ICE to stop most immigration enforcement inside U.S., will focus on criminals during coronavirus outbreak

[laylalex 7,300]

Quote

 

U.S. immigration authorities will temporarily halt enforcement across the United States, except for its efforts to deport foreign nationals who have committed crimes or who pose a threat to public safety. The change in enforcement status comes amid the coronavirus outbreak and aims to limit the spread of the virus and to encourage those who need treatment to seek medical help.

Immigration and Customs Enforcement said late Wednesday that its Enforcement and Removal Operations division will “delay enforcement actions” and use “alternatives to detention” amid the outbreak, according to a notification the agency sent to Congress.

ICE told members of Congress that its “highest priorities are to promote lifesaving and public safety activities.”

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/ice-halting-most-immigration-enforcement/2020/03/18/d0516228-696c-11ea-abef-020f086a3fab_story.html

[Orangesapples 1,954]

That's great news. No one should be afraid to seek medical care. 

[laylalex 7,300]

1 hour ago, Orangesapples said:

That's great news. No one should be afraid to seek medical care. 

I think it's the right choice. Absolutely criminals should be subject to deportation, even now. But for those whose only crime is crossing the border without inspection or overstaying their visas, and who are just here living their lives without otherwise breaking the law, enforcement should be the lowest priority for an already overstretched system. 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

48 minutes ago, laylalex said:

I think it's the right choice. Absolutely criminals should be subject to deportation, even now. But for those whose only crime is crossing the border without inspection or overstaying their visas, and who are just here living their lives without otherwise breaking the law, enforcement should be the lowest priority for an already overstretched system. 

For those who only beat old people, or rob stores, or mug people on the streets, or steal cars, they should be let go too.

 

You should move to NY, you'd fit right in.

[Orangesapples 1,954]

13 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

For those who only beat old people, or rob stores, or mug people on the streets, or steal cars, they should be let go too.

 

You should move to NY, you'd fit right in.

No, they shouldn't but spending resources on deporting non criminals during a pandemic is a terrible idea. It's not urgent or essential in any way and it increases contact between strangers, not very good for social distancing. Also, if illegal immigrants are sick and they are afraid to go to the doctor or to get tested, then that makes managing the outbreak very challenging. South Korea let all illegal immigrants get tested and treated without any fear they might be deported. 

 

I don't have a problem with reasonable and humane immigration enforcement but desperate times call for desperate measures. 

[laylalex 7,300]

24 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

For those who only beat old people, or rob stores, or mug people on the streets, or steal cars, they should be let go too.

 

You should move to NY, you'd fit right in.

Seriously, that is NOT what I said at all. I said that criminals should still be subject to deportation. I literally said:

 

1 hour ago, laylalex said:

Absolutely criminals should be subject to deportation, even now. 

What was unclear about that that you thought I was for release of criminals from prisons AND that they should not be subject to deportation?

 

Please don't put words in my mouth.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

13 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

No, they shouldn't but spending resources on deporting non criminals during a pandemic is a terrible idea. It's not urgent or essential in any way and it increases contact between strangers, not very good for social distancing. Also, if illegal immigrants are sick and they are afraid to go to the doctor or to get tested, then that makes managing the outbreak very challenging. South Korea let all illegal immigrants get tested and treated without any fear they might be deported. 

 

I don't have a problem with reasonable and humane immigration enforcement but desperate times call for desperate measures. 

Do you know what the word means?  "A disease spread over a whole country or the world".  Like the flu.  And the common cold.  But not Lyme disease.

 

South Korea?  ALL illegal immigrants, as in all 230,000 of them?  Kinda pales compared to our 15-20 million, eh?  Sure, test them, treat them... then kick them out.

Edited March 19, 2020 by Voice of Reason

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

5 minutes ago, laylalex said:

Seriously, that is NOT what I said at all. I said that criminals should still be subject to deportation. I literally said:

 

What was unclear about that that you thought I was for release of criminals from prisons AND that they should not be subject to deportation?

 

Please don't put words in my mouth.

What is an illegal immigrant?  A criminal.  Every single one of them.

 

So I put NO words in your mouth, just pointed out the fallacy of your justification.  Respectfully, of course, with deference to your softness.

Edited March 19, 2020 by Voice of Reason

[Orangesapples 1,954]

19 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Do you know what the word means?  "A disease spread over a whole country or the world".  Like the flu.  And the common cold.  But not Lyme disease.

