Men now avoid women at work – another sign we're being punished for #MeToo

[Randyandyuni 2,682]

I go to work, do my job. I am friendly to everyone, friends with none, by choice. I don't care about your kids, spouse etc. I do not sell stuff at work I do not buy stuff, I do not go out for drinks I do not go to lunch with anyone. 

This works for me, maybe not for everyone but once people realize I am not being an azz to them or treating them different all is cool. I don't need the B's my social life does not need artificial work friends for me to be fulfilled

[Steeleballz 7,550]

4 minutes ago, Randyandyuni said:

I go to work, do my job. I am friendly to everyone, friends with none, by choice. I don't care about your kids, spouse etc. I do not sell stuff at work I do not buy stuff, I do not go out for drinks I do not go to lunch with anyone. 

This works for me, maybe not for everyone but once people realize I am not being an azz to them or treating them different all is cool. I don't need the B's my social life does not need artificial work friends for me to be fulfilled

 

  I would say that's pretty much me too. There's a couple of people I'm closer too and a few I try to avoid if possible. Once in a while, I will I go to lunch just to chat with someone. If I do go to lunch, it's usually with a group because it's a free lunch thing for some reason or other. I concede many people are more social than I am so I understand people may be more engaged in interaction than I am. I am really there to work. There have been times when I have gone 8 hours without really saying a word to anyone. If someone ask's me what's wrong, I would say nothing, it's been a great day. The thing I look forward to most is leaving at the end. 

[laylalex 7,300]

1 minute ago, Steeleballz said:

 

  I would say that's pretty much me too. There's a couple of people I'm closer too and a few I try to avoid if possible. Once in a while, I will I go to lunch just to chat with someone. If I do go to lunch, it's usually with a group because it's a free lunch thing for some reason or other. I concede many people are more social than I am so I understand people may be more engaged in interaction than I am. I am really there to work. There have been times when I have gone 8 hours without really saying a word to anyone. If someone ask's me what's wrong, I would say nothing, it's been a great day. The thing I look forward to most is leaving at the end. 

It's harder when you're in a very small work environment like I am -- just three of us -- but it's also possible if you want it badly enough. My manager and I are best friends and all up in each other's lives, but the other member of staff is happy just to keep her head down and do the work. I figured out pretty quickly after I joined that we weren't going to be BFFs or anything, and I respect her space.

[Boris Farage 353]

21 minutes ago, laylalex said:

I don't think anyone is saying don't blame women who make actually false allegations. What isn't right is to assume that every man who acts in what he asserts is chivalry is actually being completely above board. Sometimes men can misread a situation and "go for it" without getting consent.

But how will we ever know if she is making a false accusation? #metoo has ensured that the woman is always to be believed. Always. ALWAYS. And on the very rare occurrence where we do find out the woman was lying, does the #metoo movement admit fault? No. They go silent, and then on to the next man.

 

21 minutes ago, laylalex said:

And I thought your situation was only about the massage? Did it also happen with drinks?

I have had drinks with this co-worker, but never during working hours.

 

8 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

In your case you gave a coworker a massage and others rightly reported you for doing so.

I'm sorry, we disagree here, and I was there. Nothing untoward occurred.

 

10 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

You admittedly shouldn't have done it, but you cope with it by believing she felt it was consensual behavior, even though it was completely inappropriate for the workplace, likely against workplace rules, and you have no true way of knowing if she actually was okay with it or reported you herself. Because even if she said she did not, you will never know.

I never did admit I shouldn't have done it. I do not believe I shouldn't have done it, and if the circumstances were the same, I would do it again. What I regret is that someone, perhaps through jealousy or sheer pettiness, turned it into something it most definitely was not. And I assure you again, it was not her. I know people, and I know her. I sleep very soundly knowing it was not her.

 

11 minutes ago, yuna628 said:

How about not putting yourself in that situation? You state that women should not do risky behavior, it works both ways. You state any accusations resulting in your behavior will always be false - but we do not know this. You are a poster on the internet, and we only have your say so. For every rape, assault, murder, and molestation that really occurs will have the abuser insisting they didn't do it or have a million lies and justifications for doing it. If you take a drunk woman home, there is no need to enter her home, or even put a blanket on her. You can choose to not take her home, you can choose to gather a bunch of non-drunk reliable persons to be witnesses to take her home, or you can call her a cab - you can even be just concerned about your own self and not worry about her. You can not go out drinking altogether. You have choices to make. Make smart ones.

In this forum, we either choose to believe one another, or we do not. Short of doxing myself, I have no way of presenting my bona fides to you or anyone else here.

 

But you do make a very good point about not putting oneself in a perilous situation. And you are of course right. Logically, and because of the #metoo situation, I should not be the gentleman I am. I should let the drunk female see herself home. I should slam the door in the face of the woman directly behind me. And when meeting with a female co-worker or subordinate, I should insist on a male in the room. I would never blame a man for behaving that way, but as for me that nasty c-word ("chivarly", get your head out of the gutter! 😉) has always driven my behavior, and always will. I'm sure it will bite me one day.

[Randyandyuni 2,682]

Headphones are my friend

[Boris Farage 353]

2 minutes ago, laylalex said:

It's harder when you're in a very small work environment like I am -- just three of us -- but it's also possible if you want it badly enough. My manager and I are best friends and all up in each other's lives, but the other member of staff is happy just to keep her head down and do the work. I figured out pretty quickly after I joined that we weren't going to be BFFs or anything, and I respect her space.

Might I suggest a massage to loosen her up? 😂 (kidding of course!)

