False claims made by the media about immigration

[GaryC 7]

relax...no one accused you of being racist, but I can see how more dramatic that makes you feel.

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

I see, a sense of right and wrong isn't one a liberal endorses? Sometimes things are black and white. This is one of them.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

relax...no one accused you of being racist, but I can see how more dramatic that makes you feel.

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

I see, a sense of right and wrong isn't one a liberal endorses? Sometimes things are black and white. This is one of them.

Is your sense of right and wrong dependent solely on whether the laws on the books says so?

Sorry for making another reference to Gupt, but I think he gave you an excellent explanation and samples of when the law was not just. Do you agree that sometimes we have laws that are not just?

[Sheriff Uling 3]

Whether it’s propaganda or not, the fact still remains that we have an invasion of undocumented individuals sneaking into the United States illegally and we need to do something about it beyond granted a "get out of jail free card" for breaking our immigration laws. We’re not talking a handful of folk. There are MILLIONS of undocumented individuals. That’s crazy! The only thing that I have seen or read from those who support these undocumented aliens is some type of amnesty program. It's a sad state of affairs. The long arm of the law should extent to those who house, employ, and support illegal immigration who that are not authorize to do so. It's socially, economically, and legally irresponsible. Everyone is overlooking the fact that we do have a formal process for migrating to America that many of us have busted our tails to follow the letter of law. So should they...

It's like someone jumping the gate to your property and deciding to live there. Would you say, "By all means, stay as long as you like!"

Nicely put, although your sugar coating ILLEGAL CRIMINALS as " undocumented immigrants" is BS, they are no more than Criminals, their 1st act on USA soil is that of criminla defiance, they drive illegally, Do not pay taxes, do not pay for health care or othe rpublic benefits they steal from those legally here who need it, they evade taxes, stela , commit other violent crimes, support crime, drug activity and cause Health problems with their clown houses violating Helath Habitability codes.

I agree that those who employ these Criminal scumbags should face full criminal prosecution. And those who are found to be here illegally should be dorted THEM AND THEIR ENTIRE LEECHING FAMILY,

Not singling out latinos or those from southern border, I say round up all those illegal Swedes and Irish men. Give me a break, We know where the problem lies we know once a Fenc eis built that is secure and guarded with Military on our Southern border the Numbers will decline by the Millions.

What politicians fail to recogmnize is these criminals they are trying to accomodate DO not have voting rights let alone any other rights for that matter.

So whne it comes down to it the American Voters will have the final say, it may have to get ugly and come down to feuding riots, but these scum bags who think they can illegal cross into out land , Sh*t on our lawn and not get the ####### kicked out them are wrong. They are nothing more than stray dogs that need to be caged and put back where they came from.

True! It's essentially a low level of domestic terrorism IMO. Those "criminals" should be sent back to their homelands and apply for visas like the rest of us.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Whether it’s propaganda or not, the fact still remains that we have an invasion of undocumented individuals sneaking into the United States illegally and we need to do something about it beyond granted a "get out of jail free card" for breaking our immigration laws. We’re not talking a handful of folk. There are MILLIONS of undocumented individuals. That’s crazy! The only thing that I have seen or read from those who support these undocumented aliens is some type of amnesty program. It's a sad state of affairs. The long arm of the law should extent to those who house, employ, and support illegal immigration who that are not authorize to do so. It's socially, economically, and legally irresponsible. Everyone is overlooking the fact that we do have a formal process for migrating to America that many of us have busted our tails to follow the letter of law. So should they...

It's like someone jumping the gate to your property and deciding to live there. Would you say, "By all means, stay as long as you like!"

Nicely put, although your sugar coating ILLEGAL CRIMINALS as " undocumented immigrants" is BS, they are no more than Criminals, their 1st act on USA soil is that of criminla defiance, they drive illegally, Do not pay taxes, do not pay for health care or othe rpublic benefits they steal from those legally here who need it, they evade taxes, stela , commit other violent crimes, support crime, drug activity and cause Health problems with their clown houses violating Helath Habitability codes.

I agree that those who employ these Criminal scumbags should face full criminal prosecution. And those who are found to be here illegally should be dorted THEM AND THEIR ENTIRE LEECHING FAMILY,

Not singling out latinos or those from southern border, I say round up all those illegal Swedes and Irish men. Give me a break, We know where the problem lies we know once a Fenc eis built that is secure and guarded with Military on our Southern border the Numbers will decline by the Millions.

What politicians fail to recogmnize is these criminals they are trying to accomodate DO not have voting rights let alone any other rights for that matter.

So whne it comes down to it the American Voters will have the final say, it may have to get ugly and come down to feuding riots, but these scum bags who think they can illegal cross into out land , Sh*t on our lawn and not get the ####### kicked out them are wrong. They are nothing more than stray dogs that need to be caged and put back where they came from.

