Socialism's Inequalities

[Boiler 45,965]

Basically in the US the Politicians have been paid off by the Healthcare industry so they can maximise their profits, nothing free market about it.I have nver een anywhere else where Drug companies etc advertise, why would you, you are sick see a Doctor prescribed medicine to help and that is it.

[90DayFinancier 910]

1 hour ago, NikLR said:

Onto health care... an inhaler costs me $300 out of pocket because it's for my cat.  Pet insurance doesn't work like current human insurance fyi.

In Canada because medication is federally controlled, same inhaler costs me $80. Wouldnt matter if it was for me or my cat.  Wtheck on that mark up!

Because the script is written by a Colorado veterinarian they also cant fill the script except online.  

 

 

Whenever some talks about high American drug prices drive innovation, I can't argue about new therapies, but inhalers have been around forever. A few years back it was the epipen, old technology. Basic diabetes care is more expensive why? 

[90DayFinancier 910]

3 minutes ago, Boiler said:

Basically in the US the Politicians have been paid off by the Healthcare industry so they can maximise their profits, nothing free market about it.I have nver een anywhere else where Drug companies etc advertise, why would you, you are sick see a Doctor prescribed medicine to help and that is it.

I don't know what that purple pill is, but I want to ask my doctor if it's right for me.

[90DayFinancier 910]

10 hours ago, Boiler said:

Mine has Welsh ancestory!

Tony Hopkins, CZeta Jones, Richard Burton, Tom Jones, Dame Shirley Bassey...why are the Welsh sexy and talented.  Broke my heart 💔 going for brexit though.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

10 hours ago, NikLR said:

VA medical is poorly run. People do wait much longer for care.  Is it because there are also private systems in place? Possibly but doubtful.  BC Canada also has private systems in place for medical but majority use the system they already pay for in taxes.  You tend to wait longer in Canada for things that take less time here, but actually necessary things (like cancer treatment) is given priority over someone's hip replacement.  

Trying to compare systems though when the populous is so different is hard.  

 

In BC (arguably the most socialist of all Canadian provinces) you could only use one auto insurance provider, (government owned) which made it easier on people to purchase insurance and registration, also easier with accidents since everyone has the same insurance, BUT since there was zero competition, prices are terrible and payouts and decisions took forever.  In Alberta the system is better with more registration and license places, and competitive rates for insurance, but still government mandated fees and minimum coverages.  You also never see cars there with bumpers missing, panels bashed, missing windows etc as the police actually fine you for not having a safe vehicle vs just running speed traps. 

But how do the taxes work out up in the great white North?  Are they actually higher than down here in Southern Canada?

[Burnt Reynolds 5,058]

57 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

But how do the taxes work out up in the great white North?  Are they actually higher than down here in Southern Canada?

Except for one or two provinces, it's generally way higher in Canada -- Alberta is one of a few places where I paid less taxes (income and sales tax especially) than I did when in Silicon Valley and got universal. However, in certain states, like California and New York, they're closing that gap, but it's largely for other wasteful spending, like illegals, as one example.

 

These systems, however, are not systems that can be successful in perpetuity, they require significant cost controls. Like any system, even a democratic one, it requires the will of people to succeed. Otherwise, you see it rot, like the NHS. I think the best case scenario for the US and universal is on a local level, but honestly, if people are this brave to demand that, why aren't they brave enough to simply dismantle the insurance industry that's the #1 driver (of numerous drivers) in excess cost?

 

The one frustrating element I've consistently encountered with other Americans is their deluded idea that so many empty beds and no wait times is somehow a good thing. A lot of empty beds means low utilization, means excess cost. In Canada, you see them facilitating cost minimization, which is more akin to how a business should be run. In the US, you see government involved too, but in the facilitation of excess and waste.. we don't like government centralizing wealth, but here you see it happening.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Burnt Reynolds

[Burnt Reynolds 5,058]

The idea of keeping government out is good, if you actually keep government out. But government isn't out of healthcare in the US. It's very much involved, even for "conservatives", regardless of what they say they believe outwardly, they ultimately vote for bigger government/more government involvement, and the ultimate result, from both sides, is steering billions and billions to the wealthy, contributing to massive corruption, massive income inequality, etc.

