ACLU: Who's botching the executions?

[mawilson 2,133]

Pulling the trigger or throwing the switch would make you a murderer too.

Therefore, by the same rationale, your own life wouldn't be worth your cat's weight in fur.

Obviously our views on capitol punishment differ. I don't consider it to be murder. Let me ask you this, if killing another human is murder then is the cop who kills a criminal murder? Is it murder when a soldier kills another solider? What about civilians killed by collateral damage? What about the homeowner defending himself against an attacker?

Yes, no, yes and yes.

[homesick_american 1]

If it came to it...I'd rather die in 1 second on the Guillotine than be tortured to death for 30+ minutes by some idiot that doesn't have a clue how to administer a lethal injection.

Now...which is more humane...30+ minutes of being tortured to death or 1 second of pain? I'll give you 3 guesses and the first 2 don't count.

Peejay, there is a reason they don't use it anymore. The chances of f*cking it up are much greater than with lethal injection. Read up on some French history sometime, and read up on how they often had to raise the blade and let it fall again...and again...and again...or they simply took out a knife and finished the job. It did not always cleanly sever the head.

[homesick_american 1]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

Not being a medical professional, I can't say for certain, but I would imagine that the head, although technically alive, would be far from conscious. The shock from the decapitation would put you in a state similar to being in a coma. Severed nerve endings may produce facial twitches, perhaps, but no pain.

They say that when they guillotined a particular prominent French lady whose name I can't recall, they slapped her face when they held her head up, and her cheeks flushed with indignation.

[Mags 112]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

oh ick .. i just lost my breakfast.

Oops. Sorry!

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

There is a story about Mary Queen of Scots after her execution, she apparently was mouthing stuff as they held her head aloft. Okay, so this is hardly reputable, but if you look hard enough you will find plenty of info on the fact that some (maybe not all) people do maintain a level of consciousness after having their heads cut off.

[homesick_american 1]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

oh ick .. i just lost my breakfast.

Oops. Sorry!

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

There is a story about Mary Queen of Scots after her execution, she apparently was mouthing stuff as they held her head aloft. Okay, so this is hardly reputable, but if you look hard enough you will find plenty of info on the fact that some (maybe not all) people do maintain a level of consciousness after having their heads cut off.

There's a lot of anecdotal evidence for it from the era of the French revolution, but obviously nobody is going to volunteer to be a subject.

If the guillotine were as humane as some people believe it to be, they might consider using it instead of lethal injection.

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

oh ick .. i just lost my breakfast.

Oops. Sorry!

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

There is a story about Mary Queen of Scots after her execution, she apparently was mouthing stuff as they held her head aloft. Okay, so this is hardly reputable, but if you look hard enough you will find plenty of info on the fact that some (maybe not all) people do maintain a level of consciousness after having their heads cut off.

Hmmm... Got to say I'm not sure how you'd verify that as the person involved wouldn't exactly be in a position to tell you what's going through their mind.

[Mags 112]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

oh ick .. i just lost my breakfast.

Oops. Sorry!

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

There is a story about Mary Queen of Scots after her execution, she apparently was mouthing stuff as they held her head aloft. Okay, so this is hardly reputable, but if you look hard enough you will find plenty of info on the fact that some (maybe not all) people do maintain a level of consciousness after having their heads cut off.

Hmmm... Got to say I'm not sure how you'd verify that as the person involved wouldn't exactly be in a position to tell you what's going through their mind.

I reckon we should have a lip reader present!

[jundp 191]

And how many people on death row were exonerated?

Regardless of that, I think that murder should be punished,yes, but not by murder. That's like saying it's ok to torture a POW because...well, they're the enemy. We supposedly uphold such things as the Geneva Convention treaties or the UN Declaration of Human Rights, yet we think that the death penalty is ok. Hell, even Germany abolished the death penalty in the 40s.

mho....

Well in MHO capitol punishment is not murder. I do not condone torture of POW's but I don't see the connection either.

I do see capital punishment as murder. Any taking of a life....I don't think we should have the right to decide who lives and who dies. I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime. I am not naive enough to believe that every criminal will be rehabilitated or that there aren't those who just don't give a ####### about what they've done (Charles Manson comes to mind), but I don't see how killing them does anything more than perpetuate the cycle of death.....because one is done under "law" and one is not, doesn't mean one is right and beyond judgment.

Call me a tree hugger But I'm also against abortion and I'm a vegetarian. I just can't justify it in my ethical belief system.

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

hitler and nazi germany used this device..cheaper than bullets

Oddly, did you know that the Nazis used the guillotine for more executions that during the entire French Reign of Terror? I just saw something on Sophie and Hans Scholl and the White Rose......I don't just have this information in my head for no reason

[Heracles 417]

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

Edited June 6, 2007 by Infidel

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

[almaty 19]

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

[Trumplestiltskin 5,791]

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

That's what I thought. Don't we elect people to do that?

[almaty 19]

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

I just don't see that a "civilized" nation should use death as a means of punishment. And I also agree with the poster who said that capital punishment isn't punishment. I'd rather see a person who committed a heinous crime have to spend the rest of their lives in prison being reminded daily of his or her crime.

The only problem is that most serial killers or gang bangers do not see anything wrong with their actions. Irrespective of a 5 year or 100 year jail sentence..

One of many problems I have with the ACLU is their passion to protect someone as low as a pedophile's rights yet absolutely refuse to address the cause of issues.. The key lies in prevention rather than punishment. The only way the crime rate will turn around is through the modernization of the laws and attitudes within the country. That is to find a balance between BS rights and low taxes to social responsibility in a civilized society. A society where everyone should not be allowed to do and say as they please without any regard for others..

How is it in the ACLU's mandate to do that?

they are not and that is not their role or mission

That's what I thought. Don't we elect people to do that?

you are correct..

[Ban Hammer 13,335]

If you have your head cut off it stays alive for a couple of minutes. Think about it; how long does the brain take to die after oxygen deprivation...2 minutes.

oh ick .. i just lost my breakfast.

Oops. Sorry!

there was a study done during the french state of terror, where one person who was too be excuted stated, that she/he would blink repeatedly after their head was cut off...and did,.,,

There is a story about Mary Queen of Scots after her execution, she apparently was mouthing stuff as they held her head aloft. Okay, so this is hardly reputable, but if you look hard enough you will find plenty of info on the fact that some (maybe not all) people do maintain a level of consciousness after having their heads cut off.

Hmmm... Got to say I'm not sure how you'd verify that as the person involved wouldn't exactly be in a position to tell you what's going through their mind.

true dat!