True! It's essentially a low level of domestic terrorism IMO. Those "criminals" should be sent back to their homelands and apply for visas like the rest of us.

Like the rest of us? Weren't we made citizens because of birthright?

[Mirorgate 0]

relax...no one accused you of being racist, but I can see how more dramatic that makes you feel.

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

I see, a sense of right and wrong isn't one a liberal endorses? Sometimes things are black and white. This is one of them.

Is your sense of right and wrong dependent solely on whether the laws on the books says so?

Sorry for making another reference to Gupt, but I think he gave you an excellent explanation and samples of when the law was not just. Do you agree that sometimes we have laws that are not just?

Gupt specifically spoke of slavery laws btw.... and the employment practices that emloyers use are near enough that to be equal. Just because one earns a check, doesnt mean its livable income.

and personally.. I'd just like to see the gov'ment enforce this:

http://www.uscis.gov/propub/ProPubVAP.jsp?...6b29d5461579010

and more than the token ####### thats been tossed out to the media lately.

[keltic 1]

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

no... its not an opinion... its a DEFINITION:

crim·i·nal (kr?m'?-n?l)

adj.

Of, involving, or having the nature of crime: criminal abuse.

Relating to the administration of penal law.

Guilty of crime.

Characteristic of a criminal.

Shameful; disgraceful: a criminal waste of talent.

n. One that has committed or been legally convicted of a crime.

[GaryC 7]

Is your sense of right and wrong dependent solely on whether the laws on the books says so?

Sorry for making another reference to Gupt, but I think he gave you an excellent explanation and samples of when the law was not just. Do you agree that sometimes we have laws that are not just?

Please tell me your just being stubborn for the sake of an argument. You think the fact that we have laws to regulate who comes into the country is wrong???? And you think that breaking those laws is right???? Please tell me your just being argumentitive for the sake of a good argument. I have more respect for you than that.

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

no... its not an opinion... its a DEFINITION:

crim·i·nal (kr?m'?-n?l)

adj.

Of, involving, or having the nature of crime: criminal abuse.

Relating to the administration of penal law.

Guilty of crime.

Characteristic of a criminal.

Shameful; disgraceful: a criminal waste of talent.

n. One that has committed or been legally convicted of a crime.

Oh God! I made your siggy!!!! hehe Shows you how frustrated I am with this whole illegal alien #######. But I still stand by the statement.

[keltic 1]

Do you agree that sometimes we have laws that are not just?

yes, i agree that there are laws that are unjust... but just because i dont agree with them doesnt mean that i can break them and not pay a penalty... i *can*, however, try to change those laws by exercising my right to vote...

if i think laws in another land are unjust, i *can NOT* waltz in and DEMAND that they change them... as a USC i dont have that right

the illegal aliens dont have the right to demand a damned thing from america... we dont OWE them anything anymore than mexico owes me anything... or china owes me anything... or... or... or...

please note that my views on this are consistent even in regards to america forcing their way into another country to control how things are run there

and let me very clear... i believe the laws of having background health and criminal checks are not only very fair, but necessary... they should be enforced... i am not sorry if it is inconvenient or a hassle to the person who desires to come to this country

[keltic 1]

Oh God! I made your siggy!!!! hehe Shows you how frustrated I am with this whole illegal alien #######. But I still stand by the statement.

heh, heh... i couldnt resist... i didnt want it to get lost in etherland!!!!!

honestly, i wasnt sure if i would believe it tomorrow if i couldnt see it!

[one...two...tree 2,762]

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

no... its not an opinion... its a DEFINITION:

crim·i·nal (kr?m'?-n?l)

adj.

Of, involving, or having the nature of crime: criminal abuse.

Relating to the administration of penal law.

Guilty of crime.

Characteristic of a criminal.

Shameful; disgraceful: a criminal waste of talent.

n. One that has committed or been legally convicted of a crime.

If you follow such a literal interpretation then anyone who breaks the law is a criminal (see motorists who speed, run a stop sign) and yet nobody is talking about speeding motorists as ones who thumb their nose at the law - do you see the difference? The implication is that because they have broken a single immigration law, they are of the criminal mindset. Do you believe that?

I'll use another example: O'Reilly is notorious for calling people a 'Liar'. The connotation is that the person is untrustworthy - incapable of ever telling the truth. Clinton was labelled a 'Liar' because he lied about his sexual escapades. Again, it's thinking in absolutes...if one tells a lie, they must be a liar.

[GaryC 7]

Oh God! I made your siggy!!!! hehe Shows you how frustrated I am with this whole illegal alien #######. But I still stand by the statement.

heh, heh... i couldnt resist... i didnt want it to get lost in etherland!!!!!

honestly, i wasnt sure if i would believe it tomorrow if i couldnt see it!