[yuna628 9,717]

23 minutes ago, Randyandyuni said:

I go to work, do my job. I am friendly to everyone, friends with none, by choice. I don't care about your kids, spouse etc. I do not sell stuff at work I do not buy stuff, I do not go out for drinks I do not go to lunch with anyone. 

This works for me, maybe not for everyone but once people realize I am not being an azz to them or treating them different all is cool. I don't need the B's my social life does not need artificial work friends for me to be fulfilled

I think that's pretty much like most average people in the workplace today. And it surprisingly works!

[laylalex 7,300]

3 minutes ago, Boris Farage said:

Might I suggest a massage to loosen her up? 😂 (kidding of course!)

Hey, you could always come on by for that massage while we watch my stolen Netflix.

 

KIDDING!!! 

[yuna628 9,717]

6 minutes ago, Boris Farage said:

But how will we ever know if she is making a false accusation? #metoo has ensured that the woman is always to be believed. Always. ALWAYS. And on the very rare occurrence where we do find out the woman was lying, does the #metoo movement admit fault? No. They go silent, and then on to the next man.

 

I have had drinks with this co-worker, but never during working hours.

 

I'm sorry, we disagree here, and I was there. Nothing untoward occurred.

 

I never did admit I shouldn't have done it. I do not believe I shouldn't have done it, and if the circumstances were the same, I would do it again. What I regret is that someone, perhaps through jealousy or sheer pettiness, turned it into something it most definitely was not. And I assure you again, it was not her. I know people, and I know her. I sleep very soundly knowing it was not her.

 

In this forum, we either choose to believe one another, or we do not. Short of doxing myself, I have no way of presenting my bona fides to you or anyone else here.

 

But you do make a very good point about not putting oneself in a perilous situation. And you are of course right. Logically, and because of the #metoo situation, I should not be the gentleman I am. I should let the drunk female see herself home. I should slam the door in the face of the woman directly behind me. And when meeting with a female co-worker or subordinate, I should insist on a male in the room. I would never blame a man for behaving that way, but as for me that nasty c-word ("chivarly", get your head out of the gutter! 😉) has always driven my behavior, and always will. I'm sure it will bite me one day.

Yes, you were there, so you claim. And everything else is a claim too. You claim it happened as it happened. But the reality is we don't know that. We only have it as you see it, and nothing more. I would suggest though making better choices, stop being frightened of women at every corner, stop taking part in inappropriate workplace behavior, and focus on yourself instead of others. And by all means... stop hanging out with the wrong woman crowd.  It's not doing you any good.

[Steeleballz 7,550]

5 minutes ago, laylalex said:

It's harder when you're in a very small work environment like I am -- just three of us -- but it's also possible if you want it badly enough. My manager and I are best friends and all up in each other's lives, but the other member of staff is happy just to keep her head down and do the work. I figured out pretty quickly after I joined that we weren't going to be BFFs or anything, and I respect her space.

 

   I think larger places are the same really. Just more people to figure out. After a while you kind of know just by looking when you can bug someone and when to leave them alone. You learn who you can trust with things and who you can't. 

 

   The one thing I didn't like about smaller work groups is that when 1 person leaves, it really kind of turns everything upside down. 

[laylalex 7,300]

38 minutes ago, Steeleballz said:

 

   I think larger places are the same really. Just more people to figure out. After a while you kind of know just by looking when you can bug someone and when to leave them alone. You learn who you can trust with things and who you can't. 

 

   The one thing I didn't like about smaller work groups is that when 1 person leaves, it really kind of turns everything upside down. 

Yeah, we have issues when something unexpected comes up, like someone has a cold, or needs to pick someone up at the airport, etc. unexpectedly. Then we have a scramble. And I get why my employer has the size staff he does -- two full-time, one not quite full-time (me). I'm the most expendable right now as I'm learning the trade still, so my absences are felt less than when the other two are called away. As I think I posted once before, I'm mostly around to look nice and help customers. 

[Boris Farage 353]

1 hour ago, yuna628 said:

Yes, you were there, so you claim. And everything else is a claim too. You claim it happened as it happened. But the reality is we don't know that. We only have it as you see it, and nothing more.

You have literally described every single person on this forum. 😉

 

1 hour ago, yuna628 said:

And by all means... stop hanging out with the wrong woman crowd.  It's not doing you any good.

I'm not sure I can give up women who aren't good for me. It's my one and only vice. 😉

[laylalex 7,300]

26 minutes ago, Boris Farage said:

I'm not sure I can give up women who aren't good for me. It's my one and only vice. 😉

Yeah, you seem pretty hung up on paying your ex-wife her monthly support. Seems kind of personal the way you talk about her -- you might want to just make the payment and not feel so emotional about it.  

[Randyandyuni 2,682]

10 minutes ago, laylalex said:

Yeah, you seem pretty hung up on paying your ex-wife her monthly support. Seems kind of personal the way you talk about her -- you might want to just make the payment and not feel so emotional about it.  

Bitterness makes it tolerable

[laylalex 7,300]

34 minutes ago, Randyandyuni said:

Bitterness makes it tolerable

I am trying to let go of the bitterness, but it is remarkably hard to shake off. I keep thinking of all the years I wasted trying to make it work.

 

He was the one who took the arguably compromising positions I found myself in through no fault of my own the wrong way, and held it against me. So if my friend had gotten called out back then as possibly having laid a hand on me without any proof, it would have been at the hands of a MAN, not a woman. So yeah, I'm bitter, about this and a thousand other things, but my therapist is trying to encourage me to leave the past behind and move into the present more, even if the future seems far away. God, that sounds so Berkeley I think I might barf.