Unobtainable police certificate

[Fstop 0]

My wife had her interview last week in Bangkok for the IR-1 immigration visa. This process has now taken 18 months. She had all of her documents except one: a police clearance certificate from Changchun, China, where we lived nearly 10 years ago. Last November I submitted a letter explaining why this document was unobtainable. We were never given a temporary residence permit (I think the school may have kept it and is now destroyed) and this was accepted on the online application. Since it was marked "accepted" I didn't think anything of it until last week when the consular officer denied her visa until we produce this document. 

 

I have contacted two different lawyers in China and my previous employer (an international school). My school has agreed to write and sign an official letter stating that she was an upstanding and valued member of the school community and as far as they know, does not have a criminal record in China. She was not employed by the school; she was just with me when I was working there.

 

One of the lawyers has attempted to contact the police and they have confirmed that the police station wouldn't be able to issue the no-criminal record based on current documents. For $500, the lawyer has offered to write a memorandum stating this.

 

Will this memorandum and the letter from my school be enough? Is there any other course of action I can take?

[P0907 127]

I can't offer official advice, just that on the surface, saying you can't get a police certificate might come across as you can but don't want to possibly due to something being on it.

 

You say the police have confirmed that they won't be able to issue a certificate? Get that in writing on an official police letterhead. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by P0907

[Chancy 6,241]

On 7/13/2021 at 5:32 AM, Fstop said:

Will this memorandum and the letter from my school be enough? Is there any other course of action I can take?

 

I doubt the consul officer would accept a memo/letter from your lawyer and school, as they specifically asked for the police certificate from China, despite already having that explanation letter you submitted back in November.

 

Contact a reputable agency that specializes in getting police certificates for those no longer residing in China.  Here are some recommendations from other VJ members --

 

 

[Annevilwill 2]

1 hour ago, Chancy said:

 

I doubt the consul officer would accept a memo/letter from your lawyer and school, as they specifically asked for the police certificate from China, despite already having that explanation letter you submitted back in November.

 

Contact a reputable agency that specializes in getting police certificates for those no longer residing in China.  Here are some recommendations from other VJ members --

 

 

The issue about contacting an agent or a lawyer - there is nothing they can do if person originally cannot provide such a documents as: work contract and residence permit; tax refund; police registration of temporarily place of living. Police or a notary office ( depend on a city) will not issue police certificate if one of those documents is missing. I understand, that OP doesn't have any of them. So all agent can do - issue a paper that states that this police certificate is unobtainable!

 

On 7/13/2021 at 5:32 AM, Fstop said:

My wife had her interview last week in Bangkok for the IR-1 immigration visa. This process has now taken 18 months. She had all of her documents except one: a police clearance certificate from Changchun, China, where we lived nearly 10 years ago. Last November I submitted a letter explaining why this document was unobtainable. We were never given a temporary residence permit (I think the school may have kept it and is now destroyed) and this was accepted on the online application. Since it was marked "accepted" I didn't think anything of it until last week when the consular officer denied her visa until we produce this document. 

 

I have contacted two different lawyers in China and my previous employer (an international school). My school has agreed to write and sign an official letter stating that she was an upstanding and valued member of the school community and as far as they know, does not have a criminal record in China. She was not employed by the school; she was just with me when I was working there.

 

One of the lawyers has attempted to contact the police and they have confirmed that the police station wouldn't be able to issue the no-criminal record based on current documents. For $500, the lawyer has offered to write a memorandum stating this.

 

Will this memorandum and the letter from my school be enough? Is there any other course of action I can take?

OP, please share with us how did you manage to resolve this issue. I live in China now, in Shanghai and work here - getting police certificate from shanghai should not be an issue for me. However I used to live in Nanjing for two years where I was studying, but I have no documents left from that time: no documents from Uni, no police registration. I was also going to prepare a statement that record from Nanjing is unobtainable.. But now after your post I don't know.. 

[arken 4,197]

42 minutes ago, Annevilwill said:

The issue about contacting an agent or a lawyer - there is nothing they can do if person originally cannot provide such a documents as: work contract and residence permit; tax refund; police registration of temporarily place of living. Police or a notary office ( depend on a city) will not issue police certificate if one of those documents is missing. I understand, that OP doesn't have any of them. So all agent can do - issue a paper that states that this police certificate is unobtainable!

 

OP, please share with us how did you manage to resolve this issue. I live in China now, in Shanghai and work here - getting police certificate from shanghai should not be an issue for me. However I used to live in Nanjing for two years where I was studying, but I have no documents left from that time: no documents from Uni, no police registration. I was also going to prepare a statement that record from Nanjing is unobtainable.. But now after your post I don't know.. 

OP has been asking on how to resolve as well. 
 

Anyway, i also believe the CO won't accept letters from the school or an agent in lieu of the police report since COs go by the state department reciprocity rule, if it says certificate is available, it has to be provided. And COs can't verify if real criminals start submitting such letters and not the police certificates with their crimes on it.

 

As @Chancy mentioned, may be there are some better agencies who can handle it better to get the police certificate.

[Fstop 0]

I have contacted several agencies and two lawyers. None of the agencies can do it - they all say that they can try, but the likelihood of getting a police certificate without the resident registration form is very difficult, if not impossible. 

