Immigration bill suffers major defeat in Senate

[Caladan 19]

Doesn't the poll just show that 70% of Americans haven't thought through the logistics of deporting 11 million people?

[Alex+R 0]

Doesn't the poll just show that 70% of Americans haven't thought through the logistics of deporting 11 million people?

85% in another poll Devilette posted said they thought it would be impossible to deport that many people.

Edited June 28, 2007 by Alex+R

[Dan J 277]

What part of that is NOT a guest worker program???

Guest worker program: allows people from other countries to come here on a temporary basis.

Amnesty: grants legal status to illegal immigrants who are already here.

Need a dictionary? Amnesty only means being forgiven for a crime, a crime which would otherwise make them ineligible for any other visa or status.

[Alex+R 0]

""Regardless of how you feel about it personally, do you think that deporting all illegal immigrants who are currently in the United States back to their native countries is a realistic and achievable goal, or not?"

was the question

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I always marvel at discussions about guest worker programs that proceed in the premise that none exists, and should we allow one, when there are several in existance already.

So, why do some discuss guest worker programs as if there needs to be one and someone is stopping the US from having one?

Edited June 28, 2007 by Green-eyed girl

[no name 1]

It's funny that so many people support a guest worker program when in the Kennedy School poll that Devilette posted some 70% of Americans doubt people would go home when their two year periods are up. What are Americans saying here?

Well Steven, your source is from March 2006, I would prefer to use a current one.

CBS News/New York Times Poll. May 18-23, 2007. N=1,125 adults nationwide. MoE ± 3 (for all adults).

"Would you favor or oppose a program allowing people from other countries to be guest workers in the U.S. for a temporary period of time, and then be required to return to their home country?" 5/18-23/07

Favor 66% (fair enough)

Oppose 30%

"Should ILLEGAL immigrants be prosecuted and deported for being in the U.S. illegally, or shouldn't they?" 5/18-23/07

Should 69% (exactly)

Oppose 24%

In your Kennedy poll, about 80% of Americans said deportation was an unrealistic goal and not likely to be feasible.

The point here is that Americans have a lot of different opinions and I think a lot of people in this thread are cherry picking their statistics from the very same polls that show opinions that conflict with their own on other questions.

Sure there will be a skew Alex, it's human nature. At least my polls were current & we had several sources.

Bottom line is, it failed today and those lawmakers need to figure out why. 18 senators flipped from yea to nay in the last 2 days. Someone got to them!

Edited June 28, 2007 by devilette

[Sofiyya 1,687]

I believe it's quite possible to deport millions of illegals. Why? Because we used to do so. I remember a day when "la migra" was feared. Back then, illegals really did live in the shadows and there were a lot fewer of them depressing real wages. I'm nostalgic for those days.

[mawilson 2,133]

We already have a Channel Deportivo, just need to start broadcasting the names of people to be deported.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

Bottom line is, it failed today and those lawmakers need to figure out why. 18 senators flipped from yea to nay in the last 2 days. Someone got to them!

No secret as to why it failed. You don't make good law by trying to force bad legislation down the throats of representatives who listened to the will of their constituants. Democracy ruled!

[Caladan 19]

When was this period? Pre-1986, at least.

And there isn't a guest worker visa available for the types of jobs currently filled by illegal immigrants.

[Alex+R 0]

When was this period? Pre-1986, at least.

And there isn't a guest worker visa available for the types of jobs currently filled by illegal immigrants.

Only seasonal ones, which are hard to use.

[Sofiyya 1,687]

When was this period? Pre-1986, at least.

And there isn't a guest worker visa available for the types of jobs currently filled by illegal immigrants.

Agricultural guest worker programs are only one segment of guest worker programs. Other segments of employment impacted greatly by illegals employ them illegally in order to circumvent paying higher wages to legals, and their wages have dropped demonstratively from a living wages to paltry sums over the years that illegal employment has increased.

There has been a lot of construction and landscaping work in the gated community I live in since last year. When I encounter any of these men doing any job, from unskilled to skilled, they cannot speak English. The HOA even hired two Spanish speaking managers to translate between the residents and the workers because none of them speak English. These are definitely jobs Americans were doing at one time. So, where are the Americans?

[one...two...tree 2,762]

What part of that is NOT a guest worker program???

Guest worker program: allows people from other countries to come here on a temporary basis.

Amnesty: grants legal status to illegal immigrants who are already here.

Need a dictionary? Amnesty only means being forgiven for a crime, a crime which would otherwise make them ineligible for any other visa or status.

Thank you, Dan.

They can call it purple daisies for all I care, as long as Mark can see that what was in the immigration bill and what Americans favored in the polls are in step with each other. The bill may have been flawed on other accounts, but on that issue it had the support of the American people.

Edited June 28, 2007 by Steven_and_Jinky

[Addie_Goodvibes 0]

Er... no. Temporary work visas don't make one eligible for citizenship after N number of years.

A temporary visa is just that - temporary. When the visa expires, the visa holder goes home.

That is part of the problem, what makes you think that people will leave after expiration of their Visa?

The Visa Holders do NOT go Home, they fall back into the shadows have children and become dependent on the local stae / Govt. for support.

They don't need citizenship all they need is to be able to enter, once they are in USA they are Home FREE,

[Addie_Goodvibes 0]

Bottom line is, it failed today and those lawmakers need to figure out why. 18 senators flipped from yea to nay in the last 2 days. Someone got to them!

No secret as to why it failed. You don't make good law by trying to force bad legislation down the throats of representatives who listened to the will of their constituants. Democracy ruled!

The American people Got to them, those who voted for them got to them, their constiuants got to them, these illegal Advocacy groups who claim this as a human rights or race issue or even an Anti Immigration issue were proven Wrong.

It s Not nor ever was about human rights, or Immigration, Thank God for Democracy.

My voice was heard and will continue to be heard.