Laws and Legality

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

That quote is a fair point - but the assumption then appears to be that Oprah should somehow be responsible for addressing the plight of inner city kids in the US rather than anywhere else. A private philanthropist spending her own money to fund a school in Africa is not the same as if the government were to do it with taxpayers money. Ultimately its her money to spend as she likes - but investing in education (anywhere) can only be a good thing, no?

As marc pointed out she deliberately did not want to invest any money in inner city US schools because she knows the average kid and their parents do not give a ####### about learning.

Which just reinforces my early point of why do they insist on living in post industrial era inner cities which require skilled labor to acquire work. So they do not want to get an education, which is provided FREE of charge, and they do not want to move where they can find jobs. Yet anyone foreign, like myself, pointing this out is racist.

I have a proposal. How about we have an exchange program. Any African American who still feels wronged and hates this country for whatever reason can go back to their country and in their place we will accept the millions of people from Africa who would die to come here and make a life for themselves and their family. Setup a fund and I will sponsor that myself. Or as Alex in her infinite wisdom pointed out I must be racist towards specifically poor inner city African Americans. Must be a new kind of micro-racism

I think its easy to make trite comments about other peoples circumstances and their social attitudes when you're sitting in a position of relative privilege. I suspect its the bald generalisations that people object to.

Marc BTW - did not point anything out. He took someone elses words and used them for his own.

No, Marc did not use it for his own, he has a linked source right in the post! You, above, said as much, as well.

Quote tags are for quotes. Otherwise it looks like your stealing someone elses words - and clearly someone made that connection.

And you called it a quote like I highlighted above! It wasn't till others kept agreeing that it became stolen words...!

I agree, quotes or italic type should have been used, but we still knew it was a quote. I'm only pointing out that you called it a quote already.

Only because I looked in the link. The person who agreed with it appeared not to do that.

Edited June 28, 2007 by erekose

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

That quote is a fair point - but the assumption then appears to be that Oprah should somehow be responsible for addressing the plight of inner city kids in the US rather than anywhere else. A private philanthropist spending her own money to fund a school in Africa is not the same as if the government were to do it with taxpayers money. Ultimately its her money to spend as she likes - but investing in education (anywhere) can only be a good thing, no?

As marc pointed out she deliberately did not want to invest any money in inner city US schools because she knows the average kid and their parents do not give a ####### about learning.

Which just reinforces my early point of why do they insist on living in post industrial era inner cities which require skilled labor to acquire work. So they do not want to get an education, which is provided FREE of charge, and they do not want to move where they can find jobs. Yet anyone foreign, like myself, pointing this out is racist.

I have a proposal. How about we have an exchange program. Any African American who still feels wronged and hates this country for whatever reason can go back to their country and in their place we will accept the millions of people from Africa who would die to come here and make a life for themselves and their family. Setup a fund and I will sponsor that myself. Or as Alex in her infinite wisdom pointed out I must be racist towards specifically poor inner city African Americans. Must be a new kind of micro-racism

I think its easy to make trite comments about other peoples circumstances and their social attitudes when you're sitting in a position of relative privilege. I suspect its the bald generalisations that people object to.

Marc BTW - did not point anything out. He took someone elses words and used them for his own.

No, Marc did not use it for his own, he has a linked source right in the post! You, above, said as much, as well.

Quote tags are for quotes. Otherwise it looks like your stealing someone elses words - and clearly someone made that connection.

And you called it a quote like I highlighted above! It wasn't till others kept agreeing that it became stolen words...!

I agree, quotes or italic type should have been used, but we still knew it was a quote. I'm only pointing out that you called it a quote already.

Only because I looked in the link. The person who agreed with it appeared not to do that.

Digging and digging,deeper and deeper! Wow were way off topic by the way. lol

Edited June 28, 2007 by CarolsMarc

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

That quote is a fair point - but the assumption then appears to be that Oprah should somehow be responsible for addressing the plight of inner city kids in the US rather than anywhere else. A private philanthropist spending her own money to fund a school in Africa is not the same as if the government were to do it with taxpayers money. Ultimately its her money to spend as she likes - but investing in education (anywhere) can only be a good thing, no?

As marc pointed out she deliberately did not want to invest any money in inner city US schools because she knows the average kid and their parents do not give a ####### about learning.

Which just reinforces my early point of why do they insist on living in post industrial era inner cities which require skilled labor to acquire work. So they do not want to get an education, which is provided FREE of charge, and they do not want to move where they can find jobs. Yet anyone foreign, like myself, pointing this out is racist.

I have a proposal. How about we have an exchange program. Any African American who still feels wronged and hates this country for whatever reason can go back to their country and in their place we will accept the millions of people from Africa who would die to come here and make a life for themselves and their family. Setup a fund and I will sponsor that myself. Or as Alex in her infinite wisdom pointed out I must be racist towards specifically poor inner city African Americans. Must be a new kind of micro-racism

I think its easy to make trite comments about other peoples circumstances and their social attitudes when you're sitting in a position of relative privilege. I suspect its the bald generalisations that people object to.

