A Broken Journey

[Michaela_Hassan 1]

I may have been wrong in stating we have a 'muslim' marriage. But since I'm not Jewish or another religion, I can only speak from our experience. I know all marriages go into it for the long haul, I was just stating that in OUR case, it is forever. I wish I could say that IF he did this I would leave, not so sure. So go ahead and pick apart my words, I know what I meant, and according to the many PM's I have gotten from online friends here, they get it too.

It is a damn shame that Jean was strong enough to come here and reach out to the few people that might understand. And for her thread to go bad, really upsets me. But bullies will be bullies.

Not sure who I am quoting but here goes: To have a friend you must BE a friend. Thank you to all my buddies here on VJ.

Jackie

you were not wrong to say you have a muslim marriage nor were you wrong in anything else you said. i find it extremely sad that at a time like this some must bicker and quibble about something trivial rather than unite and give her support and understanding.

I agree, like with anything in life there is more than one solution and the challenge is to find the right solution for yourself. I don't think that when a woman opts to try to work things out with her husband after being abused she loves herself any less than a woman that gets out of the relationship right away. I think that with some professional help things can be turned around in certain cases. I believe the decision on what do to is extremely difficult and will be driven by many factors of the abuseds life. We're not here to judge or pick apart people's attempts to help.

[kerewin21 2]

Please try to remember that this thread is about Jean and Moh. Jean is the one who will decide what is best for her. To be supportive of her, it's best not to argue among ourselves.

Very well put. I wholeheartedly agree.

And I would add that, although it is rare, some couples are able to get past the violence, prevent it from recurring, and go on to maintain a healthy relationship.

Edited May 30, 2007 by kerewin21

[deemabrouk 0]

In abolutely NO WAY am I defending what Muhammad has done or the completely horrendous way in which he has treated you, but I too have noticed a change in my husband since his arrival in the U.S. We lived together in Jordan for several months and everything was wonderful. I was forced to return to the U.S. and wait for his arrival here a year later. A few days after his arrival I noticed him withdrawing into himself and becoming quiet. His smiles disappeared and his words fell nearly silent. He refused to leave the house, he refused to socialize, and although he remained polite with my family he had no desire to see them. Out of what I think is fear, he began to criticize the American culture and way of life....everything from the way we build our houses, to our street laws and other aspects of our lives. He NEVER became physically abusive with me but I knew something was wrong even though he refused to talk to me about it.

It is VERY difficult for these men to come here. Most have never traveled outside the city they were born in much less beyond their country and to a whole new world. It takes a tremendous emotional toll on them and many have trouble dealing with this. They have left everything they have known all their lives, not knowing when they will return - if ever, and it is a huge blow to their egos to come here and live in a woman's house with many of us whom work jobs while they are stuck at home waiting for theor EAD. Many of these guys were prominent members of their community back home and worked respectable jobs and now that they are here they have trouble getting hired at Wal-Mart and are constantly reminded that they are not as good as U.S. Citizen and made to feel sub-human. This is A LOT to handle and many simply snap.

I gotta admit this is a fear of mine.. My husband was never fond of the US.. and always tells me that the only reason he would come here is for me. He thinks by watching american TV he knows the american life... BUT he is really in for a Awakening ..

He is already torn having to Leave my MIL - she is Ill and he's the one EVERY one goes to from the family when there is an issue. *sigh*

[~Jackie~ 30]

Jean, please let us know you are ok and know that we are here for you. As a good friend of mine pointed out to me, my words might have been misconstrued and taken the wrong way.

I fear for you and hope you have the strength and courage to move on and heal. I do not now or ever condone staying in an abusive relationship. No woman deserves to be hit or emotionally or verbally abused. I do know that not everyone leaves the first time or in some cases for 6 years. Please get the help you need and the counseling that will help you.

We all here on vj want the best for you.

Jackie

www.findlisastebic.com she is still missing.

[Ban Hammer 13,445]

Jean, please let us know you are ok and know that we are here for you. As a good friend of mine pointed out to me, my words might have been misconstrued and taken the wrong way.