 

My school has said it's not possible.

 

I'm still waiting on a quotation from https://lawandborder.com/ and whether or not they can help me.

 

We have spent 18 months and thousands of dollars applying for this visa, only to be turned away by an unobtainable document. Surely there is another way to get approved. 

[Annevilwill 2]

40 minutes ago, Fstop said:

I have contacted several agencies and two lawyers. None of the agencies can do it - they all say that they can try, but the likelihood of getting a police certificate without the resident registration form is very difficult, if not impossible. 

 

My school has said it's not possible.

 

I'm still waiting on a quotation from https://lawandborder.com/ and whether or not they can help me.

 

We have spent 18 months and thousands of dollars applying for this visa, only to be turned away by an unobtainable document. Surely there is another way to get approved. 

I actually had a consultation with this guy, Gary Chodorow right? But just a general consultation about CR1. He did mention during the consultation that they do help to obtain the police certificate, but again, in case when its not possible to do, they can issue an official statement for US consulate, that is what you mentioned in the initial post, memorandum. I don't think that anyone can confirm to you with 100% certainty that it will work, but I assume if he does issue documents like that, they must work at least in some cases. Otherwise, if it wont work, maybe he also can help you with this case, to contact the consulate as your attorney and try to solve this issue. You should check with him all the options. 

 

Please keep us posted about how it all worked out for you. Its a very important case for people who ever lived in China. 

[lizspj 2]

It's been a long time and things may have changed, but I was able to obtain a police cert through an agency in 2015. They were able to do this for two different periods for me - the first I stayed on campus at a uni and had no household registration, the second I lived in a flat and had the proper registration. The only information the agency required to obtain the certificate was pictures of entry / exit stamps in my passport, picture of my passport and a power of attorney giving the agency the right to act on my behalf. Has the law changed since...? They turned it around in a month for me and the entire process was seamless. Hope you can get this sorted, it sounds frustrating!

[Fstop 0]

3 minutes ago, lizspj said:

It's been a long time and things may have changed, but I was able to obtain a police cert through an agency in 2015. They were able to do this for two different periods for me - the first I stayed on campus at a uni and had no household registration, the second I lived in a flat and had the proper registration. The only information the agency required to obtain the certificate was pictures of entry / exit stamps in my passport, picture of my passport and a power of attorney giving the agency the right to act on my behalf. Has the law changed since...? They turned it around in a month for me and the entire process was seamless. Hope you can get this sorted, it sounds frustrating!

What was the name of the agency?

[lizspj 2]

1 minute ago, Fstop said:

What was the name of the agency?

Visainchina. Apologies it was the entry exit stamps, china visas and passport photo page they needed. Cost in 2015 was 3000RMB excluding wire / transfer fees.

[Fstop 0]

For some reason Visainchina only provides services for those who resided in Shanghai. 

[lizspj 2]

Just now, Fstop said:

For some reason Visainchina only provides services for those who 

Are you sure? I just had a quick look at their site and it makes reference to the fact they can try get all clearances on a single report if you lived in multiple cities. The two cities I lived in were not Shanghai. 

[Fstop 0]

Yep - only in Shanghai. I emailed them last week and they informed me as much. 

 

Their website states it as well:

 

Notice1 : As a minimum requirement, you need to have at least 1 working or family or study residence permit issued at shanghai before.
Notice2: Policy might change, so please double confirm with us in advance.

 

http://www.visainchina.com/nocriminal.htm

[Fstop 0]

On 7/14/2021 at 7:17 PM, arken said:

Anyway, i also believe the CO won't accept letters from the school or an agent in lieu of the police report since COs go by the state department reciprocity rule, if it says certificate is available, it has to be provided

 

This is the response that I got from the embassy yesterday. Since it states that the police certificate is "available", there is nothing they can do. They suggested finding an attorney or an agency to help acquire the document. 

 

I have a friend of a friend in China who is going to go to the PSB and then the local notary office to try and acquire the police clearance document for my wife. Not sure if they will give it to her, even with a power of attorney due to the lack of a temporary registration permit. We are still hopeful, or at least they will give us some official paper that states that the document is unobtainable. 

 

I'm also still waiting on a quotation from https://lawandborder.com/ and whether or not they can help me. They sure seem to be taking their dear sweet time. 

[Annevilwill 2]

2 hours ago, Fstop said:

 

This is the response that I got from the embassy yesterday. Since it states that the police certificate is "available", there is nothing they can do. They suggested finding an attorney or an agency to help acquire the document. 

 

I have a friend of a friend in China who is going to go to the PSB and then the local notary office to try and acquire the police clearance document for my wife. Not sure if they will give it to her, even with a power of attorney due to the lack of a temporary registration permit. We are still hopeful, or at least they will give us some official paper that states that the document is unobtainable. 

 

I'm also still waiting on a quotation from https://lawandborder.com/ and whether or not they can help me. They sure seem to be taking their dear sweet time. 

I am really sorry to hear that so far no news and the embassy being so strict about this without even knowing the details of life in china and how it all works here. But I really hope it will work out well for you, it must! i cannot believe that they would deny immigration for your wife only because of this paper.. Good luck!!! Please keep us posted!