Residency without signing I864

[Russ&Caro 1,549]

7 hours ago, milimelo said:

And this is why k visa is a visa from hell. Beneficiary totally dependent on petitioner who may do exactly what you’re doing. 

 

If you won’t sign I-864 she won’t be a legal documented resident. Either let her know you’re destroying her future and pay for her ticket home or get married, file AOS and sign the damn I-864 form! 

If she does marry you she can wait awhile and then sue you for divorce. Good luck.

[ineedadisplayname 499]

1 hour ago, K1visaHopeful said:

🤮

Based on what he said looks like that is the case. We don't know details, so that's why i quoted benefits. It can be cooking, raising the petitioner's children etc....

Honestly I think if you know somebody and want to be with that person you don't have this hesitation. The only thing I would say is legit the prenup he was asking in a different thread back in November....

All the rest for me seems like he wants somebody but not ready to commit and making up rules like I don't file for GC, but you can stay illegally if you want. i don't oppose it.... How you can say that to somebody you deeply care about? So I think he is using her in a sense..

[dnyal 32]

58 minutes ago, Boiler said:

The I 134 is generally considered unenforceable.

 

Irregular? New one to me.

You are right, form I-134 is not legally binding, but that doesn't mean the government won't try to collect their money. Have you not ever heard of the IRS trying to collect money from someone they were not supposed to because of a "technicality"? It usually just takes a tax lawyer to yell at them on the phone and remind them about the rules, but the government will always try, believe me. Specially now with this president.

And hers would be an 'irregular' situation. If they marry but don't adjust her status, she would just be "out" of status. She would not be undocumented because she entered the US legally and should they marry within 90 days, she would have accomplished the purpose of her visa. And she has the potential green card available to her (if they ever decide to adjust status).

[Boiler 45,564]

You would be hard pushed to find an I 864 that had been enforced, never seen an I 134 enforced.

[dnyal 32]

14 minutes ago, Boiler said:

You would be hard pushed to find an I 864 that had been enforced, never seen an I 134 enforced.

If you are right, then OP should not even worry for signing the affidavit in the first place. He should just get a prenup. Maybe he's got money and worries her fiancée might be a gold-digger.

[Calicolom 266]

9 hours ago, PirateLiker said:

My K1 fiance has been in the US for about 2 months. I was very concerned about the open ended/blank check aspect of signing I864 before she arrived, and my misgivings about this haven't changed. I am considering a couple of options.

 

A. Allow her to stay with me without marriage. I realize that in doing so she would become an undocumented resident.

 

B. Marry her but not sign I864. In so doing I realize she would not be able to adjust status, but I believe she would be a documented resident.

 

Am I more or less correct in my understanding of these two paths?

 

I live in an area of the country that is very friendly to undocumented residents. In fact,  a former GF was an undocumented immigrant. She has a job (albeit low wage), driver's license, access to health care etc. Under either scenario, A or B, I am quite certain she would be able to work and have a driver's license.   

 

I am completely aware that she is a person with the ability to make her own choices. If I tell her what I am willing to do, she can choose what is best for her. 

 

Considering reactions to a related post a couple months ago, I am not necessarily expecting very civil comments in this thread. 

I hope she is smart and file WAVA

[aaron2020 11,651]

15 minutes ago, Calicolom said:

I hope she is smart and file WAVA

It's VAWA.  

What would be the basis for VAWA?  Not signing the I-864 is not abuse.  There is nothing about abuse, so why are you bringing the VAWA into this?

[K1visaHopeful 2,820]

2 minutes ago, aaron2020 said:

It's VAWA.  

What would be the basis for VAWA?  Not signing the I-864 is not abuse.  There is nothing about abuse, so why are you bringing the VAWA into this?

If they did marry and he was preventing her from obtaining immigration benefits that is considered abuse. He hasnt disclosed what is actually involved in their relationship but it could only be imagined by what he has stated thus far.

