Italy Totally Fine Thanks To Universal Healthcare

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

Just now, Orangesapples said:

Yeah, a few people are gonna die, no big deal, let's just let their bodies accumulate and the hospitals get overwhelmed, a few healthcare professionals will die, no big deal! 

Sorry to hear you feel that way.  Because that isn't what is nor what WILL happen.  The people in those areas of public support will handle it just fine here in the US.

[abum 324]

1 minute ago, Voice of Reason said:

Sorry to hear you feel that way.  Because that isn't what is nor what WILL happen.  The people in those areas of public support will handle it just fine here in the US.

you do know that healthcare people/frontliners are also susceptible to get the virus as well as spreading it around too?

and there have been numbers of doctors/nurses died all over the world due to the virus?

[Orangesapples 1,954]

2 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Sorry to hear you feel that way.  Because that isn't what is nor what WILL happen.  The people in those areas of public support will handle it just fine here in the US.

Yeah, everything is going to be just fine, no pandemic to see here folks! 

Just now, abum said:

you do know that healthcare people/frontliners are also susceptible to get the virus as well as spreading it around too?

and there have been numbers of doctors/nurses died all over the world due to the virus?

No, that's just a few people dying, don't you know, old doctors are easy to replace! 

[Lemonslice 4,835]

2 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Ok, it began with the virus.  But what I mean is that the economy is going to blow up in our face, and it will be far worse than the deaths from this disease.  A few more people will die, sure, and those who lose their loved ones will mourn.  But that's just life.  The number of lives ruined because of the fear, I think that will be a larger as well as longer-lasting toll on us all.

Money can be made again. Dead people are dead.  I know I value life more than money. 

 

The stimulus/bailout is giving more money to corporations/businesses than to people. I'm not as worried as you are to see an economic slowdown - it's part of regular cycle in capitalist systems.   

 

If most people weren't able to save enough to cover their expenses for a few months before this crisis, bankruptcies will bring them back to zero - but they were already close to zero...  I'm other words, after some time, poor people will be back to bring poor, rich people will be richer, and us in the middle will be in between. I'm confident the economy will just go back to a growth period. 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

3 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

Yeah, everything is going to be just fine, no pandemic to see here folks! 

 

3 minutes ago, abum said:

you do know that healthcare people/frontliners are also susceptible to get the virus as well as spreading it around too?

and there have been numbers of doctors/nurses died all over the world due to the virus?

I'm curious why neither of you fine folks have made one single post on here about the 97,347 people who have died in automobile deaths since the beginning of the month?  What will all the morgues do with those bodies?  

 

Covid-19 deaths: 26,455

Edited March 27, 2020 by Voice of Reason

[abum 324]

Just now, Voice of Reason said:

 

I'm curious why neither of you fine folks have made one single post on here about the 97,347 people who have died in automobile deaths since the beginning of the month?  What will all the morgues do with those bodies?  

 

Covid-19 deaths: 26,455

 

1. is the death concentrated at a single location? around the same time? 
2. can you see vehicles coming at you? Can you avoid the streets? Can you slow down etc?

3. would those died in the accidents, require prolong life support at the same time? at a single location? 

 

If you wanna compare the number of unnecessary deaths, pick a better comparison. 

[Orangesapples 1,954]

4 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

 

I'm curious why neither of you fine folks have made one single post on here about the 97,347 people who have died in automobile deaths since the beginning of the month?  What will all the morgues do with those bodies?  

 

Covid-19 deaths: 26,455

I love the whataboutism. You do realize that this is just the beginning, right? That if there is no lockdown, things are gonna be much worse?

 

Coincidentally, the lockdown helps lower traffic deaths. 

Edited March 27, 2020 by Orangesapples

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

1 minute ago, Orangesapples said:

I love the whataboutism. You do realize that this is just the beginning, right? That if there is no lockdown, things are gonna be much worse?

 

Coincidentally, the lockdown helps lower traffic deaths. 

If there IS a lockdown, you will see an economic disaster that will make the 1930s seem like a walk in the park.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

7 minutes ago, abum said:

 

1. is the death concentrated at a single location? around the same time? 
2. can you see vehicles coming at you? Can you avoid the streets? Can you slow down etc?

3. would those died in the accidents, require prolong life support at the same time? at a single location? 

 

If you wanna compare the number of unnecessary deaths, pick a better comparison. 

Ok, ignore the 1,350,000 million automobile deaths EVERY YEAR.

 

Let's use the flu, shall we?  24,000-62,000 deaths (no way of knowing for sure, but likely to be somewhere in the middle, so let's use 43,000).  45,000,000 illnesses.  550,000 hospitalizations.  

