I'm lost. It doesn't make sense to me.

[Captain Ewok 1,891]

didn't they already close this thread earlier.-people complaining about the mods/personal attacks etc.

i think it came to this:1- have some respect for each other. 2- the mods don't get involved till it gets stupid. 3-the mods try to cool it before they kill a thread. 4- the mods are the mods coz ewok trust their judgement. 5- this is ewoks site & ewok makes the rules. 6- have some respect for each other.

QED

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q.E.D.

[MichelleandCraig 1]

Oh, Chas, I *totally* agree with you on this one.

Lisa, you know what he's getting at no matter how many times the two of you go 'round about it. Yes, you're right...it takes two to tango, just don't respond and all that... but he's also right and, IMO, you haven't really answered what he was asking. He was basically saying...why should the onus be on the one who IS BEING BAITED not to fight? Why shouldn't the responsibility at least ALSO lie with the one who is doing the baiting? Maybe I missed if you said that outright somewhere, Chas, and again, I don't mean to be putting words in your mouth,but I think that's what you meant, and I totally agree with it.

To me, it smacks of a schoolyard with a playground bully. In comparison to what we're discussing, the one being bullied would be pulled into the principal's office because he hit the big bully bacl who hit him first....doesn't really make much sense...yanno?? M.

Gupt, even tho you weren't speaking to me, I'm gonna comment on your last post anyway...

No, can't do anything about something that wasn't done yet...but in MANY (not all) instances, people doing the baiting have a history of it. These posters need to be watched a bit more closely when the mods can be here,warned once or twice,and banned for a time if it continues. A lot of people won't agree with me on that, but that's what an opinion is for, and that's mine on this particular subject. To go with the playground analogy again, a bully doesn't normally just bully once in a great while...they usually kind have a rep for it you know?

Edited June 26, 2007 by MichelleandCraig

[PlatyPius 5]

I am not sure if TOS violation is the best term for closing the other thread but it was off topic and the pinned topic at the top of this forum even specifically states that such threads will be closed and members given the opportunity to restart it (hopefully to not go off topic again).

There were repeated attacks (on 4 points), which, according to your own TOS, is NOT ALLOWED. I had to PM 2 mods, AND ask 3x in the actual thread before it got closed.

VISAJOURNEY.COM TERMS OF SERVICE

Permitted Uses. You agree that you are responsible for any Content and communications that you Post and for any consequences thereof. You agree to use the Service (including but not limited to the discussion forums) only to send and receive messages, material, and in general Content that is "in conformity with or permitted by law" (legal), proper and if part of the discussion forums then also related to the particular subject matter. By way of example, and not as a limitation, you agree that when using the Service, you will not:

• Defame, abuse, harass, stalk, threaten or otherwise violate the legal rights (such as rights of privacy and publicity) of others.

• Publish, Post, upload, distribute or disseminate or offer to do the same any inappropriate, defamatory, infringing, obscene, or unlawful material, information, or in general, Content.

• Restrict or inhibit any other user from using and enjoying the Forums.

• Make comments in a Post either direct or implied toward another member that are purposely designed to upset, antagonize, make fun of, belittle, or otherwise instigate an argument that takes away from the personal enjoyment of the Service by other users.

I'm pretty sure that Ewok was referring to the previous thread in THIS forum about THIS topic that was closed. The topic you are referring to is over, done, and forgotten. Continuing to worry at a wound that has already healed is rather pointless.

[TracyTN 237]

My impression of the new 'Thread ownership' thread was that it sprung out of the situation in devilette's UK forum thread. (Although only Lisa can say for sure what prompted her to ask that question.)

And this thread is also about closing threads and trying to understand the reasons behind it.

Just because you don't like devilette doesn't mean that the issues which happened in that thread aren't still relevant (or still a cause of confusion for some people).

[Mags 112]

didn't they already close this thread earlier.-people complaining about the mods/personal attacks etc.

i think it came to this:1- have some respect for each other. 2- the mods don't get involved till it gets stupid. 3-the mods try to cool it before they kill a thread. 4- the mods are the mods coz ewok trust their judgement. 5- this is ewoks site & ewok makes the rules. 6- have some respect for each other.

QED

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q.E.D.

[Sinergy 3]

deleted. sigh its just not worth it

Edited June 26, 2007 by Ionescu

[rebeccajo 14]

You all need to learn to differentiate between you are being baited just as much as the rest of the board is being baited.

If you ever feel that you are being baited, it doesn't mean you have to rise to the occasion. That's a personal choice, no?

Well apparantly baiting someone is a violation of TOS and demands some form of action. If the bait is is set, then I think you have the right to rise accordingly. Why let the one doing the baiting have the last word and feel they have the upper hand in such situations.