 

"Immigration Control as Abuse

The very reason for VAWA's enactment was the tendency of abusers to use their control over the victim's immigration status as a means of leverage. Abusers may threaten to call the authorities, and tell the immigrant lies about his or her rights in the U.S., such as the right to social services and protection by the police and U.S. courts."

[Hypnos 6,576]

Thought about it for some time before deciding to post. You've received mostly appropriate advice as to the consequences of what you propose.

 

What I will say is this:

 

I lived in the US as an undocumented (out of status) immigrant for a little over a decade. I do not recommend it. Our situation was different in that my wife and I wanted to file for AoS but could not, for reasons that aren't really germane here. The end result was that I had a choice on whether to remain here with her and our children, or return to the UK and face an uncertain future as to when I could see her and them again. It was entirely my choice to remain here; my wife did not coerce me in any way. I had my eyes open going into it.

 

That said, being a non-person in the US is not enjoyable. No ID, no driver's license (back then anyway; these days you can in some immigrant-friendly states like NY and CA), no ability to legally work. Were it not for the fact that you can see your reflection in the mirror, you essentially do not exist. And you go to great pains to ensure that people don't pay any great attention to you, because you don't want them to notice you and start asking questions. So I kept my head down and essentially became afraid of my own shadow.

 

Living in that kind of fear is a singular experience. Is this the day ICE to going to catch up to me? A friend of a friend of a friend says there was an ICE raid at some businesses a couple of towns over this morning, is today the day they will come and get me? There were times where it made me physically ill. And don't even get me started on being able to hold a modicum of self-respect for yourself as that's going on.

 

This is what you would voluntarily subject someone you purport to care for to? From reading your replies I am going to draw the conclusion that you do not love her. Care for her a great deal? Perhaps. But not love. If it were love you would have signed your soul away to be with her and damn the consequences. So, if there is any part of you that does care for her, either get fully on board or let her go. This half-in half-out bullshit is not fair on her or you, but she is the one that's uprooted her life to come here for you. So if you cannot commit to filing for her AoS and letting her begin to have a normal life here (and coming from Ukraine it's going to take some time to adjust to US culture), let her know that it's time for you both to move on (unsure if you're married yet, so divorce may or may not be necessary). There is enough cruelty in this world; you should not aim to add to it.

[geowrian 22,337]

2 hours ago, dnyal said:

You are right, form I-134 is not legally binding, but that doesn't mean the government won't try to collect their money. Have you not ever heard of the IRS trying to collect money from someone they were not supposed to because of a "technicality"? It usually just takes a tax lawyer to yell at them on the phone and remind them about the rules, but the government will always try, believe me. Specially now with this president.

What would be the "technicality" here? An I-134 has not been enforced and USCIS policy is that it is not enforceable.

See https://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/AFM/HTML/AFM/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-12693/0-0-0-13496.html

 

2 hours ago, dnyal said:

If you are right, then OP should not even worry for signing the affidavit in the first place.

Not quite. The I-864 is rarely enforced, but is enforceable. There's a number of cases won VJ where this has happened regarding public benefits with the government, and a number where it has been pursued for 125% income level maintenance as a private civil lawsuit.

Enforcement could change on a dime.

 

Quote

And hers would be an 'irregular' situation. If they marry but don't adjust her status, she would just be "out" of status. She would not be undocumented because she entered the US legally and should they marry within 90 days, she would have accomplished the purpose of her visa. And she has the potential green card available to her (if they ever decide to adjust status).

Undocumented and out of status are synonymous in some views. Others only use undocumented to refer to EWIs. Either way, the result is the same - unlawfully present in the US.

The marriage within 90 days means nothing if there is no AOS that follows. The "purpose of the visa" is only applicable in reference to the ability to qualify for AOS based on K-1 status. It has no meaning in any other context.

Edited January 23, 2019 by geowrian

[EM_Vandaveer 2,408]

10 hours ago, dnyal said:

You are right, form I-134 is not legally binding, but that doesn't mean the government won't try to collect their money. Have you not ever heard of the IRS trying to collect money from someone they were not supposed to because of a "technicality"? It usually just takes a tax lawyer to yell at them on the phone and remind them about the rules, but the government will always try, believe me. Specially now with this president.