 

South Korea?  ALL illegal immigrants, as in all 230,000 of them?  Kinda pales compared to our 15-20 million, eh?  Sure, test them, treat them... then kick them out.

If they know they'll be kicked out after seeking treatment or testing, they will not get tested. The government needs to guarantee them that none of the information they submit for testing or treatment will be used against them. 

[Nature Boy 2.0 8,378]

24 minutes ago, Orangesapples said:

If they know they'll be kicked out after seeking treatment or testing, they will not get tested. The government needs to guarantee them that none of the information they submit for testing or treatment will be used against them. 

as the only middle of the road poster here. I dont have a problem with that. I also agree illegals that have committed crimes should be the top priority. 

[laylalex 7,300]

2 hours ago, Voice of Reason said:

What is an illegal immigrant?  A criminal.  Every single one of them.

 

So I put NO words in your mouth, just pointed out the fallacy of your justification.  Respectfully, of course, with deference to your softness.

I think we have a disconnect, and that is okay. I also said:

4 hours ago, laylalex said:

But for those whose only crime is crossing the border without inspection or overstaying their visas, and who are just here living their lives without otherwise breaking the law, enforcement should be the lowest priority for an already overstretched system. 

If this is their only crime (and I was wrong -- people who are overstays aren't even "criminals" because they have not committed a "crime" -- their offenses are civil) is entering without inspection, a misdemeanor, then they should be at the bottom of the list of priorities. Yes, they are "criminals" because they broke a law. But you know and I know what I meant when I said "criminals" -- not people who committed a single, non-violent misdemeanor offense. I think our disconnect is a semantic one, and that is okay.

 

Pressing pause right now is the right thing to do. Resources are dwindling by the day and need to be focused on the most dangerous and the worst fraudsters. The murderers, rapists, human traffickers, etc. Not the guy who crossed the border 25 years ago and has never been in trouble since then. Not the woman who overstayed her student visa and has been getting by without causing problems to anyone. We can argue about whether or not those people should be allowed to stay or not, or allowed to fix their status or not, or prosecuted or not. But that's not what we're talking about here.

 

[Nature Boy 2.0 8,378]

I saw Chuck S on tv tonight. He said none of the bailout money could go to bonuses,  executive salaries, and stock buy backs. Also said workers must be protected. 

 

Agree 100%

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

5 hours ago, laylalex said:

I think we have a disconnect, and that is okay. I also said:

If this is their only crime (and I was wrong -- people who are overstays aren't even "criminals" because they have not committed a "crime" -- their offenses are civil) is entering without inspection, a misdemeanor, then they should be at the bottom of the list of priorities. Yes, they are "criminals" because they broke a law. But you know and I know what I meant when I said "criminals" -- not people who committed a single, non-violent misdemeanor offense. I think our disconnect is a semantic one, and that is okay.

 

Pressing pause right now is the right thing to do. Resources are dwindling by the day and need to be focused on the most dangerous and the worst fraudsters. The murderers, rapists, human traffickers, etc. Not the guy who crossed the border 25 years ago and has never been in trouble since then. Not the woman who overstayed her student visa and has been getting by without causing problems to anyone. We can argue about whether or not those people should be allowed to stay or not, or allowed to fix their status or not, or prosecuted or not. But that's not what we're talking about here.

 

I have zero issues with treating them.  ALL humans deserve that much, no matter their status.  And I mean the world over, not just here.

 

But after they are well again??  Game on as far as deportations go.  There is a LEGAL option to get here, and we all had to pay for that privilege.

 

And all of that being said, I wouldn't want our police and ICE agents being exposed unnecessarily. 

[Orangesapples 1,954]

36 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

I have zero issues with treating them.  ALL humans deserve that much, no matter their status.  And I mean the world over, not just here.

 

But after they are well again??  Game on as far as deportations go.  There is a LEGAL option to get here, and we all had to pay for that privilege.

 

And all of that being said, I wouldn't want our police and ICE agents being exposed unnecessarily. 

You're still missing the point. If they don't know for sure they won't be deported they just won't seek testing and treatment. And that's a disaster. 

[laylalex 7,300]

1 hour ago, Voice of Reason said:

I have zero issues with treating them.  ALL humans deserve that much, no matter their status.  And I mean the world over, not just here.

 

But after they are well again??  Game on as far as deportations go.  There is a LEGAL option to get here, and we all had to pay for that privilege.

 

And all of that being said, I wouldn't want our police and ICE agents being exposed unnecessarily. 

I actually think we are pretty close to agreeing here.