Edited March 27, 2020 by Voice of Reason

[abum 324]

Just now, Orangesapples said:

I love the whataboutism. You do realize that this is just the beginning, right? That if there is no lockdown, things are gonna be much worse. 

 

Coincidentally, the lockdown helps lower traffic deaths. 

 

https://time.com/5799586/italy-coronavirus-outbreak/

 

Quote

How did coronavirus start spreading in Italy?

Officially it began in Feb. 20, when a 38-year-old man checked himself into a local hospital in the town of Codogno in Lombardy. He tested positive with the virus, becoming the first recorded patient with the COVID-19 virus in Italy.

Yet some health officials believe that the virus arrived in Italy long before the first case was discovered. “The virus had probably been circulating for quite some time,” Flavia Riccardo, a researcher in the Department of Infectious Diseases at the Italian National Institute of Health tells TIME. “This happened right when we were having our peak of influenza and people were presenting with influenza symptoms.”

Before the first case was reported, there was an unusually high number of pneumonia cases recorded at a hospital in Codogno in northern Italy, the head of the emergency ward Stefano Paglia told the newspaper La Repubblica, suggesting it is possible patients with the virus were treated as if they had a seasonal flu. Health facilities hosting these patients could have become sites for infection, helping proliferate the spread of the virus.

The northern regions of Lombardy, Veneto and Emilia-Romagna, have been most affected by the outbreak. 85% of infected patients are in the region which is home to 92% of deaths so far. But the virus has been confirmed in all 20 regions of the country.

Why does Italy have such a high number of cases and deaths?

Because the virus spread undetected, some officials believe this is the reason for such a high number of cases in the country. “This started unnoticed which means by the time we realized it, there were a lot of transmission chains happening,” Riccardo says, noting that this may be why Italy has seen such a high number of cases.

 

 

 

2 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

If there IS a lockdown, you will see an economic disaster that will make the 1930s seem like a walk in the park.

Cool hope those who feels the same way, could live back in the 30s and then it would make everything better right now. 

[Orangesapples 1,954]

8 minutes ago, abum said:

 

1. is the death concentrated at a single location? around the same time? 
2. can you see vehicles coming at you? Can you avoid the streets? Can you slow down etc?

3. would those died in the accidents, require prolong life support at the same time? at a single location? 

 

If you wanna compare the number of unnecessary deaths, pick a better comparison. 

Also, society is already trying to minimize traffic related deaths - there are laws, severe penalties for breaking them, cars are manufactured with more safety features, etc. It's not like we're just letting cars hit each other and people drive drunk. 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

Just now, Orangesapples said:

Also, society is already trying to minimize traffic related deaths - there are laws, severe penalties for breaking them, cars are manufactured with more safety features, etc. It's not like we're just letting cars hit each other and people drive drunk. 

You don't get it, and I don't know how to help you get it.  Sorry you feel the way you do.

[Orangesapples 1,954]

5 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

You don't get it, and I don't know how to help you get it.  Sorry you feel the way you do.

I'm afraid you're the one not getting it. 

[Lemonslice 4,835]

People were hurt, but survived the 1930 crisis.  FDIC was created after to protect deposits - maybe something else will be improved this time? Maybe linking health insurance  to employment is not the best idea if everyone is losing their job in a health crisis? I'm definitely optimistic at this time. 

 

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It does not really matter how many deaths happen for other reasons, in my opinion.  The question is, are some of the deaths avoidable now?  Car safety devices will improve car accidents outcomes, flu vaccines will lessen the damages from the flu, and... isolation will help with COVID-19.

 

9/11 was only a few thousands deaths.  Why did the US even react to such a small casualty?  Who cares that more veterans are killing themselves, than people were killed that day, but then, it's only 22 of them a day... the economy can survive that loss I guess. 

Edited March 27, 2020 by Lemonslice

[abum 324]

11 minutes ago, Lemonslice said:

People were hurt, but survived the 1930 crisis.  FDIC was created after to protect deposits - maybe something else will be improved this time? Maybe linking health insurance  to employment is not the best idea if everyone is losing their job in a health crisis? I'm definitely optimistic at this time. 

 

---

It does not really matter how many deaths happen for other reasons, in my opinion.  The question is, are some of the deaths avoidable now?  Car safety devices will improve car accidents outcomes, flu vaccines will lessen the damages from the flu, and... isolation will help with COVID-19.

 

9/11 was only a few thousands deaths.  Why did the US even react to such a small casualty?  Who cares that more veterans are killing themselves, than people were killed that day, but then, it's only 22 of them a day... the economy can survive that loss I guess. 

 

All these talks that downplay peoples lives reminds me of this