I fear for you and hope you have the strength and courage to move on and heal. I do not now or ever condone staying in an abusive relationship. No woman deserves to be hit or emotionally or verbally abused. I do know that not everyone leaves the first time or in some cases for 6 years. Please get the help you need and the counseling that will help you.

We all here on vj want the best for you.

Jackie

www.findlisastebic.com she is still missing.

excellent post, but i'd like to add that moh needs some counseling too.

[sarah and hicham 3]

Warranted? No. Acceptable? Not every Dv case ends in an immediate divorce or separation. One can say all they want what they THINK they would do in this situation, but it is definately not that cut and dried. I married Mohammed for eternity. We are a muslim couple and I think if this pertained to us, we would seek counseling together.

Jackie

[sarah and hicham 3]

Jean I hope everything is going ok. I think this subject has really made everyone think about what they would do if they were in that situation.

Personally, I can only hope that if I were ever unfortunate enough to be in that situation that I wouldn't be too weak and desperate to stay with a man who hit me. Of course I can't speak from experience, but as I said I can only hope that I wouldn't stay with someone who physically abused me.

oops.

[~Jackie~ 30]

Sarah you quoted me from yesterday, did you have something to say?

Jackie

[Visa4habibi! 0]

In abolutely NO WAY am I defending what Muhammad has done or the completely horrendous way in which he has treated you, but I too have noticed a change in my husband since his arrival in the U.S. We lived together in Jordan for several months and everything was wonderful. I was forced to return to the U.S. and wait for his arrival here a year later. A few days after his arrival I noticed him withdrawing into himself and becoming quiet. His smiles disappeared and his words fell nearly silent. He refused to leave the house, he refused to socialize, and although he remained polite with my family he had no desire to see them. Out of what I think is fear, he began to criticize the American culture and way of life....everything from the way we build our houses, to our street laws and other aspects of our lives. He NEVER became physically abusive with me but I knew something was wrong even though he refused to talk to me about it.

It is VERY difficult for these men to come here. Most have never traveled outside the city they were born in much less beyond their country and to a whole new world. It takes a tremendous emotional toll on them and many have trouble dealing with this. They have left everything they have known all their lives, not knowing when they will return - if ever, and it is a huge blow to their egos to come here and live in a woman's house with many of us whom work jobs while they are stuck at home waiting for theor EAD. Many of these guys were prominent members of their community back home and worked respectable jobs and now that they are here they have trouble getting hired at Wal-Mart and are constantly reminded that they are not as good as U.S. Citizen and made to feel sub-human. This is A LOT to handle and many simply snap.

Again, this is NO EXCUSE or REASON to EVER EVER hit another human being, much less your wife - the person who has stood by your side and done so much for you. I am already researching counselors and am doing my best to help my husband through this difficult time. I've pushed and finaly goten him to talk to me and we have begun to work it out together but I am still seeking professional assistance. I hope you are able to recover and heal from this terrible ordeal and my thoughts and prayers are with you, but please remember that you are NOT alone.

Sorry girls, i didn't finish reading all of it yet. But I feel like I need to reply to this one! OK, here goes. It's called "cultural shock", it's a term I got in a book when I came over. It's huge and not being able to get a job is huge too - staying at home and all that can get a very happy guy just plain depressed! I know I was, but I had small children and couldn't leave them with anybody for even 5 minutes! But that is still no reason for arguments and fights!

People with both 'cultural shock' and depression need help. cultural shock is just about accepting and understanding and it's good when there' s someone to explain it step by step, plus there's time factor for adjustment.

I don't know how to overcome it, I did it, but it took a while. Having stores and people from the same country around helps too.

Good luck, mandolin.