Marc BTW - did not point anything out. He took someone elses words and used them for his own.

No, Marc did not use it for his own, he has a linked source right in the post! You, above, said as much, as well.

Quote tags are for quotes. Otherwise it looks like your stealing someone elses words - and clearly someone made that connection.

And you called it a quote like I highlighted above! It wasn't till others kept agreeing that it became stolen words...!

I agree, quotes or italic type should have been used, but we still knew it was a quote. I'm only pointing out that you called it a quote already.

Only because I looked in the link. The person who agreed with it appeared not to do that.

Digging and digging,deeper and deeper!

Its still plagiarism whether you want to admit it or not. Just depends whether you think its worth going off the chain of argument you were on to deny it.

[Caladan 19]

If you think all black people live in the inner city, I suggest that you head South where there are thriving middle-class blacks. The Carolinas, Georgia, etc.... It isn't a problem of race.

I also think it's a bit silly to insist that poor people move out of the cities... to where? Cities have clusters of jobs, better public transportation (good for someone without a car), and more apartments than single-family homes, which is good when you can't afford a down payment. And it's even sillier given that most of the people who live in the suburbs commute... to the city... to find work. How does adopting a more expensive lifestyle help the poor get out of poverty?

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

That quote is a fair point - but the assumption then appears to be that Oprah should somehow be responsible for addressing the plight of inner city kids in the US rather than anywhere else. A private philanthropist spending her own money to fund a school in Africa is not the same as if the government were to do it with taxpayers money. Ultimately its her money to spend as she likes - but investing in education (anywhere) can only be a good thing, no?

As marc pointed out she deliberately did not want to invest any money in inner city US schools because she knows the average kid and their parents do not give a ####### about learning.

Which just reinforces my early point of why do they insist on living in post industrial era inner cities which require skilled labor to acquire work. So they do not want to get an education, which is provided FREE of charge, and they do not want to move where they can find jobs. Yet anyone foreign, like myself, pointing this out is racist.

I have a proposal. How about we have an exchange program. Any African American who still feels wronged and hates this country for whatever reason can go back to their country and in their place we will accept the millions of people from Africa who would die to come here and make a life for themselves and their family. Setup a fund and I will sponsor that myself. Or as Alex in her infinite wisdom pointed out I must be racist towards specifically poor inner city African Americans. Must be a new kind of micro-racism

I think its easy to make trite comments about other peoples circumstances and their social attitudes when you're sitting in a position of relative privilege. I suspect its the bald generalisations that people object to.

Marc BTW - did not point anything out. He took someone elses words and used them for his own.

No, Marc did not use it for his own, he has a linked source right in the post! You, above, said as much, as well.

Quote tags are for quotes. Otherwise it looks like your stealing someone elses words - and clearly someone made that connection.

And you called it a quote like I highlighted above! It wasn't till others kept agreeing that it became stolen words...!

I agree, quotes or italic type should have been used, but we still knew it was a quote. I'm only pointing out that you called it a quote already.

Only because I looked in the link. The person who agreed with it appeared not to do that.

Digging and digging,deeper and deeper!

Its still plagiarism whether you want to admit it or not. Just depends whether you think its worth going off the chain of argument you were on to deny it.

Okay Im a plagiarist! Now what? Sung to the song of true colors by Cindy Lauper.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If you think all black people live in the inner city, I suggest that you head South where there are thriving middle-class blacks. The Carolinas, Georgia, etc.... It isn't a problem of race.

I also think it's a bit silly to insist that poor people move out of the cities... to where? Cities have clusters of jobs, better public transportation (good for someone without a car), and more apartments than single-family homes, which is good when you can't afford a down payment. And it's even sillier given that most of the people who live in the suburbs commute... to the city... to find work. How does adopting a more expensive lifestyle help the poor get out of poverty?

Isn't the whole thing with poverty that you have less choices available to you when you're poor - like choosing where to live.

Okay Im a plagiarist! Now what?

Now

[Heracles 417]

If you think all black people live in the inner city, I suggest that you head South where there are thriving middle-class blacks. The Carolinas, Georgia, etc.... It isn't a problem of race.

I also think it's a bit silly to insist that poor people move out of the cities... to where? Cities have clusters of jobs, better public transportation (good for someone without a car), and more apartments than single-family homes, which is good when you can't afford a down payment. And it's even sillier given that most of the people who live in the suburbs commute... to the city... to find work. How does adopting a more expensive lifestyle help the poor get out of poverty?

Well I can see how well living in the city is going for them. What sort of job is someone in Harlem or DC going to get without being skilled or educated? I guess people like Bill Cosby and Oprah must be foolish to say that people need to get off their ### and find a job.

Actually it is not silly at all and works well in countries like AUS where unemployed people are given a grant to move to areas of high employment and demand.

Why do so many people in the US live in the outer suburbs? Because the inner US cities are dumps period. Whereas inner city living is extremely expensive in most other developed cities.

PS Gezz I wonder why no US city makes the world most livable city list.