I think I have seen many people "bait" you Lisa, rightly or wrongly, but I have never seen you, NOT rise to the occasion.

Then you haven't been paying close enough attn

The reason why I say that is I feel it's all personal responsibility. You (generic you here) want to call someone names...go right ahead and do so. But take the responsibility for it and not stand behind 'oh so and so was baiting me'. Its your choice.

Whether or not any threads are started in malice is not the point...it's how they are reacted to that lies with the person doing the reacting. And we can all get along much better once we keep that in mind.

That's like saying it's ok for somebody to stand and throw rocks at a window, but the guy on the inside of the window is responsible for being unhappy about that.

[chri'stina 190]

My impression of the new 'Thread ownership' thread was that it sprung out of the situation in devilette's UK forum thread. (Although only Lisa can say for sure what prompted her to ask that question.)

....

I see that Lisa is getting all the blame about asking this question, but I also asked this question in that thread which also made her think of it, so blame me if someone has to be blamed. It has nothing to do with devilette or any other person.

I am not sure why ppl took it as Lisa vs certain people. Maybe I am not aware of problems between some of you or something. The question was a valid VJ question.

But it did bring up that valid question about an OP being able to close a thread and for what circumstances that can happen. Ewok already answered by saying that he will close the thread if requested by the OP almost every time. Now the other mods know that too. But it was a good thing to ask and I am glad I asked it, and that Lisa asked it, because we did get an answer.

Edited June 26, 2007 by stina&suj

[TracyTN 237]

My impression of the new 'Thread ownership' thread was that it sprung out of the situation in devilette's UK forum thread. (Although only Lisa can say for sure what prompted her to ask that question.)

....

I see that Lisa is getting all the blame about asking this question, but I also asked this question in that thread which also made her think of it, so blame me if someone has to be blamed. It has nothing to do with devilette or any other person.

But it did bring up that valid question about an OP being able to close a thread and for what circumstances that can happen. Ewok already answered by saying that he will close the thread if requested by the OP almost every time. Now the other mods know that too. But it was a good thing to ask and I am glad I asked it, and that Lisa asked it, because we did get an answer.

I wasn't 'blaming' Lisa for anything. Simply stating that only she knows exactly why she started her own thread. I'm sure she wouldn't appreciate me speculating that on her behalf! I wasn't 'blaming' you either (I didn't even remember you asking the question in that thread).

I actually brought up devilette's thread myself earlier on in THIS thread. However, my question wasn't quoted as being over and done with/a wound that had healed, etc. Only devilette referring to it suddenly made it a healed wound, old news, etc. I guess I don't see the difference in the two - except who posed the question.

Aside from the fact that the issues in that thread must still be relevant to folks if we're still talking about them (via two threads in this forum).

Edited June 26, 2007 by TracyTN

[Fandango 1,439]

Oh, Chas, I *totally* agree with you on this one.

Lisa, you know what he's getting at no matter how many times the two of you go 'round about it. Yes, you're right...it takes two to tango, just don't respond and all that... but he's also right and, IMO, you haven't really answered what he was asking. He was basically saying...why should the onus be on the one who IS BEING BAITED not to fight? Why shouldn't the responsibility at least ALSO lie with the one who is doing the baiting? Maybe I missed if you said that outright somewhere, Chas, and again, I don't mean to be putting words in your mouth,but I think that's what you meant, and I totally agree with it.

To me, it smacks of a schoolyard with a playground bully. In comparison to what we're discussing, the one being bullied would be pulled into the principal's office because he hit the big bully bacl who hit him first....doesn't really make much sense...yanno?? M.

Gupt, even tho you weren't speaking to me, I'm gonna comment on your last post anyway...

No, can't do anything about something that wasn't done yet...but in MANY (not all) instances, people doing the baiting have a history of it. These posters need to be watched a bit more closely when the mods can be here,warned once or twice,and banned for a time if it continues. A lot of people won't agree with me on that, but that's what an opinion is for, and that's mine on this particular subject. To go with the playground analogy again, a bully doesn't normally just bully once in a great while...they usually kind have a rep for it you know?

My only point was, if you feel you're is being baited, you can go to E or the mods or simply choose to not participate. But if you retaliate, that's your choice and you should be held accountable for such, not justify it by 'oh I was baited'. I think the problem lies in the fact that since text is one dimensional, sometimes things can be taken completely wrong...and what is construed as 'baiting' may not always be the case.

In my case with that thread lock...I wasn't baiting anyone. I was asking a question. Now some may believe that and others won't...but at the end of the day it took 3 mod warnings and a lock to ease a situation. Which I find silly. People won't always like each other and feelings will obviously brew...but at the end of the day everyone here is an adult.

