Utah Online Marriage

[za3za3 2]

Hi Everyone,

 

First time posting!

 

I'm curious about getting married online via the State of Utah. For reference, I'm a US citizen and will be traveling to see my fiance in her home country. We will physically be together and we have talked about getting married online via the state of Utah. The reason we are going this route is because her home country does not allow civil weddings. The state of Utah will issue us a certified marriage certificate and based on that I plan on submitting an I-130 to start the immigration process. This is all new,  but does anyone see any issues with going this route. The question of the marriage not being consummated should be moot, as we will be physically together for the ceremony.  

 

Appreciate any feedback on this!

 

Thanks Everyone. 

[aaron2020 11,651]

The Utah online marriage thing has been asked several times recently.

 

THIS IS A BAD HORRIBLE IDEA.

 

How is the State of Utah going to have jurisdiction over a marriage that occurs outside of its borders?

 

JUST DON'T DO THIS.

The Utah online marriage program is for marriages that will take place in Utah; not other states or foreign countries.  

Edited January 9, 2021 by aaron2020

[Adventine 3,214]

What's the country and why are civil weddings not allowed there?

 

If you're travelling there anyway, why not just get married in the "traditional" way accepted by that country's government?

[za3za3 2]

The state of Utah recognizes those marriages as long as the officiant is in the state of Utah.  It's perfectly legal and adheres to Utah State Law. 

 

As for why not a traditional marriage. Well primarily, the only unions allowed in Israel are religious ones. You can imagine a case where a couple from different religions cannot easily marry. Many people end up traveling abroad for Civil unions.   

[aaron2020 11,651]

Utah can issue valid marriage licenses for marriages that occurs in Utah.  It doesn't have jurisdiction worldwide.  The marriage license is to be used WITHIN the state, not outside of it.  That's how these things works.  


 

Edited January 9, 2021 by aaron2020

[aaron2020 11,651]

Have a destination wedding.

Both of you can travel to a country where you can get a civil marriage.  

People who are licensed to marry people IN the state of Utah are not allowed to marry people who are OUTSIDE the state of Utah.  You and your fiancee would be outside the state of Utah.  This will not work.  

[za3za3 2]

1 hour ago, aaron2020 said:

Have a destination wedding.

Both of you can travel to a country where you can get a civil marriage.  

People who are licensed to marry people IN the state of Utah are not allowed to marry people who are OUTSIDE the state of Utah.  You and your fiancee would be outside the state of Utah.  This will not work.  

Utah will marry couples outside of the state. That’s why I’m asking the question. It’s on the Utah state county website and I called them to ask.  They said that you do not have to be in the state or even in the country for them to issue a marriage license and then conduct a marriage ceremony, as long as the officiant is in the state.  In fact a number of gay couples in Israel have done this and have had their marriages recognized by the Israeli authorities.  

 

While I’m certain about what Utah does, and the consequent marriage certificate they author, I’m less certain about USCIS’s take on this. There is no real information on this. The only thing I’ve read from USCIS website is:

 

‘In general, the legal validity of a marriage is determined by the law of the place where the marriage was celebrated (“place-of-celebration rule”). Under this rule, a marriage is valid for immigration purposes in cases where the marriage is valid under the law of the jurisdiction in which it is performed.’

 

According to the state of Utah the marriage is legal. 

 

I understand this seems risky, since there’s little precedent. But that’s why I’m asking and talking about this. 

 

 

 

[Adventine 3,214]

Indeed, there is no precedent that I know of. Are you willing to set that precedent and to be one of the guinea pigs, to see if USCIS accepts online marriages for the purposes of immigration?

 

I personally would play it safe and go to a third country where you can both get married. Or, if your fiancé has a US tourist visa, they can travel to the US to get married in your hometown.

[pushbrk 13,157]

5 hours ago, za3za3 said:

The state of Utah recognizes those marriages as long as the officiant is in the state of Utah.  It's perfectly legal and adheres to Utah State Law. 

 

As for why not a traditional marriage. Well primarily, the only unions allowed in Israel are religious ones. You can imagine a case where a couple from different religions cannot easily marry. Many people end up traveling abroad for Civil unions.   

Don't confuse "civil unions" with "civil marriages" .  Correct terminology and context are important here.  USCIS is likely to recognize your online or proxy marriage only AFTER it is consummated.  If you decide to risk this, do not file the I-130 until you have evidence of being together in person AFTER the "marriage" takes place.

 

If you have not already, I encourage any discussion participants to read the information here.  https://il.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/local-resources-of-u-s-citizens/marriage/#:~:text=Civil Marriage%3A,valid for U.S. immigration purposes.

 

Edited January 9, 2021 by pushbrk

[za3za3 2]

4 hours ago, pushbrk said:

Don't confuse "civil unions" with "civil marriages" .  Correct terminology and context are important here.  USCIS is likely to recognize your online or proxy marriage only AFTER it is consummated.  If you decide to risk this, do not file the I-130 until you have evidence of being together in person AFTER the "marriage" takes place.

