Turbo Tax not letting me file separately (split topic)

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

I am trying to file separately, but it is not letting me file on turbo tax since my spouse does not have an SSN or ITIN. Anyone else having the same issue?

[junkmart 320]

1 minute ago, UnitedStatesGuy said:

I am trying to file separately, but it is not letting me file on turbo tax since my spouse does not have an SSN or ITIN. Anyone else having the same issue?

Since you are filing separately, I've read/heard that you can "cheat" by entering 999-99-9999. Otherwise, you can print the forms, leave spouse SSN/ITIN blank, and mail your return.

 

If you were filing jointly, as I did, you would need to mail the return with W-7 ITIN Application.

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

3 minutes ago, junkmart said:

Since you are filing separately, I've read/heard that you can "cheat" by entering 999-99-9999. Otherwise, you can print the forms, leave spouse SSN/ITIN blank, and mail your return.

 

If you were filing jointly, as I did, you would need to mail the return with W-7 ITIN Application.

It seems like filing jointly is much more complicated... Where did you read about the 999 thing? 

 

Lastly, if she had no income in the US in 2018, does she really need to file a separate return? 

 

Edit: She previously had an SSN from when she used to be an Opair (but it has since expired), would it make sense to just put that in? 

Edited February 5, 2019 by UnitedStatesGuy
Additional Information

[junkmart 320]

5 minutes ago, UnitedStatesGuy said:

It seems like filing jointly is much more complicated... Where did you read about the 999 thing? 

 

 

Lastly, if she had no income in the US in 2018, does she really need to file a separate return? 

I read it in a post on VJ. Not sure if its correct.

 

If you are filing separately, and your wife is a NRA with no US income in 2018, then no she does not need to file a separate return.

Edited February 5, 2019 by junkmart

[junkmart 320]

8 minutes ago, UnitedStatesGuy said:

It seems like filing jointly is much more complicated... Where did you read about the 999 thing? 

 

Lastly, if she had no income in the US in 2018, does she really need to file a separate return? 

 

Edit: She previously had an SSN from when she used to be an Opair (but it has since expired), would it make sense to just put that in? 

I take back what I said. Apparently, your spouse may need a SSN or ITIN, even if you are filing separately. I thought if they were a NRA, that a SSN or ITIN was not required, but I was wrong.

 

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/nonresident-alien-spouse:

If your spouse is a nonresident alien and you file a joint or separate return, your spouse must have either a Social Security Number (SSN) or an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN). ... If your spouse is not eligible to get an SSN, he or she can file Form W-7 with the IRS to apply for an ITIN.

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

2 minutes ago, junkmart said:

I take back what I said. Apparently, your spouse may need a SSN or ITIN, even if you are filing separately. I thought if they were a NRA, that a SSN or ITIN was not required, but I was wrong.

 

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/nonresident-alien-spouse:

If your spouse is a nonresident alien and you file a joint or separate return, your spouse must have either a Social Security Number (SSN) or an Individual Taxpayer Identification Number (ITIN). ... If your spouse is not eligible to get an SSN, he or she can file Form W-7 with the IRS to apply for an ITIN.

Got it, that's what I figured. Is she NRA if she is in the US, going through AOS through ESTA/VWP? I believe she is...

[junkmart 320]

Just now, UnitedStatesGuy said:

Got it, that's what I figured. Is she NRA if she is in the US, going through AOS through ESTA/VWP? I believe she is...

Depends on several factors. See link below.

 

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/determining-alien-tax-status

[geowrian 22,337]

You can print and write in "NRA", then mail that.

 

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1040gi.pdf

"Be sure to enter your spouse’s SSN or ITIN in the space for spouse’s SSN on Form 1040. If your spouse doesn’t have and isn’t required to have an SSN or ITIN, enter “NRA."

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

30 minutes ago, junkmart said:

Depends on several factors. See link below.

 

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/determining-alien-tax-status

Looks like she does not pass the substantial presence test (she's been here over 31 calendar days in 2018). It lists tourist visas as exception days, but no mention of ESTA/VWP she would pass if ESTA/VWP days were exempt. What do I do now? 