[Together4ever 1]

I want to mention something here I was told by two experienced, educated and unrelated sources. It is regarding the well-meaning arm-chair quarterbacking that goes on behind the scenes in a situation like this. I am mentioning it in case there is anyone else who is going through this, has gone through this, or god forbid will in the future. One of these individuals was a DV detective and the other a women's crisis councellor. They both stated the exact same thing and that is to stay away from people (who are not educated/experienced councellors) with too much advice, especially anything that indirectly undermines the already damaged self esteem of the person who is trying to make sense of a new reality.

I discussed with both what I have been told. "He will kill you next time." "He's evil." "Dump him." "If you stay with him you will lose your family and friends." Both of these people literally cringed when I said these things. And both stated this is equally damaging.

Yes, some women go back and end up hospitalized or worse. Some women dump and run and some end up in the same types of relationships, some not. Some seek councelling with their abusive partner and actually overcome. There are many varied stories and I have been advised to think this through for myself WITHOUT SELF JUDGEMENTS SUCH AS I AM WEAK OR IT IS MY FAULT regardless of what I decide to do.

I would prefer no more snap judgements be made about me here if possible, although I know they will. I have not taken a stand on what my decision I will make, but it will be my own and it will be the best decision I can make for MYSELF at that time.

Thank you for the support. It is much appreciated.

[~Jackie~ 30]

Alhamdulillah you are getting advice and support from professionals. We love you Jean for your honesty and your strength.

Jackie

[sarah and hicham 3]

Sarah you quoted me from yesterday, did you have something to say?

Jackie

Actually Jackie, I do have something to say to you about the six years you mentioned it takes some women to leave an abusive relationship. I bet that person really regrets those six years and only wishes that they had the support and reality check that most are giving in this thread.

I am really dissapointed in some of the advice that Jean is being given in this thread thus far. I am disgusted that some of you are giving Jean hope that everything will be ok in the future. We all agree that she made the right choice to call the police on Mohammed so what on earth would make someone tell her in the most vulnerable of times that counseling will clear everything up and they can live happily ever after forever? It just confirms that fact that some people will do anything in the name of being in "love" and not having to sleep alone at night.

I sure as hell wouldn't want to be the one who told her everything will be ok when she lands herself in the hospital after she gets beat for the 6th time.

Jean I hope you make the right choice and I hope you listen to your family.

No one condones what Mohammed did however telling her things will work out and they will get back together IS condoning that behavior.

Edited May 31, 2007 by sarah and hicham

[Together4ever 1]

Sarah,

That is YOUR reality. Some couples do work things out. That is also a reality. As far as my own, only I can know it and whats best at this time. What that is, I haven't figured out yet. I know the stats and facts and profiles, etc. But please read again what the councellor said and think about it. I really hate to see this degenerate into yet another vj war.

I appreciate the supportive intentions here. This is just a very difficult thing to face and trust me, you can *think* you know how it feels but until it happens to you, you can never know how hard it really is, and unfortunately life is never quite so black and white.

Again I thank you all. I think I am finished posting here.

[Together4ever 1]

I want to make one final post then I'll just fade into the woodwork. This morning for the first time I put on a lovely short sleeved shirt, exposing the colorful blotches on my arms, and came to work. I drew a smiley face on one of the bruises and realized God has tapped me on the shoulder and given me a wonderful opportunity to recreate myself. It made me smile. Yes, I love my husband. That makes me smile too. It doesn't mean what he did is excusable and I don't know really know if he will be with me again or not. I have today. I have on short sleeves with no regret or shame, I have a smiley face on my left arm and a smile on my face and a hope in my heart and THAT is what will get me through this whether I return to him or send him packing.

You can think I'm crazy, but the American Indians held a belief that the Great Spirit would leave tokens and reminders of things to come, sometimes in the form of an animal appearing unexpectedly, a face in the clouds, a sudden breeze. Yesterday morning I had to leave to work early. I vomitted twice and felt so unbelievably tired. As I was walking to my car, a white feather fell at my feet. I said, "Thank you, God." I went home, slept 6 hours, spent the evening watching tv with my teenaged son and woke up this morning with hope that whatever the future brings, it will be ok.

[Nagishkaw 510]

It was a good sign.