 

If you have not already, I encourage any discussion participants to read the information here.  https://il.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/local-resources-of-u-s-citizens/marriage/#:~:text=Civil Marriage%3A,valid for U.S. immigration purposes.

 

Thanks Pushbrk for pointing out the different terminology. For my purposes it would a civil marriage. As I mentioned, we would be together in Israel for the Utah based marriage ceremony.  We are still deciding if this is the best approach and trying to consult with immigration lawyers on the matter.

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

[carmel34 3,657]

If you have already spent time together, before the trip you are planning, it may work.  If this will be the first time you meet in person, and get married on that first visit, online via the State of Utah while you are together in Israel, I predict that USCIS and the immigration officers who will make the final decision, will scrutinize the relationship as they always assume fraud and an online marriage may be a big hurdle to overcome in that regard.  An attorney will just give you an opinion, the real test will be USCIS, and if the petition gets approved, the immigration officers in Israel who will decide on the visa.  Getting married in a third country would be less likely to cause problems.  Also, this may be one of those cases where a K-1 would be better.  Could your Israeli fiancée travel to the US for a civil marriage, then return home while you file for a CR-1?  Good luck whatever you decide to do.  And definitely come back and report on how this works out if you decide to do the online marriage thing.

[SalishSea 18,187]

13 hours ago, za3za3 said:

Utah will marry couples outside of the state. That’s why I’m asking the question. It’s on the Utah state county website and I called them to ask.  They said that you do not have to be in the state or even in the country for them to issue a marriage license and then conduct a marriage ceremony, as long as the officiant is in the state.  In fact a number of gay couples in Israel have done this and have had their marriages recognized by the Israeli authorities.  

 

While I’m certain about what Utah does, and the consequent marriage certificate they author, I’m less certain about USCIS’s take on this. There is no real information on this. The only thing I’ve read from USCIS website is:

 

‘In general, the legal validity of a marriage is determined by the law of the place where the marriage was celebrated (“place-of-celebration rule”). Under this rule, a marriage is valid for immigration purposes in cases where the marriage is valid under the law of the jurisdiction in which it is performed.’

 

According to the state of Utah the marriage is legal. 

 

I understand this seems risky, since there’s little precedent. But that’s why I’m asking and talking about this. 

 

 

 

Since everyone here is suggesting it may be a bad idea, and yet you seem to disagree, why not just try it and report back to us?

[JeanneAdil 6,677]

Reading from the site in Utah County (because of covid ) they allow applying for the marriage license online and after marriage get a copy of the cerificate  online but the following applies for other counties 

 

Everywhere else in Utah — and nearly everywhere else in the country — requires the couple to appear in person, fill out paperwork and present identification.

https://kutv.com/news/local/utahns-can-now-get-their-marriage-licenses-online#:~:text=PROVO%20(KUTV)%20%E2%80%94%20Anyone%20getting,application%20process%20on%20its%20webs

 

 

and the following  site says Utah does not allow proxy marriages

 

https://www.thespruce.com/how-to-get-married-in-utah-2300795#:~:text=Proxy%20marriages%20are%20not%20allowed,the%20applicant%20before%20a%20notary.

 

Proxy Marriage

Proxy marriages are not allowed in Utah, so both partners must be present. However, a few counties in Utah may allow only one of you to appear to apply for a license. The other partner can take the application form to be filled out and signed by the applicant before a notary.

and immigration posts this:

USCIS does not recognize the following relationships as marriages, even if valid in the place of celebration:

• USCIS does not recognize the following relationships as marriages:

• Relationships where one party is not present during the marriage ceremony (proxy marriages) unless the marriage has been consummated; ^[6] 

^{https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-12-part-g-chapter-2}

[payxibka 10,047]

17 hours ago, za3za3 said:

Hi Everyone,

 

First time posting!

 

I'm curious about getting married online via the State of Utah. For reference, I'm a US citizen and will be traveling to see my fiance in her home country. We will physically be together and we have talked about getting married online via the state of Utah. The reason we are going this route is because her home country does not allow civil weddings. The state of Utah will issue us a certified marriage certificate and based on that I plan on submitting an I-130 to start the immigration process. This is all new,  but does anyone see any issues with going this route. The question of the marriage not being consummated should be moot, as we will be physically together for the ceremony.  

 

Appreciate any feedback on this!

 

Thanks Everyone. 

It just might work

[HRQX 4,145]

14 hours ago, za3za3 said:

I understand this seems risky, since there’s little precedent. But that’s why I’m asking and talking about this.

US immigration has started to crack down on WedWeb and similar Utah marriages: "I expected to be allowed to travel since we are married, but the US border control official at the airport said I couldn't because there's a specific rule that foreign spouses who got married online can't enter the US"