Feel free!

[w¡n9Nµ7 §£@¥€r 123]

Again, it's thinking in absolutes...if one tells a lie, they must be a liar.

Plenty of people, even here on VJ, believe that. It's a shame, sometimes people forget how complex they are themselves and impose a simplistic view of right and wrong on others. Others must be automatons, either when we ourselves are not.

[GaryC 7]

The view that if one breaks a law then they are a criminal or in a similar mindset is an opinion. You're thinking in absolutes which I find odd since you've claimed to be some sort of liberal?

no... its not an opinion... its a DEFINITION:

crim·i·nal (kr?m'?-n?l)

adj.

Of, involving, or having the nature of crime: criminal abuse.

Relating to the administration of penal law.

Guilty of crime.

Characteristic of a criminal.

Shameful; disgraceful: a criminal waste of talent.

n. One that has committed or been legally convicted of a crime.

If you follow such a literal interpretation then anyone who breaks the law is a criminal (see motorists who speed, run a stop sign) and yet nobody is talking about speeding motorists as ones who thumb their nose at the law - do you see the difference? The implication is that because they have broken a single immigration law, they are of the criminal mindset. Do you believe that?

I'll use another example: O'Reilly is notorious for calling people a 'Liar'. The connotation is that the person is untrustworthy - incapable of ever telling the truth. Clinton was labelled a 'Liar' because he lied about his sexual escapades. Again, it's thinking in absolutes...if one tells a lie, they must be a liar.

Yes and yes.

[Sheriff Uling 3]

Whether it’s propaganda or not, the fact still remains that we have an invasion of undocumented individuals sneaking into the United States illegally and we need to do something about it beyond granted a "get out of jail free card" for breaking our immigration laws. We’re not talking a handful of folk. There are MILLIONS of undocumented individuals. That’s crazy! The only thing that I have seen or read from those who support these undocumented aliens is some type of amnesty program. It's a sad state of affairs. The long arm of the law should extent to those who house, employ, and support illegal immigration who that are not authorize to do so. It's socially, economically, and legally irresponsible. Everyone is overlooking the fact that we do have a formal process for migrating to America that many of us have busted our tails to follow the letter of law. So should they...

It's like someone jumping the gate to your property and deciding to live there. Would you say, "By all means, stay as long as you like!"

Nicely put, although your sugar coating ILLEGAL CRIMINALS as " undocumented immigrants" is BS, they are no more than Criminals, their 1st act on USA soil is that of criminla defiance, they drive illegally, Do not pay taxes, do not pay for health care or othe rpublic benefits they steal from those legally here who need it, they evade taxes, stela , commit other violent crimes, support crime, drug activity and cause Health problems with their clown houses violating Helath Habitability codes.

I agree that those who employ these Criminal scumbags should face full criminal prosecution. And those who are found to be here illegally should be dorted THEM AND THEIR ENTIRE LEECHING FAMILY,

Not singling out latinos or those from southern border, I say round up all those illegal Swedes and Irish men. Give me a break, We know where the problem lies we know once a Fenc eis built that is secure and guarded with Military on our Southern border the Numbers will decline by the Millions.

What politicians fail to recogmnize is these criminals they are trying to accomodate DO not have voting rights let alone any other rights for that matter.

So whne it comes down to it the American Voters will have the final say, it may have to get ugly and come down to feuding riots, but these scum bags who think they can illegal cross into out land , Sh*t on our lawn and not get the ####### kicked out them are wrong. They are nothing more than stray dogs that need to be caged and put back where they came from.

True! It's essentially a low level of domestic terrorism IMO. Those "criminals" should be sent back to their homelands and apply for visas like the rest of us.

Like the rest of us? Weren't we made citizens because of birthright?

Yes! I meant, like the rest of us that are involved in the process. Most of these "criminals" will not be able to apply for visas on their own. In fact, if visa-overstays are sometimes denied, then these "criminals" for all intensive purposes should potentially be permanently denied access into the United States.

[one...two...tree 2,762]

Is your sense of right and wrong dependent solely on whether the laws on the books says so?

Sorry for making another reference to Gupt, but I think he gave you an excellent explanation and samples of when the law was not just. Do you agree that sometimes we have laws that are not just?

Please tell me your just being stubborn for the sake of an argument. You think the fact that we have laws to regulate who comes into the country is wrong???? And you think that breaking those laws is right???? Please tell me your just being argumentitive for the sake of a good argument. I have more respect for you than that.

Gary, this is something that you are stuck on, and I'm not sure how else to explain it. Please answer the question: Do you follow what is right and wrong solely on the basis of whether something is legal or not?