And hers would be an 'irregular' situation. If they marry but don't adjust her status, she would just be "out" of status. She would not be undocumented because she entered the US legally and should they marry within 90 days, she would have accomplished the purpose of her visa. And she has the potential green card available to her (if they ever decide to adjust status).

You do realize that the majority of undocumented/illegal aliens arrived on a visa & overstayed, right? She'd be in the exact same situation.

[Going through 5,671]

11 hours ago, dnyal said:

And hers would be an 'irregular' situation. If they marry but don't adjust her status, she would just be "out" of status. She would not be undocumented because she entered the US legally and should they marry within 90 days, she would have accomplished the purpose of her visa. And she has the potential green card available to her (if they ever decide to adjust status).

So many things could fall out from that:

 

-They get married and she never adjusts status.  She cannot legally work, might not be able to even get a drivers' licence depending on where they live, and is subject to deportation at any time.

 

-They get married, she never adjusts status, she begins to accrue illegal overstay.  Yes, overstay is forgiven for spouses of USCs...but only if the AOS is filed.

 

-They get married, she never adjusts status, she cannot ever travel outside of the country because she would have no legal basis on which to reenter as a resident.

 

-Let's say they don't file the AOS for several months, or a year, or never files it (which was one of OP's plans).  She needs to return to her home country for an emergency, family death, or other reason.  She can't get a travel document (AP), because she never filed for the AOS.  She's now accumulated enough illegal overstay to trigger a 3-year ban or a 10-year ban the moment she sets foot outside the US, and is now stuck in the Ukraine----with no home, no job.

Edited January 23, 2019 by Going through

[Sellamalola 222]

21 hours ago, PirateLiker said:

My K1 fiance has been in the US for about 2 months. I was very concerned about the open ended/blank check aspect of signing I864 before she arrived, and my misgivings about this haven't changed. I am considering a couple of options.

 

A. Allow her to stay with me without marriage. I realize that in doing so she would become an undocumented resident.

 

B. Marry her but not sign I864. In so doing I realize she would not be able to adjust status, but I believe she would be a documented resident.

 

Am I more or less correct in my understanding of these two paths?

 

I live in an area of the country that is very friendly to undocumented residents. In fact,  a former GF was an undocumented immigrant. She has a job (albeit low wage), driver's license, access to health care etc. Under either scenario, A or B, I am quite certain she would be able to work and have a driver's license.   

 

I am completely aware that she is a person with the ability to make her own choices. If I tell her what I am willing to do, she can choose what is best for her. 

 

Considering reactions to a related post a couple months ago, I am not necessarily expecting very civil comments in this thread. 

Just send that poor soul back home. You need to get married within 90 days of entry when you come to the US on a K1 and even if she was to stay, she will never be able to adjust status because you must marry the original petitioner of the K1 besides the fact that she’ll probably have issues in the future if she overstays a k1 and doesn’t get married. You already knew the commitment a K1 visa represents, why would you put that person through all of that and mess their existence in this country for? Geez 

[Sellamalola 222]

12 hours ago, K1visaHopeful said:

If they did marry and he was preventing her from obtaining immigration benefits that is considered abuse. He hasnt disclosed what is actually involved in their relationship but it could only be imagined by what he has stated thus far.

 

"Immigration Control as Abuse

The very reason for VAWA's enactment was the tendency of abusers to use their control over the victim's immigration status as a means of leverage. Abusers may threaten to call the authorities, and tell the immigrant lies about his or her rights in the U.S., such as the right to social services and protection by the police and U.S. courts."

The only thing is that they would have to be married in order to file for vawa, other than that, he truly is abusing his power over her.

[Lil bear 4,228]

15 hours ago, PirateLiker said:

Yes that is true, but it does not justify my actions.

You are completely correct on this ... no it doesn’t justify your actions. Time to be an adult and treat this person with respect and honesty.