would leave them alone. I don’t know about not getting their sticker but they definitely pick on the shy ones.  

[W199 335]

9 hours ago, John & Rose said:

We didn’t pay anything for documents for CFO. We did have to get them for the visa process. CFO was started by nuns trying to sell credit cards to people leaving!  It has a lot of power now but it really isn’t a for profit thing. There is no way the cost of CFO pays for all the employees. 
 

there is human trafficking. That includes people trying to claim a family member as their biological child to try to give them a better life. The heart is in the right place but the law is strict. As far a prostitution I don’t think the Philippines is much different than any Asian country. I don’t really understand that argument. 

The budget for the CFO is 181 Million php. see the link below for the actual budget

 

https://dbm.gov.ph/wp-content/uploads/GAA/GAA2023/VolumeI/OEO/D.pdf

 

I assume they don’t charge for the CFO services because they want to encourage them to attend and be educated about abuse and getting help, etc etc rather than sneaking out or trying to bribe an IO or a fixer and so forth 

 

Though one Filipina was offloaded due to having a fake certificate for which she paid 10,000 php for even though she waa eligible allegedly for the free one

 

 

[Talako 785]

15 hours ago, John & Rose said:

One thing my wife did mention was they do tend to “attack” the shier ones. They seemed to fight and pile on the “weaker” looking beneficiaries. She felt is was very unfair but all they had to do was push back a little and the CFO councilor would leave them alone. I don’t know about not getting their sticker but they definitely pick on the shy ones.  

If I was to guess, it is probably assumed, rightly or wrongly, shy or quiet young women could be more easily tricked or manipulated into something they would not normally do. So, ultimately they are on the look out for that.

[godspeed 41]

The CFO may have some good intentions but it’s way too nosy and what kind of people want to work those jobs and who watches over them?