Devilette, you're right...I shouldn't have used the word 'malice'.

Tracy...I did start that thread partially out of the Devilette lock. I was confused as to why some threads get posts made invis, and others get locked. I thought it was pretty on topic for the most part & since it wasn't concerning any personal information, I was surprised to see it get locked instead of having the offending posts made invis & carrying on with the discussion. Sometimes, an OP lock seems odd...like 'ok this is not where I wanted this to go, so everyone stop talking about this now!' If there's still a flow and a life to a discussion, I don't see why it should be locked so long as there's no exceptions like I listed before. But that wasn't the only thread I've seen it in. Like in site discussion, the whole 'thanks for understanding' thread got an OP lock which I found strange too. And there were a few lately in OT as well.

In my initial post in that thread, I stated that you could go back into my posts to see a similar previous comment from a while ago...only to prove that it was something I had mentioned before and hopefully to show that it was a legitimate question & not done to flame anyone. But again, believe that or not, your choice.

Busy at work today peeps...cya later!

[Sheriff Uling 3]

They always say that two wrongs don't make a right or is it, two rights don't make a wrong. Oh whatever! The point is that both the initiator and retaliator are BOTH wrong. Moreover, they are both in violation of the TOS.

Cheers!!!

Sheriff Uling

Edited June 26, 2007 by Sheriff Uling

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Gupt, even tho you weren't speaking to me, I'm gonna comment on your last post anyway...

No, can't do anything about something that wasn't done yet...but in MANY (not all) instances, people doing the baiting have a history of it. These posters need to be watched a bit more closely when the mods can be here,warned once or twice,and banned for a time if it continues. A lot of people won't agree with me on that, but that's what an opinion is for, and that's mine on this particular subject. To go with the playground analogy again, a bully doesn't normally just bully once in a great while...they usually kind have a rep for it you know?

yes, i know. but even with the habitual bully, you don't pull the mod trigger until after he's made a mistake. yes, by doing so you prevent future 'incidents' but you still don't prevent the triggering event.

[Fandango 1,439]

Hey Stina...I missed your post before, but thank you for your post.

[Tim and Bethanie 1]

I found these and thought how very much they apply to the topic at hand. A bully continues to pick the fight yet the bullied is supposed to be the stronger of the two and keep their mouthes shut? Smells like bully-sh*t to me. Tis the natural instinct of the bully to not get a reaction, but for his/her victim to shut up and take it. This makes the bully the BULLY!

Perhaps anyone who is not a bully should keep quiet and let the bullies run the entire forum, since this is after all what they are after. Once all of the bullied folks are gone the bullies can then take pot shots at one another. Fun fun!

"Bullies are always cowards at heart and may be credited with a pretty safe instinct in scenting their prey. "

~Anna Julia Cooper~

"Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life, but define yourself."

~Harvey S. Firestone~

[Fandango 1,439]

I found these and thought how very much they apply to the topic at hand. A bully continues to pick the fight yet the bullied is supposed to be the stronger of the two and keep their mouthes shut? Smells like bully-sh*t to me. Tis the natural instinct of the bully to not get a reaction, but for his/her victim to shut up and take it. This makes the bully the BULLY!

Perhaps anyone who is not a bully should keep quiet and let the bullies run the entire forum, since this is after all what they are after. Once all of the bullied folks are gone the bullies can then take pot shots at one another. Fun fun!

"Bullies are always cowards at heart and may be credited with a pretty safe instinct in scenting their prey. "

~Anna Julia Cooper~

"Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life, but define yourself."

~Harvey S. Firestone~

If this is in response to what I said, then I'll say this:

No one is saying that a person feeling bullied should keep his/her mouth shut per se, but when the reaction denigrates into a name calling, bickering childish argument...which one is the bully? I'll turn this on myself for one sec. I started a thread about thread locks. It was automatically assumed to be 'antagonistic' even though I specified it wasn't. That was used as justification for animosity & so much childishness, that the thread wound up getting locked. When the thread was asking a legitimate question.

The bottom line is....you (generic you here) may not like me, I may not like you...but every time we're in a thread together does not mean that one or the other needs to look for some 'hidden insult' to get offended by and used as justification for acting in a manner unsuitable for an adult. If both parties feel bullied, then where's it end? Both sides feeling justified to throw sh!t in the other's direction, with no one taking responsibility for it? No, surely there's a much calmer and more adult way to deal with something as basic as a personality conflict on a message board.

Your quotes can probably be applicable for every person alive. Perspective is reality. I most certainly define my own life & am not pushed into silence. But I'm a biotch because of it, hahahaha. And because of such, it's ok to treat me in whichever manner one sees fit. Eh, it's no big shakes but the irony is astounding.