Indiana Governor To Churches: Worship As I Say Or Be Shut Down

[Ban Hammer 13,551]

11 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Beyond ridiculous. Abortion is always safer than continuing the pregnancy. Always. You want to force women to give birth? You're do realize there's no alternative, right? Pro forced birth 

 

what's beyond ridiculous is claiming abortion is essential no matter what.  what's beyond ridiculous is claiming that someone who just wants to get rid of their kid is on the same level as police, medical staff, and so forth.

[Orangesapples 1,954]

Just now, Ban Hammer said:

what's beyond ridiculous is claiming abortion is essential no matter what.  what's beyond ridiculous is claiming that someone who just wants to get rid of their kid is on the same level as police, medical staff, and so forth.

There's no kid, there's a pregnancy that needs to be stopped. Of course that bodily autonomy is essential. 

[Boiler 46,117]

1 minute ago, Orangesapples said:

There's no kid, there's a pregnancy that needs to be stopped. Of course that bodily autonomy is essential. 

So somebody dying with COVID or a normal pregnancy, who should get priority?

[Orangesapples 1,954]

2 minutes ago, Boiler said:

So somebody dying with COVID or a normal pregnancy, who should get priority?

Good thing that they're not competing and good thing that abortion is a quick and easy procedure (or just prescribing pills) unlike taking care of COVID patients. 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

Just now, Boiler said:

So somebody dying with COVID or a normal pregnancy, who should get priority?

 

  We see both every day. Priority goes to whoever needs treatment most urgently. Neither situation is considered elective so both patients would get treatment.

 

  Now if you show up with a hernia or something, they might tell you to go home and wait till it hurts more.

[Ban Hammer 13,551]

7 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

There's no kid, there's a pregnancy that needs to be stopped. Of course that bodily autonomy is essential. 

still a child to many.  still not essential just because you claim it so.

no officer, we're not violating the essential personnel only quarantine, we're on the way to get an abortion! 

[Orangesapples 1,954]

2 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

still a child to many.  still not essential just because you claim it so.

no officer, we're not violating the essential personnel only quarantine, we're on the way to get an abortion! 

A medical procedure *

 

And who cares what "many" think of your pregnancy. It's your pregnancy. Only the woman can decide if she wants to be a host to another organism. Just because some random person might think it's a child, doesn't mean it is. 

 

Abortion is healthcare. 

[Ban Hammer 13,551]

4 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

A medical procedure *

 

And who cares what "many" think of your pregnancy. It's your pregnancy. Only the woman can decide if she wants to be a host to another organism. Just because some random person might think it's a child, doesn't mean it is. 

 

Abortion is healthcare. 

if the mother's life is not in danger, it's elective surgery.  not essential.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

Abortion is NOT healthcare unless one of the two involved is about to die.  It's just an elective procedure to eliminate future responsibility in that case.  Also, unless one or the other is about to die, abortion CAN wait, weeks in fact.

[millefleur 5,047]

1 minute ago, Ban Hammer said:

if the mother's life is not in danger, it's elective surgery.  not essential.

Was just about to say that. A woman can also elect not to engage in activities which may lead to pregnancy. She can elect not to "host [a certain] organ(ism)" into her body that would lead to the pregnancy in the first place (unless it was rape.)

[Boiler 46,117]

15 minutes ago, Steeleballz said:

 

  We see both every day. Priority goes to whoever needs treatment most urgently. Neither situation is considered elective so both patients would get treatment.

 

  Now if you show up with a hernia or something, they might tell you to go home and wait till it hurts more.

The discussion is whether is is essential not if Hospitals treat it as elective, and I can see the argument. When you have Police checking the aisles to see if what you are buying is essential, road blocks etc becomes an interesting discussion. 

 

When you deal in absolutes these issues arise. very little in my life experience is an absolute.

 

I thought this was funny, so I go into Ace yesterday and the owner has constructed shield by the till, he could have varnished the frames, so pointed that out, got a lecture from the cute check out lady to put my mask on so did, then I could not find what I wanted and asked a lady on staff, so she had to make a call on her radio and took her mask off to make it and talk to me. And of course most people I saw obviously had little knowledge of what they were doing, how they fit etc. Put them on to go in the store taken them off when they came out, out them back on when they went into the next one etc etc.

 

I have just realised that a couple I know are up here from Denver, so off to message them about that! Realistically if it hits my community probably be one of the second home owners.

[Orangesapples 1,954]

17 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Abortion is NOT healthcare unless one of the two involved is about to die.  It's just an elective procedure to eliminate future responsibility in that case.  Also, unless one or the other is about to die, abortion CAN wait, weeks in fact.

Childbirth is very risky and has long term health effects. Abortion is always, always, I repeat, always the safest alternative. So yes, it is healthcare. No woman should have to risk her life and her health just because some random people said so. 

[Steeleballz 7,550]

9 minutes ago, Boiler said:

The discussion is whether is is essential not if Hospitals treat it as elective, and I can see the argument. When you have Police checking the aisles to see if what you are buying is essential, road blocks etc becomes an interesting discussion. 

 

When you deal in absolutes these issues arise. very little in my life experience is an absolute.

 

I thought this was funny, so I go into Ace yesterday and the owner has constructed shield by the till, he could have varnished the frames, so pointed that out, got a lecture from the cute check out lady to put my mask on so did, then I could not find what I wanted and asked a lady on staff, so she had to make a call on her radio and took her mask off to make it and talk to me. And of course most people I saw obviously had little knowledge of what they were doing, how they fit etc. Put them on to go in the store taken them off when they came out, out them back on when they went into the next one etc etc.

 

I have just realised that a couple I know are up here from Denver, so off to message them about that! Realistically if it hits my community probably be one of the second home owners.

 

 

   I guess that's why I brought up the example of the hernia though. Many things are elective for a time, but we know they will eventually become emergent. I actually know someone with a hernia who was told what I said there - wait till this is over or come back when it starts to hurt. It's not a good approach. Obviously, there are times during pregnancy where you could tell someone to come back next week, and there are also scenarios such as a code white emergency, where that patient would take priority over everything. As a general rule, issues related to pregnancy would not ever be treated as elective.

 

  

[Burnt Reynolds 5,058]

1 hour ago, Orangesapples said:

Abortion is a time sensitive medical procedure, of course its essential. You can pray at home if that's your hobby, nothing will change if you don't go to the church physically. Not any more than will change for someone working out at home instead of going to the gym. 

Nah, it's a hobby. Do it at home.

Edited April 12, 2020 by Burnt Reynolds

[Burnt Reynolds 5,058]

56 minutes ago, Ban Hammer said:

what's beyond ridiculous is claiming abortion is essential no matter what.  what's beyond ridiculous is claiming that someone who just wants to get rid of their kid is on the same level as police, medical staff, and so forth.

That's the point, of course.

 

Body autonomy! Except for Christians.

 

Abortion super important! Religion just a hobby.