 

If there are any conservatives left in politics who actually believe in getting government out, they'd put forth measures to gut the insurance industry.. it's a scam.

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

9 minutes ago, Burnt Reynolds said:

Except for one or two provinces, it's generally way higher in Canada -- Alberta is one of a few places where I paid less taxes (income and sales tax especially) than I did when in Silicon Valley and got universal. However, in certain states, like California and New York, they're closing that gap, but it's largely for other wasteful spending, like illegals, as one example.

 

These systems, however, are not systems that can be successful in perpetuity, they require significant cost controls. Like any system, even a democratic one, it requires the will of people to succeed. Otherwise, you see it rot, like the NHS.

Thanks, Burnt.  Without divulging any personal info, if you and other Canadians could give an idea what you pay in total taxes, as a percentage of income, that would be great.  It seems to be hard to nail down a figure.

 

As an example, my effective tax rate last year was 9.54% federally.  Of course, this does not account for state income tax, local and sales taxes, property taxes, etc.  I figure another few thousand dollars for those taxes, and I am around 21% overall (just estimating my sales tax, as I have no idea how much I actually pay).

[NikLR 13,232]

3 hours ago, Bill & Katya said:

I often wonder what would happen if every country controlled prescription prices.  I imagine less research and probably shortages at some point.

Doubtful.. it's the generics that get controlled so for the first 7 years the rx companies still make bank. 

[Burnt Reynolds 5,058]

5 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Thanks, Burnt.  Without divulging any personal info, if you and other Canadians could give an idea what you pay in total taxes, as a percentage of income, that would be great.  It seems to be hard to nail down a figure.

 

As an example, my effective tax rate last year was 9.54% federally.  Of course, this does not account for state income tax, local and sales taxes, property taxes, etc.  I figure another few thousand dollars for those taxes, and I am around 21% overall (just estimating my sales tax, as I have no idea how much I actually pay).

We've had that discussion before and I've given you the info. While I don't want my income paraded around the forum (for privacy reasons) you're free to disclose the marginal and average (effective) tax rates I gave you.

Edited March 3, 2020 by Burnt Reynolds

[NikLR 13,232]

I paid less in taxes in Alberta than I do here in Colorado.  GST runs an even 5% across the country, provincial tax (or the combined HST) can run total sales tax up to 15% depending on province but there are no local or county taxes.  Property taxes are more in AB. House prices are similar in Alberta depending on location obvs. 

Hubs works for the govt so we get fairly cheap health, dental, and vision insurance.  I paid put of pocket for rx, dental, and vision in AB. Theyre not covered under provincial health care.  My standard of care there was higher from my yearly visit to my ER. I havent even bothered to try an ER visit here as waiting painfully for the drs office seems the obvious choice with a 3k and 6k deductible (I'm double insured.) Regualr GP availability is the same but there are more specialists here. 

Food costs more in AB in terms of milk and meat.  But the quality IMHO is better. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by NikLR

[NikLR 13,232]

1 hour ago, Voice of Reason said:

But how do the taxes work out up in the great white North?  Are they actually higher than down here in Southern Canada?

Nah i pay more down here.  Nickel and dimed. 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

17 minutes ago, NikLR said:

Nah i pay more down here.  Nickel and dimed. 

Any idea what your ETR was up North, and what it was last year in Colorado?

[NikLR 13,232]

51 minutes ago, Voice of Reason said:

Any idea what your ETR was up North, and what it was last year in Colorado?

My pay is different and I havent worked in Canada since 2013. 

[Voice of Reason 10,298]

Just now, NikLR said:

My pay is different and I havent worked in Canada since 2013. 

Gotcha, thanks.  Not trying to pin you down, but above you said, "I paid less in taxes in Alberta than I do here in Colorado."  How do you know (since you haven't worked in CA since 2013), or does it just feel like more taxes here?