[junkmart 320]

3 minutes ago, UnitedStatesGuy said:

Looks like she does not pass the substantial presence test (she's been here over 31 calendar days in 2018). It lists tourist visas as exception days, but no mention of ESTA/VWP she would pass if ESTA/VWP days were exempt. What do I do now? 

Then she is a NRA. The easiest way is probably to file MFS, as you intended to do. You would write NRA for your spouses SSN/ITIN, as mentioned by geowrian. Your spouse would not have to file anything.

 

That being said, you may want to explore the MFJ option I mentioned previously, as this may get you a bigger return. The only way for you to know is to do mock returns.

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

2 minutes ago, junkmart said:

Then she is a NRA. The easiest way is probably to file MFS, as you intended to do. You would write NRA for your spouses SSN/ITIN, as mentioned by geowrian. Your spouse would not have to file anything.

 

That being said, you may want to explore the MFJ option I mentioned previously, as this may get you a bigger return. The only way for you to know is to do mock returns.

I don't see how writing "NRA" in will solve anything. It says the IRS requires a SSN or ITIN no matter what for the spouse right? 

 

I also don't understand how you are saying that she is NRA if she does not meet the test... 

Edited February 5, 2019 by UnitedStatesGuy

[junkmart 320]

3 minutes ago, UnitedStatesGuy said:

I don't see how writing "NRA" in will solve anything. It says the IRS requires a SSN or ITIN no matter what for the spouse right? 

 

I also don't understand how you are saying that she is NRA if she does not meet the test... 

Geowrian answered that question, and provided a link to the IRS source document:

You can print and write in "NRA", then mail that.

 

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1040gi.pdf

"Be sure to enter your spouse’s SSN or ITIN in the space for spouse’s SSN on Form 1040. If your spouse doesn’t have and isn’t required to have an SSN or ITIN, enter “NRA."

 

You said she didn't meet the test to be a RA, therefore she is a NRA.

Edited February 5, 2019 by junkmart

[UnitedStatesGuy 0]

5 minutes ago, junkmart said:

Geowrian answered that question, and provided a link to the IRS source document:

You can print and write in "NRA", then mail that.

 

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i1040gi.pdf

"Be sure to enter your spouse’s SSN or ITIN in the space for spouse’s SSN on Form 1040. If your spouse doesn’t have and isn’t required to have an SSN or ITIN, enter “NRA."

 

You said she didn't meet the test to be a RA, therefore she is a NRA.

Sorry, I meant that shes doesn't meet requirements for NRA, therefore she is RA. I did the math and the return is much bigger if we file jointly. 

[junkmart 320]

Just now, UnitedStatesGuy said:

Sorry, I meant that shes doesn't meet requirements for NRA, therefore she is RA. I did the math and the return is much bigger if we file jointly. 

The substantial presence test is to determine if she is a RA. You said she did not pass the substantial presence test. That means she is a NRA. I think you got it backwards.

 

Since you did the math and saw that the return is larger if filing jointly, then you may go that route. If you do, you need to include a statement with your return that you are choosing to treat your NRA spouse as a RA, and that you are reporting worldwide income.

 

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/resident-aliens

In some cases, aliens can choose to be treated as U.S. resident aliens. For example, if, at the end of the tax year, you are a resident alien and your spouse is a nonresident alien, the two of you can choose to treat the nonresident alien spouse as a U.S. resident alien and file Form 1040 using the filing status married filing jointly.

[geowrian 22,337]

Yes, you can elect to be treated as an RA for the entire tax year as the NRA spouse of a USC. Then you can file as MFJ fine.

 

However, there are 2 issues:

1) Worldwide income must be reported. This can then be mostly to fully excluded via the FEIE and/or FTC.

2) She must have an SSN or ITIN. You cannot write in "NRA" instead. She is not an NRA if you elect to be treated as an RA. She would need to obtain an ITIN, OR wait until she has an SSN (via an EAD), OR you can file MFS now and amend taxes later.

Edited February 5, 2019 by geowrian