Edited June 28, 2007 by Infidel

[Alex+R 0]

If you think all black people live in the inner city, I suggest that you head South where there are thriving middle-class blacks. The Carolinas, Georgia, etc.... It isn't a problem of race.

I also think it's a bit silly to insist that poor people move out of the cities... to where? Cities have clusters of jobs, better public transportation (good for someone without a car), and more apartments than single-family homes, which is good when you can't afford a down payment. And it's even sillier given that most of the people who live in the suburbs commute... to the city... to find work. How does adopting a more expensive lifestyle help the poor get out of poverty?

Even places like here in Minneapolis, where there are a lot of factories in the suburbs, people still can't aford to live near the factory. So poor people who live in the city bus several hours a day to come out to the factory and work. Then they bus home at night. There's no way they can afford to live in the suburb, and they don't seem to have cars. Because of the conveniences you mentioned, I'm sure these people would rather work in the city, especially since moving away from it seems to not be an option.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If you think all black people live in the inner city, I suggest that you head South where there are thriving middle-class blacks. The Carolinas, Georgia, etc.... It isn't a problem of race.

I also think it's a bit silly to insist that poor people move out of the cities... to where? Cities have clusters of jobs, better public transportation (good for someone without a car), and more apartments than single-family homes, which is good when you can't afford a down payment. And it's even sillier given that most of the people who live in the suburbs commute... to the city... to find work. How does adopting a more expensive lifestyle help the poor get out of poverty?

Well I can see how well living in the city is going for them. What sort of job is someone in Harlem or DC going to get without being skilled or educated? I guess people like Bill Cosby and Oprah must be foolish to say that people need to get off their ### and find a job.

Actually it is not silly at all and works well in countries like AUS where unemployed people are given a grant to move to areas of high employment and demand.

Why do so many people in the US live in the outer suburbs? Because the inner US cities are dumps period. Whereas inner city living is extremely expensive in most other developed cities.

PS Gezz I wonder why no US city makes the world most livable city list.

That'll go down well with the "no government handout" crowd.

[Caladan 19]

Moving to the suburbs isn't going to help if the jobs are still in the city! If you want to give people a grant to move somewhere where there is work, that's smart.

But absent a grant, we're in unicorn territory. Higher education isn't free. Picking up your life and moving across the country to find work isn't free. Moving into the suburbs isn't free, either. The thing with the poor is they don't have the money to get started.

PS why do so many people in the US live in the outer suburbs? Because the inner US cities are dumbs period. The inner city is extremely expensive in most other developed cities.

Just as a matter of fact, I think you have the causality backwards. People who could leave the cities did so either because they wanted more land, or because they didn't like the cities, or whatever.... Tax base of the city drops as the poorest are all that's left, and then the schools & property values go to hell because there isn't enough of a tax base to support it.

[Heracles 417]

Even places like here in Minneapolis, where there are a lot of factories in the suburbs, people still can't aford to live near the factory.

Please tell me what sort of factory work poor people will find in Harlem and DC.

There's no way they can afford to live in the suburb, and they don't seem to have cars. Because of the conveniences you mentioned, I'm sure these people would rather work in the city, especially since moving away from it seems to not be an option.

Funny how the illegal immigrants have no issue with moving to the outer suburbs or countryside to find work..

[Heracles 417]

The thing with the poor is they don't have the money to get started.

As Gupt put it earlier thousands of other immigrants have moved to the US and capitalized on the opportunities in the US. Both legal and Illegal immigrants do it all the time. That is migrate here with no tax payer funded benefits, no food stamps EBT and pretty much the clothes on the back yet build a life for themselves.

Edited June 28, 2007 by Infidel

[Pinocchio Liberal 268]

The thing with the poor is they don't have the money to get started.

As Gupt put it earlier thousands of other immigrants have moved to the US and capitalized on the opportunities in the US. Both legal and Illegal immigrants do it all the time. That is migrate here with no tax payer funded benefits, no food stamps EBT and pretty much the clothes on the back yet build a life for themselves.

Exactly Infidel, some ppl only see what they want to see and not the reality.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

This just goes back to the idea that successful people often see the failures of others as somehow deserved. In doing so you can’t fail to make wide-ranging assumptions about people’s circumstances, background and general outlook.

[Caladan 19]

The thing with the poor is they don't have the money to get started.

As Gupt put it earlier thousands of other immigrants have moved to the US and capitalized on the opportunities in the US. Both legal and Illegal immigrants do it all the time. That is migrate here with no tax payer funded benefits, no food stamps EBT and pretty much the clothes on the back yet build a life for themselves.

Someone who immigrates here must have a sponsor in lieu of all of the tax-payer funded benefits, so 'just the clothes on their back' should be 'just the clothes on their back and someone who either is employing them or guaranteeing their place of residence', right? I'm seeing reality and it has a I-864 attached.

Plus one of four immigrants lives below the poverty line, so, at a poverty rate of 25%, they're not exactly beating out the American public.

Edited June 28, 2007 by Caladan